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Thousand Year Reign

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  • the rookie
    replied
    Hey all -

    I am going to ask that we honor the OP and not take the opportunity to debate the legitimacy of his question. To do so is to radically change the topic in a way that is a bit rude, IMO. If you disagree with the substance of the question, feel free to say so here and invite the OP to join you in another thread discussing your angle on the question. But to shift the discussion to a debate on millennial viewpoints is unhelpful.

    Thanks all!

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  • Raybob
    replied
    Originally posted by Revolvr View Post
    But what is the point of binding Satan for 1000 years, then releasing him again (20:3,7) so he can go out and deceive again (20:8), resulting in a second battle where he is finally thrown into the Lake of Fire (20:10)?
    That was the question that made me finally give up the idea of a future temporary (1000 years) reign of Christ. God is a God of order. It is given to us to understand the mysteries of God.

    Eph 3:3-4 How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words, hereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)

    To let one passage of a prophetic book dictate my belief in a future reign after Christ returns was not right. Then I remembered the words of the song, "When we been there 10,000 years, we've only just begun..." When speaking of eternal reign with Christ, 1000 years is just a drop in the bucket!

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  • ananias
    replied
    Originally posted by Revolvr View Post
    But what is the point of binding Satan for 1000 years, then releasing him again (20:3,7) so he can go out and deceive again (20:8), resulting in a second battle where he is finally thrown into the Lake of Fire (20:10)?
    It's not a second battle - it's the final battle. The battle began here:

    "Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?" (Gen.3: 1).

    ananias

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  • ananias
    replied
    Originally posted by Revolvr View Post
    But what is the point of binding Satan for 1000 years, then releasing him again (20:3,7) so he can go out and deceive again (20:8), resulting in a second battle where he is finally thrown into the Lake of Fire (20:10)?
    "If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him." (Jam.1: 5).

    I didn't write about Satan being bound for a thousand years and then being released again for a short time - John wrote it (so I can't say).

    But go read the following link, and then ask yourself whether the period from the fall of Adam (Genesis 3) to "the great white throne judgment" (Rev.20: 11-15) will NOT be a period of 7,000 years:

    http://completeword.blogspot.com/

    ananias

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  • RevLogos
    replied
    But what is the point of binding Satan for 1000 years, then releasing him again (20:3,7) so he can go out and deceive again (20:8), resulting in a second battle where he is finally thrown into the Lake of Fire (20:10)?

    Leave a comment:


  • ananias
    replied
    Originally posted by ananias View Post
    Hi, scourge39.

    Neither did I say anything - let alone anything explicit - about 7 years. The wedding-consummation period has always been seven DAYS - not seven years (Gen.29: 27). I know there are many who believe that the saints will be raptured at the start of a "seven-year tribulation period". But I'm not one of them. I believe neither in a seven-year tribulation period, nor in a seven-year marriage-consummation period.

    But the Bible - both the O.T and the N.T most certainly teaches about the wedding of the Messiah and His bride - in heaven.

    ananias
    Neither the O.T nor the N.T knows the period during which God's WRATH will be poured out upon the world as "the tribulation" or "the great tribulation". The saints are the ones who will go through what the N.T calls "the great tribulation" - and this will be BEFORE the Lord comes in the air to gather His elect on Rosh Hashsanah. The great tribulation will certainly not last for seven years.

    The pattern of sevens in the Bible also suggests that the resurrection and rapture, and God's judgment, will occur in the seventh of the final seven years of the age:

    http://completeword.blogspot.com/

    ananias

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  • ananias
    replied
    Originally posted by scourge39 View Post
    Yes, to meet him in the air. That's where the verse ends. The text says nothing explicit about being taken off the earth and taken to heaven for 7 years.
    Hi, scourge39.

    Neither did I say anything - let alone anything explicit - about 7 years. The wedding-consummation period has always been seven DAYS - not seven years (Gen.29: 27). I know there are many who believe that the saints will be raptured at the start of a "seven-year tribulation period". But I'm not one of them. I believe neither in a seven-year tribulation period, nor in a seven-year marriage-consummation period.

    But the Bible - both the O.T and the N.T most certainly teaches about the wedding of the Messiah and His bride - in heaven.

    ananias

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  • scourge39
    replied
    Originally posted by ananias View Post
    In 1Thes.4: 16-17, we are told that we will meet the Lord IN THE AIR.
    Yes, to meet him in the air. That's where the verse ends. The text says nothing explicit about being taken off the earth and taken to heaven for 7 years.

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  • ananias
    replied
    Hello, lendtay.

    Ten Christians, 15 different opinions on this! (So here's #11 and opinion #16):

    Originally posted by lendtay View Post

    (a) What will happen during the Thousand Year Reign of Christ?

    (b) How do you suppose he will come to earth? From a cloud? Or will he just appear somewhere in the world and announce himself? And how will people react to this? I am guessing that if he is going to reign over the earth, he will overthrow all the other world leaders.
    My answer to (b) first (my opinion):

    In Mat. 24: 29-31, Jesus said He will be seen by every eye in the heavens, and He will send out His angels with the great sound of a trumpet to gather His elect.

    In 1Thes.4: 16-17, we are told that we will meet the Lord IN THE AIR.

    But in Zech.14: 4, we are told that the Lord will set His feet on the Mount of Olives (that's where He ascended to heaven from).

    But also, in Zech.14: 5, we read that when the Messiah sets His feet on the Mount of Olives, that "... the LORD my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.";

    and in Rev.19: 11-21 when Christ comes in judgment of "the beast" and "the false prophet", His armies which come with Him are "clothed in fine linen, white and clean." (Rev 19:14) - this is ONLY said elsewhere of the saints:

    "And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they? And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb." (Rev.7: 13-14).

    So it seems to me that the Lord will FIRST come in the clouds to gather His saints (the resurrection and the rapture spoken of in 1Thes.4: 16-17), and then afterwards He will return WITH His resurrected and "changed" glorified saints to execute judgment, in the day His feet stand on the Mount of Olives.

    This opinion of mine is confirmed by the meaning surrounding the period between Rosh Hashanah and Sukkot (the Feast of Tabernacles), if one understands the meaning of these Biblical "Feasts of the LORD" - for Rosh Hashanah is also the Biblical Day of Trumpets, and it has always been linked to the resurrection and rapture in the Jewish understanding (see also Rev.11: 15).

    Rosh Hashanah is known as the day of God's judgement of the world in the Jewish understanding, and the period from Rosh Hashanah to Yom Kippur (ten days) is known as "the days of awe", and the brith-pangs of the Messiah, which is followed by the days of wrath (from Yom Kippur to Sukkot - four days).

    For seven days from Rosh Hashanah onwards is also the wedding Feast, according to the Jewish tradition - and the baquet is written about in Rev.19: 17-19.

    All the symbolism found in the book of Revelation regarding the second coming of Jesus comes directly from the traditional Jewish understanding of the Feasts of the LORD, and one can learn a great deal from studying these types and shadows of the Messiah which God revealed to Moses on Mount Sinai, and which are contained in the Bible.

    (a) What will happen during the Thousand Year Reign of Christ?

    (1) Satan will have been bound by Christ, so that he will be unable to deceive the nations anymore UNTIL the close of the thousand years (Revelation 20).

    (2) The resurrected and glorified saints will be ruling the world with Christ for a thousand years. They will be ruling the naturally-born survivors of "the Day of the LORD" (Zech.14: 16) and their naturally-born descendants, with the Jewish disciples of Jesus ruling (judging) the twelve trribes of Israel (Mat.19: 28), and the Gentile disciples ruling and judging the nations under Christ's authority (Revelation 20; Rev.2: 26-27).

    There are a number of N.T scriptures re-stating this fact.

    The millenium will be a period of peace in all the world, and every human being will be instructed in the Word of God.

    ananias

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  • scourge39
    replied
    Originally posted by Raybob View Post
    Yes but we can't take a verse or two out of context. II Thes. didn't have chapter numbers so the idea continues into the next chapter.:

    1Th 5:1-4 But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you. (2) For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night. (3) For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape. (4) But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.
    Yes, it's referring to the Day of the Lord, just like the earlier section, NOT a secret, sudden pre-trib rapture. The Day of the Lord is a phrase used throughout the OT to describe Yahweh's future visitation and judgment upon the wicked. Read Malachi, for example, if you doubt me. Destruction will indeed come upon the wicked at that time. It will come as a thief in the night for the wicked because they won't be expecting it. The righteous, on the other hand, are told to eagerly expect it. Therefore, we won't be surprised at all when it happens. The pre-trib view doesn't hold one bit of exegetical water. It clearly reads details that it wants to see into the text that simply aren't there. That's eisegesis, not sound Biblical interpretation. Just because the pre-trib rapture view is the consensus among North American Christians doesn't mean for one minute that it's correct or faithfully and accurately interpreting Scripture.

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  • Raybob
    replied
    Originally posted by scourge39 View Post
    15 We tell you this directly from the Lord: We who are still living when the Lord returns will not meet him ahead of those who have died. 16 For the Lord himself will come down from heaven with a commanding shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trumpet call of God. First, the Christians who have died[b] will rise from their graves. 17 Then, together with them, we who are still alive and remain on the earth will be caught up in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. Then we will be with the Lord forever. (1 Thessalonians 4:15-17, NLT)



    Here's the primary passage on Christ's return...
    Yes but we can't take a verse or two out of context. II Thes. didn't have chapter numbers so the idea continues into the next chapter.:

    1Th 5:1-4 But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you. (2) For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night. (3) For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape. (4) But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.

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  • scourge39
    replied
    15 We tell you this directly from the Lord: We who are still living when the Lord returns will not meet him ahead of those who have died. 16 For the Lord himself will come down from heaven with a commanding shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trumpet call of God. First, the Christians who have died[b] will rise from their graves. 17 Then, together with them, we who are still alive and remain on the earth will be caught up in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. Then we will be with the Lord forever. (1 Thessalonians 4:15-17, NLT)


    Here's the primary passage on Christ's return. I cite the NLT over some other popular translations because it more correctly translates the Greek word parousia as 'returns', which is all too frequently translated as 'coming' in other versions. That word is more accurately rendered 'physical appearance,' 'presence' or 'arrival.' It is used to describe the physical return and ceremonial visits of gods, kings and rulers. We derive the English word, 'apparition' from it. The change in meaning to the more vague 'coming' was brought about by W.E. Vine in his concordance to justify his pre-trib rapture view. One is hard pressed to find it earlier. Strong's concordance does this as well for similar reasons. Paul isn't talking about expecting Christ's return in the passage at all. He's describing exactly what it will be like when Jesus does physically return to earth. Notice that there's nothing in the passage that mentions it will be quiet. God will shout, the voice of the archangel Michael will be heard and a trumpet will be blown for crying out loud! Nothing in the passage says one iota about only Christians being able to hear it as if it were some cosmic dog whistle tuned only to the ears of the righteous. This is not a passage about a secret, supersonic pre-trib rapture (Holy eisegesis, Batman!). It's describing Christ's Second Coming and the final resurrection of the dead at the end of the age. Those who see this as a passage supporting a pre trib-rapture are very ignorant of the letter's overall message. Paul is assuring Thessalonian believers who were afraid that their dead, believing loved ones would not see the final resurrection. He was simply dispeling false teaching that the final resurrection had already taken place. His comment, "we who are still alive and remain on the earth" demonstrates a belief that Christ could have come during his own lifetime. This makes the Dispensational 'looking for signs' to be fulfilled that will allegedly precede his return utter nonsense.

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  • Raybob
    replied
    Originally posted by bennie View Post
    hi ray,

    Eph 6:12For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the powers of this dark world and against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms.


    I dont think we are currently, presently, reighning with Christ. Satan is king of this world, he will be king of this world untill Jesus takes care of him after the thousand years of the saints in heaven.

    bennie
    I know I am reigning with Christ and can bind Satan whenever he comes to tempt me. Yes, Satan roams about like a roaring lion but Christians have victory over Satan. Satan is only bound from deceiving the gentiles (nations) since the cross.
    Raybob

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  • Raybob
    replied
    Originally posted by Love Fountain View Post
    Hello Raybob

    That verse tells you and those who choose to believe as you do that time means nothing to God. If that were accurate, God would have no mention of time throughout His word and He would have no need to be longsuffering which is yet another lesson in time as is the lesson of 1000 years to mankind is merely 1 day to God.
    Actually, God is outside of time. God created time. He knows time means everything to man that He created, that's why He speaks of time to us in His word to us but to Him, He is outside of time. He created us and our world and our time with a first day and a last day and told us about each.

    Raybob

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  • Love Fountain
    replied
    Originally posted by Raybob View Post
    Actually, that verse also tells us the exact opposite, that a thousand years to God is like a day. That only means that time means nothing to God. To us, a day is a day and 1000 years is 1000 years because we are not God.

    2Pe 3:8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

    Hello Raybob

    That verse tells you and those who choose to believe as you do that time means nothing to God. If that were accurate, God would have no mention of time throughout His word and He would have no need to be longsuffering which is yet another lesson in time as is the lesson of 1000 years to mankind is merely 1 day to God.

    2 Peter 3:9

    9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
    KJV



    Originally posted by Raybob View Post
    That same "last day" is the one Jesus told us all the wicked and the 'lukewarm' will be punished on.

    Joh 12:48 He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.

    I thought you said time means nothing to God and now you want to discuss a "last day" which is another reference to time by God? For time to mean nothing to God, He sure refers to time quite a bit throughout the whole Bible.



    Originally posted by Raybob View Post
    Don't forget the plain words of Jesus about the "hour" that He comes.:

    Joh 5:28-29 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, (29) And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

    Raybob

    Yet another reference to time that means nothing to God? Time is kept by a mark, marks mean more to God than nothing, He wants them to wash the marks off of themselves and return to His truth and love in obedience just like is plainly written throughout the whole Bible.

    Here's another famous reference to time showing that it means something to God.


    Matt 24:44-45

    44 Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.

    45 Who then is a faithful and wise servant, whom his lord hath made ruler over his household, to give them meat in due season?
    KJV


    Bless you,
    Love Fountain

    Leave a comment:

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