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Pre-Tribber....what convinces you?

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  • Pre-Tribber....what convinces you?

    I was raised Pre-Trib and remained so for 36 years. I became Post-Trib 3 years because I had listened to a radio show daily where the host was Post-Trib. His arguments for Post-Trib were convincing.

    I did a little research in the scriptures and came to agree with him.

    This, of course, wasn't easy...and has caused me a great, great deal of soul wrenching moments. I miss the old days where I felt like this world, with all of it tough moments would come to an abrupt end and I would meet my sisters, brothers and our Savior in the air. I so looked forward to that day.

    Even now, when I look at some of the stories in the Bible, I question my Post-Trib position.

    For example, Noah and his family's removal prior to the flood.

    Lot and his family's removal prior to the destruction of Sodom.

    Joseph's family being spared hunger by joining Joseph in Egypt.

    Israel not being harmed by the plagues on Egypt (though, I must admit, they were still in Eygpt during this time..however, they did not suffer.)

    I am sure there are other examples that have spoken to the hearts of Pre-Tribbers and have convinced them that our Lord intends to remove us from the ugliness of the Great Tribulation.

    Yet, I do wonder. If we were all raptured away, reasonably, wouldn't everyone that was left automatically know that the Bible was correct...and wouldn't the antichrist have a near-impossible time convincing folks that we weren't taken away by Jesus? Afterall, those that aren't saved and raptured away would still have intelligence enough to see the obvious.

    If you are a Pre-Tribber, something convinced you to be so. I'd love to know what it is.

  • #2
    IMO those who refuse the lord now will find a way to convince themselves that there is still no God. There were those who did not believe when confronted with truth all through the bible.
    I was brought up in the Baptist church so I was taught pre trib believes. I have begun to study and read the word myself and I am not convinced yet that what I believe was wrong.
    1 Thes 5:3 states "While people are saying, peace and safety," destruction will come upon them suddenly as labor pains on a pregnant women, and they will not escape. If we are meant to life through the great tribulation would we really be experiencing peace and safety.(This is but one of many scriptures that I base my believes upon)
    I have many reason why based on scripture but the most compelling reason that I believe as I do is because I have been given peace in my belief. I was challenged about 4 months ago about my belief and after that I became really upset that I would be made to life through the tribulation. The spirit calmed my soul and presented me with confirmation of my beliefs. No matter what your stance is there is no need to fear because that is not the spirit we are given. I think we will be surprised how it all comes down. I believe that God has revealed different things to different people but it will end up being a mixture of different things. Gos is not boxed in my our limited capacity to see. I do not like labels as many are fond of. I simply am a believer and I trust that Gods provision however he see fit will be in our best interest and out of his love for his church.

    Comment


    • #3
      1 Thes 5:3 states "While people are saying, peace and safety," destruction will come upon them suddenly as labor pains on a pregnant women, and they will not escape. If we are meant to life through the great tribulation would we really be experiencing peace and safety.(This is but one of many scriptures that I base my believes upon)

      OK. I had not thought of this verse. You do have a point. I have never viewed any portion of the Great Tribulation as offering anyone the opportunity to feel peace and safety...

      And, by this verse, it would appear that destruction (wrath) immediately follows...and we are to be spared the wrath.

      I know, this is just one of many interpretations. But, it does make me think.

      Thank you for your response.

      Comment


      • #4
        I'm still pre trib. Simply to many things I cannot reconcile otherwise. But thats a pretty long post, if you have a particular question I would be happy to try and answer.


        sigpic

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Saved! View Post
          I miss the old days where I felt like this world, with all of it tough moments would come to an abrupt end and I would meet my sisters, brothers and our Savior in the air. I so looked forward to that day.
          You still can. The only difference is that the events of the last seven years before that moment are more clear to you than they are to Pre-Tribbers.
          Originally posted by Saved! View Post
          Even now, when I look at some of the stories in the Bible, I question my Post-Trib position.

          For example, Noah and his family's removal prior to the flood.

          Lot and his family's removal prior to the destruction of Sodom.

          Joseph's family being spared hunger by joining Joseph in Egypt.

          Israel not being harmed by the plagues on Egypt (though, I must admit, they were still in Eygpt during this time..however, they did not suffer.)

          I am sure there are other examples that have spoken to the hearts of Pre-Tribbers and have convinced them that our Lord intends to remove us from the ugliness of the Great Tribulation.
          This thinking stems from a faulty understanding of Post-Trib. First of all, the Day of the Lord wrath does not begin until after the Sixth Seal and Seventh Trumpet. By the time it begins, the Post-Trib Rapture will have already happened as we seen portrayed in Revelation 14:14-16. So even a Post-Trib Rapture still has believers spared from God’s wrath.

          However, regarding the examples you cited of Noah, Lot, Joseph, and the Egyptian plagues, I would cite as examples where God’s people were not spared, Jeremiah, Daniel (who was carted off as an exile), Moses, Joshua, and Caleb (who were all stuck wandering with the other Hebrews in the desert), and finally an unknown number of Israelis who died in the plague of II Samuel 24:15-17. So there really isn’t a consistent pattern that can be clung to, in spite of what Pre-Tribbers would like to think.
          Originally posted by Saved! View Post
          Yet, I do wonder. If we were all raptured away, reasonably, wouldn't everyone that was left automatically know that the Bible was correct...and wouldn't the antichrist have a near-impossible time convincing folks that we weren't taken away by Jesus? Afterall, those that aren't saved and raptured away would still have intelligence enough to see the obvious.
          A Pre-Tribber would argue that the world will be so lost that they will choose to not see the truth. That actually plays into Paul’s description of God sending the world “the lie” of 2 Thessalonians 2, so this line of reasoning isn’t really useful for disproving Pre-Trib beyond all doubts.
          Originally posted by Saved! View Post
          If you are a Pre-Tribber, something convinced you to be so. I'd love to know what it is.
          In my case, back when I became a Pre-Tribber, it was simply the only thing I had been exposed to.
          Originally posted by jen74 View Post
          IMO those who refuse the lord now will find a way to convince themselves that there is still no God. There were those who did not believe when confronted with truth all through the bible.
          Very true.
          Originally posted by jen74 View Post
          I was brought up in the Baptist church so I was taught pre trib believes. I have begun to study and read the word myself and I am not convinced yet that what I believe was wrong.
          The most important thing is that you form your own conclusion and do not allow other people’s opinions to dictate for you what to believe.
          Originally posted by jen74 View Post
          1 Thes 5:3 states "While people are saying, peace and safety," destruction will come upon them suddenly as labor pains on a pregnant women, and they will not escape.
          What this is referring to is based on a correct understanding of the sequence of events in the Tribulation. At the end of the Tribulation, the world’s believers will be near the point of total defeat as we see described in Revelation 13 and Daniel 7. In addition, the still-surviving Jews will be holed up in Petra/Bosra, southeast of present-day Israel. The Antichrist will have gathered the world’s armies together at Armageddon, as we see in Revelation 16, and they will be preparing to move down to Petra/Bosra to annihilate the remaining Jews. Since the world will be convinced by this point that the various plagues they’ve been enduring (as we see described in Revelation’s first six trumpets) are the fault of the Jews and Christians, they’ll believe that annihilating us all will be the key to ending the plagues and ushering in the peace and safety the Antichrist had been promising since his rise to power. Since they’ll be on the brink of victory at Armageddon, they’ll be anticipating a great triumph, just as baseball fans in Philadelphia are anticipating a World Series championship as I’m typing this. But at the last instant, the sky will rip apart as we see described in Revelation’s Sixth Seal and the Lord will appear. This will be the moment of the Rapture, and the world will realize what they’re really up against – the Day of the Lord. It will come on them as a total surprise, just like a thief in the night. It will be completely unexpected. THAT’S where the “thief in the night” descriptions come from.

          That's also why Paul says in I Thessalonians 5:4, "But you, brothers and sisters, are not in darkness so that this day should surprise you like a thief", because the believers of that time will not be surprised at all by the Lord's appearance - they'll have been expecting it.
          Originally posted by jen74 View Post
          If we are meant to life through the great tribulation would we really be experiencing peace and safety.(This is but one of many scriptures that I base my believes upon)
          Believers living during that time will experience none of the peace and safety. But neither will the unbelievers. The unbelievers will simply think they are about to achieve “peace and safety”, but Jesus will spoil their plans.
          Originally posted by jen74 View Post
          I have many reason why based on scripture but the most compelling reason that I believe as I do is because I have been given peace in my belief. I was challenged about 4 months ago about my belief and after that I became really upset that I would be made to life through the tribulation.
          If God can get you though your present life, why can’t He get you though whatever you would have to endure in the Tribulation?
          Originally posted by jen74 View Post
          The spirit calmed my soul and presented me with confirmation of my beliefs.
          That’s ironic, because He has done the same thing for me regarding the Post-Trib Rapture.
          Originally posted by jen74 View Post
          No matter what your stance is there is no need to fear because that is not the spirit we are given.
          I agree with that completely.
          Originally posted by jen74 View Post
          I think we will be surprised how it all comes down. I believe that God has revealed different things to different people but it will end up being a mixture of different things.
          That is a distinct possibility to a certain extent, but keep in mind that He will still conform to His word 100%. So the Truth is there to be found.
          Originally posted by jen74 View Post
          Gos is not boxed in my our limited capacity to see.
          No, but He does have to conform to what He has said in His own Word. (Note that I am differentiating between what He said in His Word and our various interpretations of it. He is absolutely NOT required to conform to any one person’s interpretation of His Word. Rather it is our responsibility to find the correct interpretation of that Word.)
          Originally posted by jen74 View Post
          I do not like labels as many are fond of. I simply am a believer and I trust that Gods provision however he see fit will be in our best interest and out of his love for his church.
          That’s a good piece of wisdom right there.
          ----------------------------------------------
          When the plain sense of Scripture make sense, seek no other sense.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by quiet dove View Post
            I'm still pre trib. Simply to many things I cannot reconcile otherwise. But thats a pretty long post, if you have a particular question I would be happy to try and answer.
            Literalist-Luke waiting in the wings to pounce........

            ----------------------------------------------
            When the plain sense of Scripture make sense, seek no other sense.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Saved! View Post
              I was raised Pre-Trib and remained so for 36 years. I became Post-Trib 3 years because I had listened to a radio show daily where the host was Post-Trib. His arguments for Post-Trib were convincing.

              I did a little research in the scriptures and came to agree with him.

              This, of course, wasn't easy...and has caused me a great, great deal of soul wrenching moments. I miss the old days where I felt like this world, with all of it tough moments would come to an abrupt end and I would meet my sisters, brothers and our Savior in the air. I so looked forward to that day.

              Even now, when I look at some of the stories in the Bible, I question my Post-Trib position.

              For example, Noah and his family's removal prior to the flood.

              Lot and his family's removal prior to the destruction of Sodom.

              Joseph's family being spared hunger by joining Joseph in Egypt.

              Israel not being harmed by the plagues on Egypt (though, I must admit, they were still in Eygpt during this time..however, they did not suffer.)

              I am sure there are other examples that have spoken to the hearts of Pre-Tribbers and have convinced them that our Lord intends to remove us from the ugliness of the Great Tribulation.

              Yet, I do wonder. If we were all raptured away, reasonably, wouldn't everyone that was left automatically know that the Bible was correct...and wouldn't the antichrist have a near-impossible time convincing folks that we weren't taken away by Jesus? Afterall, those that aren't saved and raptured away would still have intelligence enough to see the obvious.

              If you are a Pre-Tribber, something convinced you to be so. I'd love to know what it is.
              Hi Saved!
              I'd like to address this part of your quote above. (My replies are all in blue. Your statements are in black.) You said, "Even now, when I look at some of the stories in the Bible, I question my Post-Trib position."

              The same examples that you give (quoted below) are the same scriptures that I see as defending the Post trib view!

              "For example, Noah and his family's removal prior to the flood."
              They were KEPT--while everyone around them, every living thing, was DESTROYED.

              "Lot and his family's removal prior to the destruction of Sodom."
              Ah, yes. Sodom was the target of God's wrath, and only Lot and his family survived from that wicked, sinful den of iniquity! Lot and his family, again, were kept, while the wicked were destroyed!

              Joseph's family being spared hunger by joining Joseph in Egypt.
              Again, here we see the hand of God KEEPING THEM!

              Israel not being harmed by the plagues on Egypt (though, I must admit, they were still in Eygpt during this time..however, they did not suffer.)
              Right! They were KEPT by the blood of the lamb! Kept, once again!

              Now, about this that you said:
              "Yet, I do wonder. If we were all raptured away, reasonably, wouldn't everyone that was left automatically know that the Bible was correct...and wouldn't the antichrist have a near-impossible time convincing folks that we weren't taken away by Jesus? Afterall, those that aren't saved and raptured away would still have intelligence enough to see the obvious."

              Consider your own examples. Consider, for just a moment.
              1- In the example of Noah...what DID happen to those LEFT BEHIND?
              I'll tell you. The flood came, and destroyed them all! (Luke 17:26-27)

              2- In the example of Lot...what DID happen to those LEFT BEHIND?
              The same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all. (Luke 17:28-30)

              Show me where in the Bible anything, ANYTHING is said to prove that those left behind just go on with life as usual. No. they don't. Anyone left behind will be utterly destroyed by the wrath of God.

              I promise you that the righteous, those who keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ will again BE KEPT! Those NOT kept will once again, once and for all time, be destroyed. At his coming. At the brightness of his coming!

              Luke 17:24
              24 For as the lightning, that lighteneth out of the one part under heaven, shineth unto the other part under heaven; so shall also the Son of man be in his day.

              Luke 17:30
              30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.


              My favorite scripture: Malachi 3:16

              "Then they that feared the LORD spake often one to another: and the LORD hearkened, and heard it, and a book of remembrance was written before him for them that feared the LORD, and that thought upon his name!" (Every time we speak of the Lord, or even THINK of him--its written down in a book of remembrance!)

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Diggindeeper View Post
                Hi Saved!
                I'd like to address this part of your quote above. (My replies are all in blue. Your statements are in black.) You said, "Even now, when I look at some of the stories in the Bible, I question my Post-Trib position."

                The same examples that you give (quoted below) are the same scriptures that I see as defending the Post trib view!

                "For example, Noah and his family's removal prior to the flood."
                They were KEPT--while everyone around them, every living thing, was DESTROYED.

                "Lot and his family's removal prior to the destruction of Sodom."
                Ah, yes. Sodom was the target of God's wrath, and only Lot and his family survived from that wicked, sinful den of iniquity! Lot and his family, again, were kept, while the wicked were destroyed!

                Joseph's family being spared hunger by joining Joseph in Egypt.
                Again, here we see the hand of God KEEPING THEM!

                Israel not being harmed by the plagues on Egypt (though, I must admit, they were still in Eygpt during this time..however, they did not suffer.)
                Right! They were KEPT by the blood of the lamb! Kept, once again!

                Now, about this that you said:
                "Yet, I do wonder. If we were all raptured away, reasonably, wouldn't everyone that was left automatically know that the Bible was correct...and wouldn't the antichrist have a near-impossible time convincing folks that we weren't taken away by Jesus? Afterall, those that aren't saved and raptured away would still have intelligence enough to see the obvious."

                Consider your own examples. Consider, for just a moment.
                1- In the example of Noah...what DID happen to those LEFT BEHIND?
                I'll tell you. The flood came, and destroyed them all! (Luke 17:26-27)

                2- In the example of Lot...what DID happen to those LEFT BEHIND?
                The same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all. (Luke 17:28-30)

                Show me where in the Bible anything, ANYTHING is said to prove that those left behind just go on with life as usual. No. they don't. Anyone left behind will be utterly destroyed by the wrath of God.

                I promise you that the righteous, those who keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ will again BE KEPT! Those NOT kept will once again, once and for all time, be destroyed. At his coming. At the brightness of his coming!

                Luke 17:24
                24 For as the lightning, that lighteneth out of the one part under heaven, shineth unto the other part under heaven; so shall also the Son of man be in his day.

                Luke 17:30
                30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.

                Excellent points, well done.
                ----------------------------------------------
                When the plain sense of Scripture make sense, seek no other sense.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Phew...hope less confusion happens here...
                  Shinjitsu wa itsumo hitotsu
                  2 Timothy 3:16 Jehovah Jireh Matthew 6:33

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I am curious why anyone one person would think that they had it figured out and why it would be important for them to have others know their opinions and believe the same way(in regards to End times). I have heard it said that some things are spine issues and others are rib issues. End times events and order are rib issues(meaning know ones knows for sure). It is not important to me that anyone believes as I do(about end times events). The main point is that everyone only has an opinion and yet it is made to seem as truth. You can study the word of God one day and get one thing and the very next day read the same scripture and receive another truth. Does it line up with Gods character? That is what I ask myself as I study the word. Just because someone has an opinion does not then make it truth. It is hard for me to understand why others would expect me to believe there way simply because it is there truth.
                    God is a personal God and I believe that he will provide me with the truth he would have ME to see.
                    I guess I am just trying to understand why it is so important that we all believe the same thing here(in regards to end time events). I am deep into the word and have a personal relationship with my savior. He is the only one that will convince me of truth.
                    If I must live through the tribulation, then God will provide for me as he sees fit(not meaning that I do nothing but I am out loving on the saved and unsaved). It seems that many folks believe that we who might believe something different are not going to be aware of what is happening and be caught of guard. No matter how it plays out, if you are in the word and are studying then God will reveal what needs to be revealed at the time you need it. I do not have to prepare for the worst, I have a savior who has prepared a way for me.
                    Last edited by jen74; Oct 28th 2008, 04:08 PM.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Saved! View Post
                      1 Thes 5:3 states "While people are saying, peace and safety," destruction will come upon them suddenly as labor pains on a pregnant women, and they will not escape. If we are meant to life through the great tribulation would we really be experiencing peace and safety.(This is but one of many scriptures that I base my believes upon)

                      OK. I had not thought of this verse. You do have a point. I have never viewed any portion of the Great Tribulation as offering anyone the opportunity to feel peace and safety...

                      And, by this verse, it would appear that destruction (wrath) immediately follows...and we are to be spared the wrath.

                      I know, this is just one of many interpretations. But, it does make me think.

                      Thank you for your response.

                      This doesn't answer your question completely, but needs to be pointed out for comprehensions sake. The tribulation does NOT last 7 years. The reign of the Antichrist is 7 years but the first 3.5 is peace and prosperity...

                      Further this verse speaks to the general public not Christians per-se. Thus, in the tribulation that the Antichrist presses against Christians those with the mark are happily eating, buying selling and saying "Peace and safety from the Antichrist oh yeah!" SO that is what is meant when they say peace and safety and then the judgement of God comes down.
                      Dragonfighter1
                      Vivo est Ministro

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I find this interesting that at the top it say PRE TRIBULATION not POST yet all the post tribs must find there way in to explain the text. Is there a reason that post tribs must have there view point recognized?
                        Remember that you do not have it all figured out and if you think you do I bet you will be surprised. Just my opinion.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by jen74 View Post
                          I am curious why anyone one person would think that they had it figured out and why it would be important for them to have others know their opinions and believe the same way. I have heard it said that some things are spine issues and others are rib issues. End times events and order are rib issues. It is not important to me that anyone believes as I do. The main point is that everyone only has an opinion and yet it is made to seem as truth. You can study the word of God one day and get one thing and the very next day read the same scripture and receive another truth. Does it line up with Gods character? That is what I ask myself as I study the word. Just because someone has an opinion does not then make it truth. It is hard for me to understand why others would expect me to believe there way simply because it is there truth.
                          God is a personal God and I believe that he will provide me with the truth he would have ME to see.
                          I guess I am just trying to understand why it is so important that we all believe the same thing here(in regards to end time events). I am deep into the word and have a personal relationship with my savior. He is the only one that will convince me of truth.
                          If I must live through the tribulation, then God will provide for me as he sees fit. It seems that many folks believe that we who might believe something different are not going to be aware of what is happening and be caught of guard. No matter how it plays out, if you are in the word and are studying then God will reveal what needs to be revealed at the time you need it. I do not have to prepare for the worst, I have a savior who has prepared a way for me.
                          First, I am ASTOUNDED that your opening line says what it says. Absolutely astounded. Please reconsider it. The implications are astonishing to the utmost.

                          Second: you said:"End times events and order are rib issues. It is not important to me that anyone believes as I do." Another astonishing statement. Do you not believe in witnessing the truth of Christ to others? so that those who hold a wacky faith be corrected? so that they may be saved? so that if you are wrong on a particular issue (We all are wrong somewhere) they may be able to sharpen you, iron against iron?
                          Why are you even on these boards if what you said is truly what you believe? You can't believe it because you are here, therefore I must believe you are frustrated by the dialog... this is good. It means either you want to learn and find it hard to, or you dont want to learn and the spirit is urging you.... dont stop now friend keep pushing through!

                          You said:"I guess I am just trying to understand why it is so important that we all believe the same thing here(in regards to end time events)." I dont think anyone is trying to convince you to hold a position you don't understand or agree with. I do think it VERY important that we sharpen one another. Lazy thinking may be comfortable, but it is also inaccurate and leads to trouble. Avoiding spiritual trouble is the purpose of these boards. By discussion and discourse we all move towards truth. We may individually take different paths as we move but ultimately we all want to be more accurate in our thinking.

                          You said: "If I must live through the tribulation, then God will provide for me as he sees fit." Hmm, May I politely suggest that such a philosophy is dangerous. (If you intend to sit down on a log and see what happens). God has always instructed us to be busy, to work, to think, to strive honestly for each other and our selves. If we are to go through the trib, then we might want to consider the holocaust, those who said, "God will provide" ended up in concentration camps and etc... Other said "No, God has given me feet, hands and a mind", some of them still died but many who took to their wits as God had granted to them, took to the hills and avoided the desperate times.

                          I urge you Jen not to be frustrated by these boards but to tough it out till you have hundreds more threads to your account, as you spend time in here you will understand more of what we are about and I promise, you will be a much smarter christian than if you never came among us.

                          God bless
                          DF1
                          Dragonfighter1
                          Vivo est Ministro

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Saved! View Post
                            I was raised Pre-Trib and remained so for 36 years. I became Post-Trib 3 years because I had listened to a radio show daily where the host was Post-Trib. His arguments for Post-Trib were convincing.

                            I did a little research in the scriptures and came to agree with him.

                            This, of course, wasn't easy...and has caused me a great, great deal of soul wrenching moments. I miss the old days where I felt like this world, with all of it tough moments would come to an abrupt end and I would meet my sisters, brothers and our Savior in the air. I so looked forward to that day.

                            Even now, when I look at some of the stories in the Bible, I question my Post-Trib position.

                            For example, Noah and his family's removal prior to the flood.

                            Lot and his family's removal prior to the destruction of Sodom.

                            Joseph's family being spared hunger by joining Joseph in Egypt.

                            Israel not being harmed by the plagues on Egypt (though, I must admit, they were still in Eygpt during this time..however, they did not suffer.)

                            I am sure there are other examples that have spoken to the hearts of Pre-Tribbers and have convinced them that our Lord intends to remove us from the ugliness of the Great Tribulation.

                            Yet, I do wonder. If we were all raptured away, reasonably, wouldn't everyone that was left automatically know that the Bible was correct...and wouldn't the antichrist have a near-impossible time convincing folks that we weren't taken away by Jesus? Afterall, those that aren't saved and raptured away would still have intelligence enough to see the obvious.

                            If you are a Pre-Tribber, something convinced you to be so. I'd love to know what it is.

                            we are not meant for God's wrath. There are many verses that state this, if you want me to, I can list them.
                            as for your last question, the answer is no, they wouldn't. God has already given evidence of His existence, His omnipotence, His omnicence, his omnipresence, etc, and look how many people still deny Him. There is also that big lie to contend with, whatever it may be. Their eyes are blinded by the devil. Look at all the people that actually knew Jesus. They saw Him, touched Him, walked with Him, yet still denied Him. If that doesn't convince every human, nothing is going to. I would have to say the number one reason I stay pre trib is because I trust God and the promises He made. He said that we were not meant for wrath, and I believe Him. If being deceived and damning our soul to hell isn't wrath, I don't know what is. If going through the tribulation, which is for Israel and those who denied God isn't wrath, I don't know what is.
                            You know, Jesus died on the cross for us. He suffered the wrath of almighty God because no human ever could. To me and the way I understand it, if we are left here to go through the trib, it is us trying to save ourselves by some kind of suffering....but when is it enough? The answer is, there is nothing we can do to save ourselves. Jesus has already completed that work. he has not judged the ungodly of this age yet, though, and I believe that is what the tribulation is. His judgement on the ungodly of this age who have denied Him. There is not one verse of scripture that tells me I am going to go through the great tribulation, but many to refute that idea. God Bless.
                            Psalm 118:8 - "It is better to trust in the Lord than to put confidence in man."

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              This doesn't answer your question completely, but needs to be pointed out for comprehensions sake. The tribulation does NOT last 7 years. The reign of the Antichrist is 7 years but the first 3.5 is peace and prosperity...
                              False peace. Let's always try to remember that. As I have stated recently in a couple of posts, wouldn't being deceived and your soul damned to hell...be wrath? The first three and a half years of the tribulation will be just as much wrath, just in a different way.
                              Psalm 118:8 - "It is better to trust in the Lord than to put confidence in man."

                              Comment

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