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Dead in Christ judged at GWT they are standing wicked will not stand in judgement

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  • Dead in Christ judged at GWT they are standing wicked will not stand in judgement

    Psalm 1:5

    Therefore the ungodly shall not stand in the judgement nor in the congregation of the rightoues.

    Rev 20:11/12

    And I saw a great white throne....and I saw the dead small and great stand before God ..

    So these folks must be godly! The next verse we see another group raise up from Hell which are the ungodly. So we have both godly and ungodly at the GWT. First the godly then after the ungodly on the same day not 1000 years apart.

  • #2
    Originally posted by ross3421 View Post
    Psalm 1:5

    Therefore the ungodly shall not stand in the judgement nor in the congregation of the rightoues.

    Rev 20:11/12

    And I saw a great white throne....and I saw the dead small and great stand before God ..

    So these folks must be godly! The next verse we see another group raise up from Hell which are the ungodly. So we have both godly and ungodly at the GWT. First the godly then after the ungodly on the same day not 1000 years apart.
    =================
    A clear indication of why OSAS on earth is ...well....crazy.

    If one is saved on earth the GWTJ....... would mean nothing. It won't work that way.
    A validation that we are...born again.....while here on this earth.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by ross3421 View Post
      Psalm 1:5

      Therefore the ungodly shall not stand in the judgement nor in the congregation of the rightoues.

      Rev 20:11/12

      And I saw a great white throne....and I saw the dead small and great stand before God ..

      So these folks must be godly! The next verse we see another group raise up from Hell which are the ungodly. So we have both godly and ungodly at the GWT. First the godly then after the ungodly on the same day not 1000 years apart.
      The meaning of the grammar of Psalm 1:5 is that the ungodly will not be selected to be judges, nor will they be part of the company of righteous ones. See 1st Corinthians 6:1-5.

      There are no Christians at the White Throne judgement. Those who are the Lord's are resurrected "WHEN HE COMES" (1st Cor.15:23; 1st Thess.4:16-17) - that is, one thousand years BEFORE the White Throne. Added to this, Christians are not judged at a THRONE, but a BEMA (Rom.14:10; 2nd Cor.5:10)

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by ross3421 View Post
        Psalm 1:5

        Therefore the ungodly shall not stand in the judgement nor in the congregation of the rightoues.

        Rev 20:11/12

        And I saw a great white throne....and I saw the dead small and great stand before God ..

        So these folks must be godly! The next verse we see another group raise up from Hell which are the ungodly. So we have both godly and ungodly at the GWT. First the godly then after the ungodly on the same day not 1000 years apart.
        Amen! You are absolutely correct.

        The ones in Rev 20:11/12 are also the ones in Rev 20:4 who are judging the ones in the next group (whose names are not written in the book of life). These are taking part in the 1st resurrection and actively judging the wicked with Christ at the GWT.

        The ones in the other group are those whose names are not written in the book of life, who did not have part in the 1st resurrection, and were not found worthy to judge the wicked. Because they are wicked. Hell does have power over them. These also are the same group, as in Rev 20:5.

        Comment


        • #5
          Neither verse are about body position.
          (sitting, standing, laying, kneeling, etc)

          Standing before God, is a figurative term meant to portray honesty, integrity, innocence, and accountability.

          Only those who belong to Christ, covered in His shed blood of righteousness, will be able to righteously and figuratively stand and survive the Great day of judgment of Almighty God.

          All others, because of their unrepentent sin and shame, will have no grounds for standing.

          The Lord will easily see through their unrepentent sin and say depart, I never knew you.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by ross3421 View Post
            Psalm 1:5

            Therefore the ungodly shall not stand in the judgement nor in the congregation of the rightoues.

            Rev 20:11/12

            And I saw a great white throne....and I saw the dead small and great stand before God ..

            So these folks must be godly! The next verse we see another group raise up from Hell which are the ungodly. So we have both godly and ungodly at the GWT. First the godly then after the ungodly on the same day not 1000 years apart.
            There is a difference between the judgment of the righteous and sinners. The righteous receive their wages, while the sinner is condemned to punishment. Rom 8: 1 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. If you have no sin, you have no judgment.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by angelmike View Post

              There is a difference between the judgment of the righteous and sinners. The righteous receive their wages, while the sinner is condemned to punishment. Rom 8: 1 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. If you have no sin, you have no judgment.
              As with you, I also do not believe the saints will receive judgement at the GWT. I believe the saints are judged by Christ when they are saved and born again. At this point, the only judgement that can be rendered is guilty as charged. We must see ourselves as a sinner before we can be saved. We must plead guilty. And then if we accept Jesus as our savior, then his blood will redeem us from that charge of guilt and will free us from the punishment of hell.

              Jesus's death on the cross and his blood is payment for our guilty sentence. Therefore, being justified by his grace and his mercy, we are set free. But, we will stand at the GWT of Christ when we are resurrected. The saints will stand at this very instance. But we will stand with the Lord. We will play an active role with Jesus in the Judgement of the wicked as they will be resurrected when the sea gives up the dead.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Walls View Post
                The meaning of the grammar of Psalm 1:5 is that the ungodly will not be selected to be judges, nor will they be part of the company of righteous ones. See 1st Corinthians 6:1-5.

                There are no Christians at the White Throne judgement. Those who are the Lord's are resurrected "WHEN HE COMES" (1st Cor.15:23; 1st Thess.4:16-17) - that is, one thousand years BEFORE the White Throne. Added to this, Christians are not judged at a THRONE, but a BEMA (Rom.14:10; 2nd Cor.5:10)
                I agree that no Christian will be judged at the GWTJ.

                Comment


                • #9
                  [QUOTE=Walls;n2706572

                  There are no Christians at the White Throne judgement. Those who are the Lord's are resurrected "WHEN HE COMES" (1st Cor.15:23; 1st Thess.4:16-17) - that is, one thousand years BEFORE the White Throne. Added to this, Christians are not judged at a THRONE, but a BEMA (Rom.14:10; 2nd Cor.5:10)[/QUOTE]

                  Were do the ones standing at the GWT come from? So the judgement seat is different than a throne? These says we all shall before the judgement seat both godly and ungodly. So then how can only the ungodly be judged alone at any judgement

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Trivalee View Post

                    I agree that no Christian will be judged at the GWTJ.
                    I agree as well. "the rest of the dead" are those judged at the second judgment and no dead Christian exist past the first resurrection so that leaves only non-Christian dead that are resurrected and judged at the GWTJ.

                    James 4:10 Humble yourselves in the sight of the Lord, and he shall lift you up.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by ross3421 View Post

                      Were do the ones standing at the GWT come from?
                      They come from dark and evil places like the seas, death and hell. The dead in Christ only come from one place, heaven. That means all at the GWTJ are there because they weren't worthy to be resurrected when the dead in Christ were. They spent their time after death in places other than heaven because they are the ungodly.

                      Rev 20:13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

                      Sea, death and hell and it's interesting that all these places cease to exist in the eternity. Death and hell are cast into the LOF and the seas just cease to exist. The places of the ungodly dead are no longer needed in the eternity.

                      James 4:10 Humble yourselves in the sight of the Lord, and he shall lift you up.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Trivalee View Post

                        I agree that no Christian will be judged at the GWTJ.
                        At Gods righteous judgment we are considered worthy and are glorified....on the day the rest are eternally separated when he comes in a flame of fire.

                        2Thess 1
                        This is a plain indication of God’s righteous judgment so that you will be considered worthy of the kingdom of God, for which indeed you are suffering. 6 For after all it is only just for God to repay with affliction those who afflict you, 7 and to give relief to you who are afflicted and to us as well when the Lord Jesus will be revealed from heaven with His mighty angels in flaming fire, 8 dealing out retribution to those who do not know God and to those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus. 9 These will pay the penalty of eternal destruction, away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power, 10 when He comes to be glorified in His saints on that day, and to be marveled at among all who have believed—for our testimony to you was believed.
                        And those castles made of sand....fall into the sea......eventually

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by jeffweeder View Post

                          At Gods righteous judgment we are considered worthy and are glorified....on the day the rest are eternally separated when he comes in a flame of fire.
                          Do you have scripture for this? I ask because in all mentions of the judgment of Christians there were some judged FAILURES and consigned to chastisement. Romans 14:10 and 2nd Corinthians 5:10 says we are judged ON OUR WORKS. Let's take some examples. In 1st Corinthians Chapter 3 some Christians build with unlawful materials. How will they come out at the judgment? In 1st Corinthians 5 a "brother" is committing incest. How will he fare at the judgment? In 1st Corinthians 7 some will divorce and remarry. In Chapter 11, some take the Lord's Table in vain and are killed. How will it go for these at the judgment? In Galatians, some Christians tried to be perfected by the Law. It says in 5:4 that Christ has become of none effect to them and that they are fallen from grace.


                          2Thess 1
                          This is a plain indication of God’s righteous judgment so that you will be considered worthy of the kingdom of God, for which indeed you are suffering. 6 For after all it is only just for God to repay with affliction those who afflict you, 7 and to give relief to you who are afflicted and to us as well when the Lord Jesus will be revealed from heaven with His mighty angels in flaming fire, 8 dealing out retribution to those who do not know God and to those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus. 9 These will pay the penalty of eternal destruction, away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power, 10 when He comes to be glorified in His saints on that day, and to be marveled at among all who have believed—for our testimony to you was believed
                          The judgement spoken of here is when, "... the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power, 10 when He comes to be glorified in His saints on that day." When is this DAY? It is Matthew 25:31-46. And who is judged? "ALL NATIONS" who survive the Great Tribulation (v.32). That is, THE LIVING of the Nations. When will the DEAD of the Nations we judged? ONE THOUSAND YEARS LATER (Rev.20:5, 7-13). Note the language;

                          5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. ... .
                          ...
                          7 "And when the thousand years are expired,
                          ...

                          11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.
                          12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
                          13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works."


                          The sequence of judgement is as follows:
                          1. Christ was judged on resurrection day when he ascended to His father as the firstfruits of the dead and to present His blood in the Holy of Holies in heaven
                          2. 2,000 years later the Church will be judged in the clouds at the BEMA (not the throne)
                          3. Christ returns to earth in His glory and sets up His THRONE "of glory". From this He judges "ALL Nations" who are still LIVING (Matt.25:31-46)
                          4. Christ reigns for 1,000 years and then causes Hades to give up "the REST of the dead" and judges them at the White THRONE

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Walls View Post

                            Do you have scripture for this?
                            2Thess 1 is enough.

                            At Gods righteous judgment , Jesus will appear in a flame of fire taking eternal vengeance on those who rejected the gospel.

                            He will do this on the day when those all who accepted the gospel are glorified at this appearing.



                            This is a plain indication of God’s righteous judgment so that you will be considered worthy of the kingdom of God, for which indeed you are suffering. 6 For after all it is only just for God to repay with affliction those who afflict you, 7 and to give relief to you who are afflicted and to us as well when the Lord Jesus will be revealed from heaven with His mighty angels in flaming fire, 8 dealing out retribution to those who do not know God and to those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus. 9 These will pay the penalty of eternal destruction, away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power, 10 when He comes to be glorified in His saints on that day, and to be marveled at among all who have believed—for our testimony to you was believed. 1
                            And those castles made of sand....fall into the sea......eventually

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by ross3421 View Post

                              Were do the ones standing at the GWT come from? So the judgement seat is different than a throne? These says we all shall before the judgement seat both godly and ungodly. So then how can only the ungodly be judged alone at any judgement
                              There are three peoples on this earth, Christian, Israelite and Gentile. 1st Corinthians 15:23 says that "those who are His" are raised "at His coming". As both Christian and Israelite "are His", they will be judged at the end of this age. We see the Church judged before the Bema in Romans 14:10 and 2nd Corinthians 5:10. It is a BEMA because Christ is still traveling and has not yet touched down on earth. By the time the Lord returns to earth all Christians have been appointed reward or loss. Then our Lord sets up His "throne of glory" in Jerusalem and having resurrected and gathered ALL Israel, judges them at this throne. The effects of this judgment can be seen in Daniel 12:2. And you will note that it is just after the Great Tribulation (12:1).

                              That leaves the Gentiles, or THE NATIONS. The Nations are divided into two groups - the LIVING and the DEAD. Our Lord Jesus, New Judge on earth, gathers the LIVING for judgement in Matthew 25:31-46. During the Millennium there will generally be long life, but not only will there be death, but at the end of the 1,000 years comes the great slaughter of Magog. It is at this point that Christ raises "the rest of the dead" and they now stand before "the Great White Throne". Since at this point EVERY SINGLE DEAD MAN is raised and judged, the earth is RENEWED (or made pristine - lit. Gk.) and there is no death anymore. To summarize:
                              1. Christ is judged first - on resurrection day. His works, His blood and His Person are fully accepted by God and He is made HEIR of all things with a famous Name to which all will confess and bow the knee
                              2. The Church is judged in the clouds after the Rapture before a "Traveling Throne". The Overcomers will be made co-kings with Christ and be allowed into the Wedding Feast. The slothful will be refused these, and even be chastised
                              3. Israel is then judged at Christ's Throne after being resurrected and gathered (Ezekiel 37, Matt.24:31). The results are in Daniel 12:2
                              4. The LIVING of "ALL NATIONS" will be next at the same Throne as Israel (Israel being one of the Nations - Deut.4:6-7)
                              5. The DEAD of "ALL NATIONS" must wait 1,000 years and then they face "the Great White Throne"
                              Note: Men are always judged when LIVING. They must either be ALIVE like the "sheep and the goats", or have been RESURRECTED. I am aware that some sort of decision is made after death, as the rich man in Luke 16 shows, but this is not the judgment where he must "stand" (in resurrection) before a THRONE.

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