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  • #76
    Re: Israel Palestine Peace Plan

    Isaiah 58:1-2 Shout aloud without restraint, declare to My people, Israel, their sins. They seek guidance of Me day after day and say they delight in knowing My ways, as if they were a nation which had acted rightly and had not abandoned the just Laws of their God. The Jewish State of Israel.

    Isaiah 58:3-5 Why should we fast and work hard for God, when He seems to pay no heed? In fact you just serve your own interests on your holy day, keeping your workers employed. Your observance of a holy day leads only to trouble and strife, on such a day your ‘fasting’ [secular activities] means that you cannot expect your voice to be heard in heaven. Is that what you call a ‘fast day’, holy to the Lord? Just a day for a man to humble himself, bowing his head like a bulrush and repenting in sorrow.
    The situation of many Christian Church’s today.

    Isaiah 58:6-7 This is the kind of ‘fast day’ that I require; to loose the chains of injustice, to set the oppressed free and break every yoke. To share your food with the hungry and to provide the homeless with shelter. When you see those without garments, to clothe them and to never evade your duty to your kinfolk.

    Isaiah 58:8-9 Then your light will break forth like the dawn, your healing will appear, your righteousness will go before you and the glory of the Lord will follow you. Then you will call and the Lord will answer, you will cry for help and He will say; Here I am!

    Isaiah 58:13-14 If you keep your Sabbath day holy by not doing as you please, making the Lords day worthy of honour and do not attend to your own affairs, then you will find joy in the Lord. He will give you dominion over the Land, the holding of your father, Jacob will be yours to enjoy.

    Isaiah 58:11-12 The Lord will guide you always. He will satisfy your needs in the sun scorched Land and give you strength. You will be like a well watered garden, like an unfailing spring. Your people will rebuild the ancient ruins and build upon ancient foundations. You will be called the restorers of houses and towns.

    Psalms 125:1-5 Those who trust in the Lord are like Mount Zion; it cannot be shaken, it stands forever. As the mountains surround Jerusalem, so the Lord surrounds His people, for now and evermore. Surely wicked rulers will not continue to control the Land allotted to the righteous, or the righteous may put their hand to injustice. Do good, Lord to Your people, to those who are upright in heart, but those who turn aside into crooked ways, let them suffer the penalty of evildoers
    PEACE BE UPON ISRAEL.
    Reference: REB. some verses abridged.

    ‘Surely wicked rulers will not continue to control the Land’ – the apostate, atheistic and false religion peoples who currently occupy most that area originally promised to Abraham, will not stay much longer. The soon to happen, Lord’s Day of vengeance and wrath, will ‘sun scorch’ the entire Middle East, allowing His faithful Christian people to ‘have dominion over the Land’, and they will ‘rebuild the ancient ruins’.
    Then, there will be truly; Peace upon the holy land of Israel.

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    • #77
      Re: Israel Palestine Peace Plan

      Originally Posted by Keraz
      U.S. President Donald Trump has announced that he will unveil a settlement between Israel and the Palestinians, on September 25th, during a session of the United Nations. This Plan will be non-negotiable and enforced onto them by the threat of the withdrawal of financial support and a possible army presence.



      non-negotiable and enforced into them?!! I don't think Israel is going to be forced to do anything. The crisis in that area is very complicated and peace is very difficult to achieve but we hope for that.


      Dafont Showbox Adam4adam
      Last edited by Alicia28; Jun 22nd 2019, 09:05 PM.

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      • #78
        Re: Israel Palestine Peace Plan

        Originally posted by Alicia28 View Post
        non-negotiable and enforced into them?!! I don't think Israel is going to be forced to do anything. The crisis in that area is very complicated and peace is very difficult to achieve but we hope for that.
        Thanks, Alicia; we all hope and pray for peace.
        However if the Bible prophesies are to be believed and I think they are, or where are we? Then; there is coming a dramatic change to the world, something that will solve the ME problem once and for all and will lead up to the glorious Return of Jesus for His Millennium reign.

        I see this peace agreement as the thing that will induce people to say: Peace and safety..... 1 Thessalonians 3:3..... read what happens next yourself.

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        • #79
          Re: Israel Palestine Peace Plan

          I think it's premature to affix "prophetic meaning" to a variety of Middle East proposals. This went on throughout the last century, and what do we have today, particularly since 1948? We have a lot of ideas that bore little fruit, in terms of bringing final peace to the region. Withdrawal or hesitancy in dealing with false partners for "peace" has been proven to encourage terror groups like Al Qaeda and ISIS. What did giving up Gaza to the Palestinians accomplish?--uncompromising Hamas leadership. Hezbollah's unrelenting attack on N. Israel has led to the US's acceptance of Israel's annexation of the Golan Heights.

          I agree with Trump making positive moves towards Israel, which is democratic, as opposed to Islamic fundamentalism, which has become very intolerant. Who has defied Russia, or moved Russia out of the UN assembly for annexing part of Ukraine? They have rightfully been punished, economically. But aggressive moves are not always the end of the world. Sometimes the right kind of bold steps can actually establish realities on the ground that better bring a proper resolution to the problem.

          The fact is, the Jewish People are an established ethnicity that deserves to have defensible borders and a territory that upholds a sufficient economy to meet their needs. All the scrambling for property will not change this reality, that food and water are needed, along with defensible borders. The economy depends on a whole host of factors, and property claims that threaten things like commerce will not work.

          If we talk about prophecy, we will have to go back to what Jesus said. The Jewish People will suffer "great tribulation" until the "times of the Gentiles are over." That means that Israel will continue to suffer the birth pangs of national restoration until Jesus comes.

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          • #80
            Re: Israel Palestine Peace Plan

            I don't believe that there will be a peace treaty between Israel and some political figure deemed to be (in a future or [future, to today] present) role as THE Antichrist. The mistake that people make is to equate The Antichrist with the Man of Sin [who WILL sit in the temple shewing himself to be god]. Many will expect, and some will even prophesy that this antichrist [not the Man of Sin] will "seat" himself in the temple. And because expectations of "this man" to sit in the temple will NEVER happen, the DOTL will come with sudden destruction like a thief in the night upon the whole world.

            Who is this man that WILL bring destruction unto the whole world, but DOES NOT sit in the temple? He will be a/the(?) prominent role player in the "league" that is made with a coalition of nations, FOR the sake of peace in the middle east. Yes, Israel will be a prime supporter of this "treaty of pace". But it will not be a treaty that "he" makes with Israel. What do I mean? A coalition of nations will form as a means to counteract the soon to be manifest aggression of the Iranians. What I believe that we will soon see is an Iranian "invasion" into the land of Syria. What we will see is the leader/ general of these coalition forces turn back and squelch this Iranian threat. Daniel says that this "king of fierce countenance" shall rise to power via a small nation. I believe that this "small people " will be the Kurds. The world's expectation that this man will stand/ sit in the temple, will be their downfall. It is because the AoD will precede the tribulation of those days ["when you see the AoD, THEN...] will be the reason why the DOTL will come unexpectedly upon the world. The world will be so enamored with "peace and safety" that they will not recognize when these events will take place. Keep your eyes on Iran, not Israel.

            Be Blessed
            The PuP

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            • #81
              Re: Israel Palestine Peace Plan

              Originally posted by randyk View Post
              The fact is, the Jewish People are an established ethnicity that deserves to have defensible borders and a territory that upholds a sufficient economy to meet their needs. All the scrambling for property will not change this reality, that food and water are needed, along with defensible borders. The economy depends on a whole host of factors, and property claims that threaten things like commerce will not work.

              If we talk about prophecy, we will have to go back to what Jesus said. The Jewish People will suffer "great tribulation" until the "times of the Gentiles are over." That means that Israel will continue to suffer the birth pangs of national restoration until Jesus comes.
              The true fact is that those who call themselves Jewish, are a mixed bag of ethnicities. There are Sephardic, Ashkenazi, Ethiopian, and Babylonian Jews, +. Jesus calls them members of the Synagogue of Satan. About .05% have become Christian; they are the remnant who will be saved. Romans 9:27 To join with their Christian brethren in all of the holy Land.

              The Trump Peace Plan is likely to be presented soon, they are holding off because Kushner, etc, know that it is going to cause serious dissent and controversy.
              But they will do it and it will be enforced by the UN, as the permanent solution to the 70+ years of terrorism against Israel and for the peace of the region.
              However, Iran is the uncontrollable issue. They have one clearly stated aim; to wipe Israel off the map and when they attempt to do that, with nuke missiles, that will be their doom. Jeremiah 49:34-37, Ezekiel 32:24-25

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              • #82
                Re: Israel Palestine Peace Plan

                Originally posted by Keraz View Post
                The true fact is that those who call themselves Jewish, are a mixed bag of ethnicities. There are Sephardic, Ashkenazi, Ethiopian, and Babylonian Jews, +. Jesus calls them members of the Synagogue of Satan. About .05% have become Christian; they are the remnant who will be saved. Romans 9:27 To join with their Christian brethren in all of the holy Land.

                The Trump Peace Plan is likely to be presented soon, they are holding off because Kushner, etc, know that it is going to cause serious dissent and controversy.
                But they will do it and it will be enforced by the UN, as the permanent solution to the 70+ years of terrorism against Israel and for the peace of the region.
                However, Iran is the uncontrollable issue. They have one clearly stated aim; to wipe Israel off the map and when they attempt to do that, with nuke missiles, that will be their doom. Jeremiah 49:34-37, Ezekiel 32:24-25
                You are confusing the Jewish ethnicity with the supposed need for a "pure" ethnicity. A genetic mix is not the issue. God promised Abraham a nation descended from him, and from Isaac, and from Jacob. There is a group that cultural aligns with the descendants of this group, and they are the Jewish People.

                You also confuse the Jews who convert now with the Jews who will convert later. Nobody is saying that *all* the Jews will be saved. There are Jews not saved now who will be saved later, who will become part of the Jewish elect promised to Abraham. And then the new nation will be built from them on a Christian foundation. This will take place *after* Christ returns.

                But the fact many Jews are not and never will embrace Christ has nothing to do with it. This is true in all nations, and yet many nations have become Christian. I believe Israel will one day become a Christian nation, even though many Jews are judged as rebels in the process.

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                • #83
                  Re: Israel Palestine Peace Plan

                  Originally posted by randyk View Post
                  You are confusing the Jewish ethnicity with the supposed need for a "pure" ethnicity. A genetic mix is not the issue. God promised Abraham a nation descended from him, and from Isaac, and from Jacob. There is a group that cultural aligns with the descendants of this group, and they are the Jewish People.

                  You also confuse the Jews who convert now with the Jews who will convert later. Nobody is saying that *all* the Jews will be saved. There are Jews not saved now who will be saved later, who will become part of the Jewish elect promised to Abraham. And then the new nation will be built from them on a Christian foundation. This will take place *after* Christ returns.

                  But the fact many Jews are not and never will embrace Christ has nothing to do with it. This is true in all nations, and yet many nations have become Christian. I believe Israel will one day become a Christian nation, even though many Jews are judged as rebels in the process.
                  So basically; your belief is that anyone can just call themselves a Jew? The only requirement needed is to convert to Judaism. And that is how it is today, the State of Israel will accept those who do convert, [but be careful to convert to the right kind of Judaism!] but they totally reject Christians. What do you think God should do about this situation?

                  Your contention that many, [most?] of the Jews will convert later, is not in the Bible. Their Judgment and punishment is.

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                  • #84
                    Re: Israel Palestine Peace Plan

                    Originally posted by Keraz View Post
                    So basically; your belief is that anyone can just call themselves a Jew? The only requirement needed is to convert to Judaism. And that is how it is today, the State of Israel will accept those who do convert, [but be careful to convert to the right kind of Judaism!] but they totally reject Christians. What do you think God should do about this situation?

                    Your contention that many, [most?] of the Jews will convert later, is not in the Bible. Their Judgment and punishment is.
                    You really have failed to comprehend my position--I'll take responsibility. I do not believe *most* Jews will convert later. I do believe *many* Jews will convert at the return of Christ. Zech 12.10 Many will also be judged, and will be lost.

                    Neither do I believe that just anybody can call themselves a Jew. One must either claim their Mother is Jewish, or they must identify with Jewish culture and religion.

                    It is debatable, for Jews, as to whether Christianity is a "Jewish religion," obviously. I do *not* believe that all Christians are Jews, if Christianity is indeed viewed as a Jewish religion.

                    Ethnicity is established by association with the culture and with the genetics. A mixed gene pool does not prevent an English person from being English, nor a French person from being French. A Jew can have "mixed blood" and still belong to the Jewish gene pool.

                    What should God do about the non-Christianity of the Jewish People? I've already addressed this. Judgment is the answer.

                    But final judgment has been put off for centuries in the interest of preserving the Jewish People. God has been judging the Jewish People, but complete judgment has been delayed while a remnant in Israel is still being saved.

                    God, similarly, has been judging the nations, who threaten the existence of the Jewish People. But He has held off on final judgment against the nations while people are still being saved among them.

                    One day God will send His Son and bring final judgment against Israel, to dispose of those who resist the new Christian Israel that will be. And He will also judge the nations who also threaten this hope of Israel, so as to preserve the Jewish People so that they can populate the new Israel.

                    It's important to note that not just Israel is being judged by God. The nations are, as well. The world has fallen into great corruption, and it is similar to the time before Noah's Flood. Violence and immorality is everywhere.

                    God's interest is in establishing His knowledge throughout the nations, and not just in Israel. If God has judged Israel, He will also judge formerly Christian nations.

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                    • #85
                      Re: Israel Palestine Peace Plan

                      Randyk says; many Jews will convert at the Return of Jesus.
                      Zechariah 12:10-14 refers to the remnant, as prophesied in many scriptures. The next Chapter of Zechariah 13:1-9, tells of how God will reduce them to a remnant; by a Judgment of fire. Isaiah 4:3-4, Isaiah 6:11-13, Ezekiel 21:1-7, + all tell of a forthcoming terrible fiery blast that will decimate the Land of Israel and only a few Christians who shelter underground will survive. Isaiah 29:1-4 There is no 'conversion' for them at the Return.

                      The Lord is coming to judge and punish the whole world. Zephaniah 3:8, 2 Peter 3:7, +
                      His enemies will die, and they include ll those people currently living in the holy Land, who reject Jesus. Jeremiah 12:14, Luke 19:27, Isaiah 22:14

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                      • #86
                        Re: Israel Palestine Peace Plan

                        Those scriptures aren't saying what you claim they're saying.
                        "Some people's idea of free speech is that they are free to say what they like, but if anyone says anything back that is an outrage."

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                        • #87
                          Re: Israel Palestine Peace Plan

                          Originally posted by Keraz View Post
                          Randyk says; many Jews will convert at the Return of Jesus.
                          Zechariah 12:10-14 refers to the remnant, as prophesied in many scriptures. The next Chapter of Zechariah 13:1-9, tells of how God will reduce them to a remnant; by a Judgment of fire. Isaiah 4:3-4, Isaiah 6:11-13, Ezekiel 21:1-7, + all tell of a forthcoming terrible fiery blast that will decimate the Land of Israel and only a few Christians who shelter underground will survive. Isaiah 29:1-4 There is no 'conversion' for them at the Return.

                          The Lord is coming to judge and punish the whole world. Zephaniah 3:8, 2 Peter 3:7, +
                          His enemies will die, and they include ll those people currently living in the holy Land, who reject Jesus. Jeremiah 12:14, Luke 19:27, Isaiah 22:14
                          Absolutely right about the remnant. I believe the remnant to repent at Christ's coming will be substantial. It will be of sufficient numbers to reestablish a whole nation, founded on Christianity.

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                          • #88
                            Re: Israel Palestine Peace Plan

                            Originally posted by BrianW View Post
                            Those scriptures aren't saying what you claim they're saying.
                            It depends on the way people want to interpret them. To suit preconceived notions, or to understand them according to the truths of all scriptures.

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                            • #89
                              Re: Israel Palestine Peace Plan

                              Originally posted by Keraz View Post
                              It depends on the way people want to interpret them. To suit preconceived notions, or to understand them according to the truths of all scriptures.
                              Right. And you're in the preconceived notions camp. I'm not saying you're totally wrong, I'm just saying that you are attempting to use scripture to support your claims of prophecy concerning Trump, the U.N. an Israel Palestine peace plan and the remnant only consisting of Christians that hide underground.
                              "Some people's idea of free speech is that they are free to say what they like, but if anyone says anything back that is an outrage."

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                              • #90
                                Re: Israel Palestine Peace Plan

                                Originally posted by BrianW View Post
                                Right. And you're in the preconceived notions camp. I'm not saying you're totally wrong, I'm just saying that you are attempting to use scripture to support your claims of prophecy concerning Trump, the U.N. an Israel Palestine peace plan and the remnant only consisting of Christians that hide underground.
                                Actually the American President, any of them; are not in any Bible prophecy.
                                Neither is the United nations, or Trump's Peace Plan.
                                The remnant of the Jews that will survive u/g, is clearly stated in Isaiah 29:1-4 Note that Ariel means 'fire Altar'.

                                The verse that seems to me and to many others, to pertain to a settlement between the Palestinians and the Jewish State of Israel, is 1 Thessalonians 5:3, where people will say: peace and safety at last.....but then: sudden destruction will strike them.
                                This destruction must be the next action of the Lord, His great and terrible Day of fiery wrath, that will change the world and lead up to the glorious Return of Jesus.

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