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  • Melchizedek, the angel of the Lord

    it is obvious to me that the man who Abraham paid homage to, would had been the same man who visited his tent and prophesied about Isaac and condemn sodom. whom Abraham at that time called Lord. Melchizedek was both priest and king of God and it would seem reasonable that he was also the angel of the Lord that appeared to many of the saints. Hebrew goes onto some detail about who he was and how important he is.

  • #2
    Re: Melchizedek, the angel of the Lord

    Originally posted by nobleseed View Post
    it is obvious to me that the man who Abraham paid homage to, would had been the same man who visited his tent and prophesied about Isaac and condemn sodom. whom Abraham at that time called Lord. Melchizedek was both priest and king of God and it would seem reasonable that he was also the angel of the Lord that appeared to many of the saints. Hebrew goes onto some detail about who he was and how important he is.
    Melchizedek was a man, not an angel.

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    • #3
      Re: Melchizedek, the angel of the Lord

      Originally posted by nobleseed View Post
      it is obvious to me that the man who Abraham paid homage to, would had been the same man who visited his tent and prophesied about Isaac and condemn sodom. whom Abraham at that time called Lord. Melchizedek was both priest and king of God and it would seem reasonable that he was also the angel of the Lord that appeared to many of the saints. Hebrew goes onto some detail about who he was and how important he is.
      No, Melchizedek is not the angel of the Lord. The preincarnate Jesus Christ is the angel of the Lord. At Genesis 18:1 it says, "Now the Lord appeared to him/Abraham by the oaks of Mamre, while he was sitting at the tent door in the heat of the day." At vs2 it says three men were standing there. One of the men was the angel of the Lord, i.e Jesus Christ and the other two men were actual angels who took the form of men.

      Now, I could go and explain in detail why Melchizedek is not the angel of the Lord but I would rather post the following site that explains it all. https://www.christiancourier.com/art...carnate-christ If you have any more questions I am happy to address them.

      IN THE ANGEL OF THE LORD,
      maverick

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      • #4
        Re: Melchizedek, the angel of the Lord

        Originally posted by Trivalee View Post
        Melchizedek was a man, not an angel.
        And the preincarnate Jesus Christ who is the angel of the Lord is God and not an actual angel.

        IN THE ANGEL OF THE LORD,
        maverick

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        • #5
          Re: Melchizedek, the angel of the Lord

          Originally posted by nobleseed View Post
          it is obvious to me that the man who Abraham paid homage to, would had been the same man who visited his tent and prophesied about Isaac and condemn sodom. whom Abraham at that time called Lord. Melchizedek was both priest and king of God and it would seem reasonable that he was also the angel of the Lord that appeared to many of the saints. Hebrew goes onto some detail about who he was and how important he is.
          By Glen Rogers

          I. Jesus, a High Priest Like Melchizedek, 6:20-8:6.

          A. Who was Melchizedek?
          There have been many speculations as to who exactly this Melchizedek was. The speculations range for the possible to the absurd. Here is a list of some of those speculations.

          1. He was the pre-incarnate Christ. This is a popular notion.
          2. He was the Holy Spirit.
          3. He was an angel.
          4. He was Enoch. By the time Abraham meets Melchizedek, Enoch had been gone for more than a thousand years.
          5. He was Shem, the son of Noah.
          6. He was an extra-ordinary emanation of deity.

          The only one of these speculations that bears any kind of merit is that he may have possibly been Shem the son of Noah. This is physically possible for Shem and Abraham are contemporaries. In fact, Shem did not die until after Isaac married. As far as any of the rest of the speculation as to the manner of being Melchizedek was, the Hebrew writer leaves no room for speculation. He was a man.

          B. Melchizedek in not a proper name but a title.
          The ancient kings of pre-Israel Jerusalem were called the Tsedeks. Melchizedek is from Meleck meaning King and Tsedek meaning righteousness. Thus, king of righteousness. He was the King of Salem meaning peace. This Salem would later be called Jerusalem meaning foundation of peace. In Joshua 10:1 we encounter another Tsedel of Salem called Adoni-Tsedek meaning lord of righteousness. The difference between these two men in the deterioration of the worship from the time of Melch-Tsedek to Adoni-Tsedek.
          C. The nature of Melchizedek – He was a man.
          “Now consider how great this man was....” The word man in not represented in the text either by ἄνθρωπος nor ἀνήρ. It is however, provided by the gender of the pronoun οὗτος which is nominative masculine singular for this one. Thus, this man.

          1. The fact that he is a High Priest of God demands that he is of the human race. In 5:1 we learn that every High Priest is taken from among men.
          2. As a man, he had a genealogy. “Whose genealogy was not derived from them (the Levites).” This is in the possessive which says that he had a genealogy but, that it was not traced from the priestly tribe of Levi.

          II. Melchizedek is Both King and Priest, 1-2.
          Melchizedek is only one of many shadows of Christ in the Old Testament. He is the example of how the function of both offices can are fulfilled in one man. The two offices of king and priest are manifestly contrary to one another in as much as the administration of the one stands in stark opposition to the other. As king, he is the administrator of justice to the sinner. As priest, he is the administrator of mercy. Mercy cannot satisfy the demands of justice for the sinner goes unpunished. On the other hand, justice in administered to the sinner, is a complete absence of mercy because the penalty for sin is death. So, how can both offices be effected in one man to render both justice and mercy at the same time?

          A. As King, he renders the sentence of death to the sinner. “The person who sins, will die.” Ezekiel 18:20. Because the demand for justice must be met in order for God's holiness to be satisfied, someone must die for sin. It is God's justice that preserves his holiness so for God to allow sin to go unpunished is a violation of his nature.
          B. As High Priest, he must supply mercy to the sinner for this is the function of the office. The sinner is guilty and it is imperative that the sin be punished but, as Priest, he must pardon the offender and allow him to go unpunished, 4:14-16. How then does he both demand justice and extend mercy to the sinner? Jesus himself pays the penalty for all sin for all time for all men. Calvary is the satisfaction of God to extradite his justice on the sins of humanity. Thus, as High Priest, he is able to pardon those who will appropriate to themselves the blood of atonement, 2Thessalonians 1:8-9.

          III. A High Priest Without Genealogy, 3.

          A. “Without father, mother, or genealogy.” Like Jesus, Melchizedek does not receive his priesthood from a predecessor. In the Levitical system, the high priest was descended only through the line of Aaron. 1Chronicles 6:50-52. But, the office of the high priest was not passed on to Melchizedek by his father, nor did he in turn pass it on to his heir. In other words, his is a one-man-forever-priesthood.
          B. “Having neither beginning of days nor end of life.” In this there are three possibilities.

          1. That this refers to the person of Melchizedek the man. Some argue from this that Melchizedek was not a man but some supernatural being who was neither born of human parents not had a beginning or end of life. But, as the text says, he was a man and as such, he had a past, 6. Some view this with the preceding statement as simply a Hebraism which stresses the obscurity of his genealogy and posterity. Perhaps.
          2. That this refers not to the man himself but to his priesthood. This priesthood is unlike that of the Levitical system. We can look back at Sinai and see where the Levitical priesthood had its beginning of days with the anointing of Aaron and his sons, Exodus 28:1ff. We can then look forward from there to the cross and see where this priesthood saw its end of life. Now, a new and greater covenant is inaugurated in Jesus “according to a the power of an endless life.” But, this may not apply to just the priesthood apart from the man because this is a one-man priesthood and apart from the man there is no priesthood.
          3. That this refers to the man as a high priest. As a man he had a beginning of days and an end of life. As high priest, he has neither but remains a priest continually. This contrasts the priests of the Levitical system whose “beginning of days” began at the age of twenty-five when they began to serve as priests. They reached their “end of life” at the age of fifty when they completed their appointed time of priestly service, Numbers 8:24-25.

          C. “But made like the Son of God.” Here, the order is reversed. In 6:20, Christ is presented as a High Priest after the order of Melchizedek. Now, Melchizedek is said to be a High Priest who was made like the Son of God. Like everything else that is type, Melchizedek is the shadow of the reality. This is like the building of the tabernacle in Exodus 25:40 being built according to the “pattern shown to you on the mountain.” Everything that is shadow must be patterned according to the substance it represents. The substance ALWAYS precedes the type. It must reflect the reality.
          D. He “remains a priest continually.” His priesthood is uninterrupted even by death. He leaves his office to no one else. Although Melchizedek has been dead for many centuries, he is still the central figure in the one-man forever priesthood. Like the Son of God, he carries his priest beyond the grave. His priesthood, in contrast to that of the Levites is not bound by the physical - “not according to the law of fleshly commandment,” 15-16. This fleshly commandment says that the Levitical priest must end his days of service at the age of 50. The High Priest ended his days of service at his death. In contrast, the priesthood of Melchizedek is greater. He continues as the High Priest of his priesthood even though he is dead, 8.

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          • #6
            Re: Melchizedek, the angel of the Lord

            Originally posted by nobleseed View Post
            it is obvious to me that the man who Abraham paid homage to, would had been the same man who visited his tent and prophesied about Isaac and condemn sodom. whom Abraham at that time called Lord. Melchizedek was both priest and king of God and it would seem reasonable that he was also the angel of the Lord that appeared to many of the saints. Hebrew goes onto some detail about who he was and how important he is.
            As tempting as it is to make Melchizedek more special than he is, he was just a man--a very important man in Abraham's time, and a symbol of the future Messiah. But he was just a man. The weird knowledge used of him in Hebrews is strictly designed to show the parallels between Melchizedek and Christ. It was important to show that there was a priesthood higher than the one that emerged from Abraham. It symbolized the eventual priesthood of Christ.

            This was important because as effective as the priesthood of the Law was for the time being, on behalf of Israel, it kept Israel bound to the condemnation of death. It held no hope for eternal life, because despite all of the ceremonies of cleansing, eternal cleansing from sin was not possible through the Law. The priests themselves were imperfect and unclean, and at best, they acted on behalf of God, who put up with their flaws to administer His covenant through them by grace.

            But Melchizedek's priesthood showed that God's priesthood extended beyond Abraham himself, and as such prefigured the coming of Christ, whose priesthood surpassed the sinful priesthood of Moses. Jesus' priesthood was perfect, and as such, extended a righteousness to Israel that could truly cleanse them when they receive it and act on it.

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            • #7
              Re: Melchizedek, the angel of the Lord

              hebrew rules out any possibility of Jesus being an angel and it is ridiculous to think he was running around before he was even born

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              • #8
                Re: Melchizedek, the angel of the Lord

                Originally posted by nobleseed View Post
                hebrew rules out any possibility of Jesus being an angel and it is ridiculous to think he was running around before he was even born
                It does?

                Now the word of God became flesh so then before he was flesh he was spirit.

                We know all angels are spirits. Then the question you need to answer is "are all spirits angels"? Well let me answer.

                God is spirit and we know God was manifested as the ANGEL of the Lord. And consider Angel [of the Lord] can be no other than an angel which is the Lord.

                2 And the angel of the Lord appeared unto him in a flame of fire out of the midst of a bush: and he looked, and, behold, the bush burned with fire, and the bush was not consumed.
                3 And Moses said, I will now turn aside, and see this great sight, why the bush is not burnt.
                4 And when the Lord saw that he turned aside to see, God called unto him out of the midst of the bush, and said, Moses, Moses. And he said, Here am I.

                Now we can go even deeper to show the Son of God and seven spirits.

                6 And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent forth into all the earth.

                Note these seven spirits are PART of he Lamb himself hence could the Lamb actually have mortal parts? The seven spirits [of God] if being OF GOD can really be Godly in character. These seven spirits are actually the seven angels in Revelation. Christ is the eighth head but is of the seven. No wonder Michael the arch angel is like God and is voice is able to raise the dead.....Also Jesus says he is light of the world, light itself is comprised of 7 colors...um.

                I say all this to show that YES all spirits ARE angels thus God and the Son of God are angelic in the sense they are spirit. Now in the hierarchy of the heavens they are not all in equal in authority as mentioned.


                There is no need to be scared to claim Christ can be manifested as an angel. Again angels are merely reference spiritual in nature. But not all angels are created (ie the seven spirits of God).

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                • #9
                  Re: Melchizedek, the angel of the Lord

                  Originally posted by nobleseed View Post
                  hebrew rules out any possibility of Jesus being an angel and it is ridiculous to think he was running around before he was even born
                  Jesus was not running around but certainly existed and moved before physical birth.

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                  • #10
                    Re: Melchizedek, the angel of the Lord

                    Originally posted by nobleseed View Post
                    hebrew rules out any possibility of Jesus being an angel and it is ridiculous to think he was running around before he was even born
                    You are right about Jesus not being an angel.....I mean that in terms of Jesus is not a created being. He is God. This link gives many citations where the Bible speaks of the angel of the Lord. Sometimes it can ONLY be God the Father or the Son because he of authority over things that can only be attributed to God the Father or the Son - such as the power to give life and the authority to forgive sins.

                    Other times, the angel of the Lord does not have this authority. The context is important. CLICK RIGHT HERE

                    Jesus existed before he was born of Mary on this earth. The book of John explains that Jesus was the Creator. He is part of the God-head. So Jesus has always been in existence.
                    sigpic
                    ".....it's your nickel"

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                    • #11
                      Re: Melchizedek, the angel of the Lord

                      Originally posted by jayne View Post
                      You are right about Jesus not being an angel.....I mean that in terms of Jesus is not a created being. He is God
                      .

                      Are all spirits created beings? Are the seven spirits of God created?

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                      • #12
                        Re: Melchizedek, the angel of the Lord

                        Originally posted by ross3421 View Post
                        It does?

                        Now the word of God became flesh so then before he was flesh he was spirit.

                        We know all angels are spirits. Then the question you need to answer is "are all spirits angels"? Well let me answer.

                        God is spirit and we know God was manifested as the ANGEL of the Lord. And consider Angel [of the Lord] can be no other than an angel which is the Lord.

                        2 And the angel of the Lord appeared unto him in a flame of fire out of the midst of a bush: and he looked, and, behold, the bush burned with fire, and the bush was not consumed.
                        3 And Moses said, I will now turn aside, and see this great sight, why the bush is not burnt.
                        4 And when the Lord saw that he turned aside to see, God called unto him out of the midst of the bush, and said, Moses, Moses. And he said, Here am I.

                        Now we can go even deeper to show the Son of God and seven spirits.

                        6 And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent forth into all the earth.

                        Note these seven spirits are PART of he Lamb himself hence could the Lamb actually have mortal parts? The seven spirits [of God] if being OF GOD can really be Godly in character. I see the seven spirits comprise the Holy Spirit. Thus you have the God the father and subject to him is the Son wherein you have the Holy Spirit (7 total spirits) subject to the Son (as the seven spirits are part of the lamb). These seven spirits are actually the seven angels in Revelation. Christ is the eighth head but is of the seven. No wonder Michael the arch angel is like God and is voice is able to raise the dead.....Also Jesus says he is light of the world, light itself is comprised of 7 colors...um.

                        I say all this to show that YES all spirits ARE angels thus God and the Son of God are angelic in the sense they are spirit. Now in the hierarchy of the heavens they are not all in equal in authority as mentioned.


                        There is no need to be scared to claim Christ can be manifested as an angel. Again angels are merely spiritual in nature.
                        In each example where the phrase “The Angel of Jehovah” is used, particularly in the O.T, God is represented as the messenger of Jehovah. The phrase “The Angel of Jehovah” is only used to describe the spokesman of deity. This term is never applied to anyone else in scripture. He is always functioning as the spokesman of the divine triad. In each case, this is deity appearing in human form. In every example, those to whom The Angel of Jehovah appeared always understood, at some point, that he was God and they honored him as such. The Angel of Jehovah will always assume divine authority in each of these Old Testament exemplars. He will always be seen serving as the agent of communication, hence the term “The Angel of Jehovah.” He is NOT angelic in nature but in function. In nature, he is God. In function, he is the messenger in the triadic unity.

                        As to the seven spirits of God - "And from the seven spirits who are before His throne." There is no justification for the capitalization of "spirits". This is not a description of the nature of God.
                        a. This statement cannot be understood apart from 4:5 which reads "And there were seven lamps of fire burning before the throne, which are the seven Spirits of God;" The seven spirits which are the seven lamps of fire that burn before to throne are the seven churches to whom this revelation is sent (verse 20), "As for the mystery of the seven stars which you saw in My right hand, and the seven golden lampstands: the seven stars are the angels of the seven churches, and the seven lampstands are the seven churches."
                        b. Their position is "before" the throne.
                        * The significance of "before the throne" could be for the purpose of judgment, particularly since we will see this judgment of the fidelity of these seven churches weighed in the balances in chapters two and three.
                        * Since this is found in the body of the salutation, "before the throne" could also simply represent the position that the church holds as those who belong to God hence the expression "which are the seven spirits of God;" ('Which are' - ἃ - nominative neuter plural).

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                        • #13
                          Re: Melchizedek, the angel of the Lord

                          Originally posted by nobleseed View Post
                          hebrew rules out any possibility of Jesus being an angel and it is ridiculous to think he was running around before he was even born
                          True enough. It's another thing, though, to deny his preexistence as *Deity.* The Word of God, which shaped Jesus as a man, prexisted the Incarnation. The eternal Word of God could indeed produce human figures that presaged the coming of Christ. Prior to Christ's Coming, the Word of God could've produced angelic or human figures encompassing the personality of God in human form. As such, they would not truly have been "angels," but only "appearances," or transient beings.

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                          • #14
                            Re: Melchizedek, the angel of the Lord

                            Originally posted by ross3421 View Post
                            .

                            Are all spirits created beings? Are the seven spirits of God created?
                            The Bible does not fully explain who or what the seven spirits of God are. You've got a couple of choices.

                            [1] Either they are created beings who serve God.

                            [2] Or they are seven descriptors of the purpose of the Holy Spirit - ergo not beings at all and not created.

                            I'm sure there are other explanations. We can't be dogmatic about it.
                            sigpic
                            ".....it's your nickel"

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                            • #15
                              Re: Melchizedek, the angel of the Lord

                              Originally posted by nobleseed View Post
                              it is obvious to me that the man who Abraham paid homage to, would had been the same man who visited his tent and prophesied about Isaac and condemn sodom. whom Abraham at that time called Lord. Melchizedek was both priest and king of God and it would seem reasonable that he was also the angel of the Lord that appeared to many of the saints. Hebrew goes onto some detail about who he was and how important he is.
                              Melchizedek wasn't/isn't a "man", but a manifestation of God. Like God, He has no descent (father and mother) and lives forever. He is like God the Son (Spirit of life) manifesting on earth as a soul.

                              If He appeared to Abraham as God the Son, He'd be called a king of joy, king of peace and king of righteousness. Also, He would have been a high priest in the order of Christ. He'd grant liberty to sons of God in the world. Abraham would have been replenished while giving a hundredth of all.

                              But, in Melchizedek's own order, likened to but not as God the Son, He manifested on earth as a king of peace, as a king of righteousness and as a priest who lives forever to minister to heirs of salvation and good report.

                              Angels also minster to heirs of salvation, but they are not as priests as Melchizedek was/is.
                              Grace and peace unto you from God the Father and from the Lord Jesus Christ!

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