The False Prophet

[divaD]

Re: The False Prophet

The false prophet points to how the OT says the Messiah will defeat the enemies of God's people and how Jesus didn't do that. The false prophet claims the Messiah will do this in the future.
The false prophet will ignore who the enemy really is. The false prophet will ignore the battle Jesus fought and won and how God's people conquer the enemy by the Messiahs Spirit.

Some of us aren't exactly stupid, thus see who your real target is here. You're trying to imply that any professed Christian who doesn't interpret these same things you brought up, the same way you interpret them, that means these interpreters are antichrist.

[divaD]

Re: The False Prophet

Yes how true I agree and John was talking about apostate Israel in his day

I didn't see any mention of apostate Israel in his post.

[journeyman]

Re: The False Prophet

Yes how true I agree and John was talking about apostate Israel in his day

Yes he was talking about apostate Israel in his day, but most Jews believe those lies to this day and those lies have bent the truth. Many Christians bow to Judaisms heresy by saying, "Well, you're right, Jesus didn't do this or that, but he will in the future." And satan loves it.

[journeyman]

Re: The False Prophet

Some of us aren't exactly stupid, thus see who your real target is here. You're trying to imply that any professed Christian who doesn't interpret these same things you brought up, the same way you interpret them, that means these interpreters are antichrist.

Yes, I didn't realize how antichrist my thinking was, how antichrist what I was being taught in church was, until a dear saint woke me up. How satanic it is to think the Word hasn't always ruled all heaven and earth.

[marty fox]

Re: The False Prophet

I didn't see any mention of apostate Israel in his post.

He described them

[marty fox]

Re: The False Prophet

Yes he was talking about apostate Israel in his day, but most Jews believe those lies to this day and those lies have bent the truth. Many Christians bow to Judaisms heresy by saying, "Well, you're right, Jesus didn't do this or that, but he will in the future." And satan loves it.

Yes I believe many Christians have been deceived into thinking that Jesus and us don’t rule now

Ephesians 2:4-7
. 4 But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, 5 made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions—it is by grace you have been saved. 6 And God raised us up with Christ and seated us with him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus, 7 in order that in the coming ages he might show the incomparable riches of his grace, expressed in his kindness to us in Christ Jesus.

[ewq1938]

Re: The False Prophet

It depends on the translation. NIV:

The seven heads are seven hills on which the woman sits. THEY are also seven kings.

I'm no expert on ten manuscripts but I do know the one that the KJV is based upon does not contain that wording in the Greek which is why it's this way:

Rev 17:10* And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space.*

Here we are introduced to a new bit of information that does not say the heads are also 7 kings. This is the correct version based on none of the heads having ever fallen.

If we understand Dan 7 through the eyes of history, the 4 heads of the leopard beast were the 4 kingdoms that followed Alexander's Greek Empire. From this we understand that heads are kingdoms.

It is not that way In rev. The final beast empire has all 7 heads. None had fallen and these heads are mountains not kings.

The difference with the 7 heads, compared to the 4 heads, is that the 7 are consecutive, 5 were, one is, and one is to come.

Again, the heads of the Rev 13 beast are simultaneous not consecutive. That's how we know the manuscripts that translations like the NIV are based upon are faulty.

[ewq1938]

Re: The False Prophet

The way you and ewq are reading Rev 17 needs clarification. The NIV is pretty clear that the 7 consecutive kings relate to the 7 heads.

The KJV is more ambiguous, but if you regard those 7 consecutive kings as unrelated to the beast, why does the Bible decide to introduce 7 consecutive kings into the text, if unrelated to the 7 heads of the beast just mentioned?

It's a history lesson for the most part. The Rev 13:1 beast is the 7th kingdom that was yet to come. We know from Rev 17 that there were 6 previous ones, 5 had fallen which means were gone by John's time and the one of John's time would fall before the 7th arose. When it rises, all 7 of it's heads are standing and unfallen which obviously contradicts that 6 kings would fall away before the 7th arose.

Not just the NIV, but the Amplified and some other Bibles (eg ASV) also associate the 7 heads with the 7 consecutive kings.
AmP:: The seven heads are seven hills on which the woman sits; and THEY are seven kings: five of whom have fallen, one exists and is reigning

Hard to sit on 7 hills if there aren't 7 existing to sit upon. That's why these are the correct translations and this sin't a complete list just something I put together real quick:

Revelation 17:10
(ABP+)* AndG2532 [3kingsG935 2sevenG2033 1there are] --G1510.2.6 theG3588 fiveG4002 fallen,G4098 theG3588 oneG1520 is,G1510.2.3 theG3588 otherG243 not yetG3768 is come;G2064 andG2532 wheneverG3752 he should come,G2064 [4a littleG3641 1heG1473 2mustG1163 3remain].G3306

(Darby)* And there are seven kings: five have fallen, one is, the other has not yet come; and when he comes he must remain only a little while.

(EMTV)* And there are seven kings. Five have fallen, one is, and the other has not yet come. And whenever he comes, he must abide for a short time.

(KJV)* And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space.

(KJVA)* And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space.

(KJV-BRG)* And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space.

(MKJV)* And there are seven kings; five have fallen, and one is, and the other has not yet come. And when he comes, he must continue a short time.

(Murdock)* And there are seven kings: of whom five have fallen, one exists, and the other hath not yet come; and when he cometh he must continue for a short time.

(TS2009)* “And there are seven sovereigns: five have fallen, and one is, and the other has not yet come. And when he comes, he has to remain a little while.

(Webster)* And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short time.

(Williams)* There are also seven kings; five have fallen, one is on the throne, the other has not yet come, and when he does he must stay but a little while,

(YLT)* and there are seven kings, the five did fall, and the one is, the other did not yet come, and when he may come, it behoveth him to remain a little time;

[ewq1938]

Re: The False Prophet

So how can he be the eighth, and is of the seven? I still haven't figured that out.

It's one person who is king of the 7th kingdom then the beast transforms into the 8th kingdom with the same king who now has a new kingly role. That's why the FP has two little horns, horns are always symbolic of kings in Rev. The Rev 13:1 beast is a war kingdom, whereas the second beast/FP is peaceful at least on a global scale.

[ewq1938]

Re: The False Prophet

And the Seven Heads of the Beasts ARE the 7 POWERS that arose {Mountains}.

That's not consistent with the 7 hills of Rome. They were areas of land not powers. Within the area of land of 7 hills were 10 states...like mini kingdoms with Caesar as the main king or AC type. If we go by that early version or shadow of the ten horns beast to come we then understand that heads are just the hills where ten kingdoms will be established.

[ewq1938]

Re: The False Prophet

Yes I believe many Christians have been deceived into thinking that Jesus and us don’t rule now

No, that is true. Many Christians have been deceived into thinking they rule now over the world when they don't.

The world is in chaos and is anti-christian. Obviously Christ is not ruling this world or else it would not be so evil and chaotic. Christ said Satan is the ruler of the world. That doesn't change until Christ returns.

[journeyman]

Re: The False Prophet

Yes I believe many Christians have been deceived into thinking that Jesus and us don’t rule now

Ephesians 2:4-7
. 4 But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, 5 made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions—it is by grace you have been saved. 6 And God raised us up with Christ and seated us with him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus, 7 in order that in the coming ages he might show the incomparable riches of his grace, expressed in his kindness to us in Christ Jesus.

Yes marty! We are lambs but also lions in the Lord. A stronger man than Jesus never walked on earth or ever will.

[marty fox]

Re: The False Prophet

No, that is true. Many Christians have been deceived into thinking they rule now over the world when they don't.

The world is in chaos and is anti-christian. Obviously Christ is not ruling this world or else it would not be so evil and chaotic. Christ said Satan is the ruler of the world. That doesn't change until Christ returns.

That was before the cross this is what Jesus says now

Revelation 3:14
14 “To the angel of the church in Laodicea write:

These are the words of the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the ruler of God’s creation.

People just don’t understand what the ruling is

[ewq1938]

Re: The False Prophet

That was before the cross

Actually no Christ was speaking of after the cross.

Joh 14:30* Hereafter I will not talk much with you: for the prince of this world cometh, and hath nothing in me.*

The kingdoms of the world are not ruled by Christ until the 7th trump:

Rev 11:15* And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.*

So, the ruler of this current world is Satan. Christ and his saints will not rule it until the 7th trump, which signals the end of the GT as well where Satan will have the most power and authority in this world that he ever had, even more than he has now.

[marty fox]

Re: The False Prophet

Actually no Christ was speaking of after the cross.

Joh 14:30* Hereafter I will not talk much with you: for the prince of this world cometh, and hath nothing in me.*

The kingdoms of the world are not ruled by Christ until the 7th trump:

Rev 11:15* And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.*

So, the ruler of this current world is Satan. Christ and his saints will not rule it until the 7th trump, which signals the end of the GT as well where Satan will have the most power and authority in this world that he ever had, even more than he has now.

No Jesus said that before the cross and he was talking about satan in that presence tense just like this verse

John 12:31
31 Now is the time for judgment on this world; now the prince of this world will be driven ou

What about the verse I quoted in revelation 2?

Jesus stated that He is the ruler of Gods creation now