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The False Prophet

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  • Re: The False Prophet

    Originally posted by divaD View Post
    Boangry apparently thinks there is something that says that.
    Nothing states the angel of the pit was ever imprisoned there prior to the pit being opened. It is only being assumed. As I showed, being the "angel of" something doesn't require being locked inside of whatever area the angel is the angel of.
    James 4:10 Humble yourselves in the sight of the Lord, and he shall lift you up.

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    • Re: The False Prophet

      Originally posted by ewq1938 View Post
      Nothing states the angel of the pit was ever imprisoned there prior to the pit being opened. It is only being assumed.
      That would be my position as well, regardless who abaddon is meaning or not meaning. But even so, nothing states he wasn't imprisoned there either. That, too, is only being assumed. But if abaddon and satan are one and the same, and if abaddon is indeed locked up in the pit until the angel opens the pit in Rev 9, that is Amil, and there would be no way to get around it. Keeping in mind that this is based on all these ifs I brought up, and that they were true.

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      • Re: The False Prophet

        Originally posted by divaD View Post
        That would be my position as well, regardless who abaddon is meaning or not meaning. But even so, nothing states he wasn't imprisoned there either. That, too, is only being assumed. But if abaddon and satan are one and the same, and if abaddon is indeed locked up in the pit until the angel opens the pit in Rev 9, that is Amil, and there would be no way to get around it. Keeping in mind that this is based on all these ifs I brought up, and that they were true.
        Either way Rev 9 is a dif timeframe than Rev 20. One being before the GT, and one after it.
        James 4:10 Humble yourselves in the sight of the Lord, and he shall lift you up.

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        • Re: The False Prophet

          Originally posted by divaD View Post
          That would be my position as well, regardless who abaddon is meaning or not meaning. But even so, nothing states he wasn't imprisoned there either. That, too, is only being assumed. But if abaddon and satan are one and the same, and if abaddon is indeed locked up in the pit until the angel opens the pit in Rev 9, that is Amil, and there would be no way to get around it. Keeping in mind that this is based on all these ifs I brought up, and that they were true.
          So then what predicates, what event occurs whereby the beast decides to come up from the pit at that moment. Are we to think he was never imprisoned but just came up from the pit when he felt like it? And if not imprisoned then why did he even have to come up from any pit? He could have came down from the heavens...….or some place else.

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          • Re: The False Prophet

            Originally posted by ross3421 View Post
            And if not imprisoned then why did he even have to come up from any pit?
            He's the leader of whatever is in the pit. It's like a general going into a military prison to meet with his imprisoned soldiers and lead them out.

            He could have came down from the heavens...….or some place else.
            We aren't given the circumstances of his entering so we can only guess at that. Nothing shows him going in willingly nor being cast in as one of the many prisoners. All we are told is he leaves the pit.
            James 4:10 Humble yourselves in the sight of the Lord, and he shall lift you up.

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            • Re: The False Prophet

              Originally posted by ewq1938 View Post
              He's the leader of whatever is in the pit. It's like a general going into a military prison to meet with his imprisoned soldiers and lead them out.
              So then he is able to go in and out of the pit even if it is locked?

              We aren't given the circumstances of his entering so we can only guess at that. Nothing shows him going in willingly nor being cast in as one of the many prisoners. All we are told is he leaves the pit.
              Well we are in Chapter 12. The beast is cast into the sea, the sea in which he comes up from in Rev 13.

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              • Re: The False Prophet

                Originally posted by ross3421 View Post
                So then he is able to go in and out of the pit even if it is locked?
                No. The passage says the pit is opened, then later it says he leaves the pit. In my analogy the prison was "opened" to let prisoners out so that's when a leader would enter.



                Well we are in Chapter 12. The beast is cast into the sea
                The beast isn't mentioned in Rev 12, and the dragon is cast into the Earth.

                Here is the Greek word:

                G1093
                γῆ
                gē
                ghay
                Contracted from a primary word; soil; by extension a region, or the solid part or the whole of the terrene globe (including the occupants in each application): - country, earth (-ly), ground, land, world.
                Total KJV occurrences: 252


                This is likely the same timeframe that the pit is opened and he enters into to retrieve his evil demons etc. This makes sense because at the end of Rev 12 Satan goes off to start the GT.
                James 4:10 Humble yourselves in the sight of the Lord, and he shall lift you up.

                Comment


                • Re: The False Prophet

                  Originally posted by ross3421 View Post
                  So then what predicates, what event occurs whereby the beast decides to come up from the pit at that moment. Are we to think he was never imprisoned but just came up from the pit when he felt like it? And if not imprisoned then why did he even have to come up from any pit? He could have came down from the heavens....or some place else.
                  This is where logic could work in your favor if you viewed the first 6 kings differently. During the time of the 5 kings that have fallen, this would be when the beast is not in the pit. During the time when John saw the vision, the king that was at that time, the beast would be in the pit during his reign, and would remain in the pit until the time of the 7th king. So just determine what king was reigning when John saw the vision, and when his reign began. That would be when the beast is initially bound in the pit.

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                  • Re: The False Prophet

                    Originally posted by divaD View Post
                    I was basically meaning it proves Amil if abaddon had been in the pit before it opened, and that abaddon was satan, because satan wouldn't be in the closed pit and then seen coming out of it unless someone initially cast him in there to begin with. We have to keep in mind, until the falling star, which I take to be meaning an angel, unlocks the pit and opens it, this obviously indicates the pit has been closed and locked until the angel opens it. Regardless that the key is likely not literal, a key depicts something needed to unlock something that is locked, that being the point.
                    The fallen angel could be Satan himself who falls after a great victory for the church, the church who overcomes by the blood of the lamb and our testimony.

                    the accuser of our brothers and sisters,
                    who accuses them before our God day and night,
                    has been hurled down.
                    11 They triumphed over him
                    by the blood of the Lamb
                    and by the word of their testimony;
                    they did not love their lives so much
                    as to shrink from death.
                    12 Therefore rejoice, you heavens
                    and you who dwell in them!
                    But woe to the earth and the sea,
                    because the devil has gone down to you!
                    He is filled with fury,
                    because he knows that his time is short.

                    Satan is a "fallen star", he goes from accuser in heaven, to "filled with fury" on earth.

                    Comment


                    • Re: The False Prophet

                      Originally posted by DurbanDude View Post
                      The fallen angel could be Satan himself who falls after a great victory for the church
                      Satan isn't the angel who has the key to the pit. A different angel has that key and imprisons Satan in the pit. Wouldn't make sense if the most evil person in history has the key to his own prison.

                      Rev 9:1* And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit.*

                      Rev 20:1* And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.*
                      Rev 20:2* And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,*

                      I believe the same angel has the key. A star falling and an angel coming down is the same exact thing.
                      James 4:10 Humble yourselves in the sight of the Lord, and he shall lift you up.

                      Comment


                      • Re: The False Prophet

                        Originally posted by DurbanDude View Post
                        The fallen angel could be Satan himself who falls after a great victory for the church, the church who overcomes by the blood of the lamb and our testimony.

                        the accuser of our brothers and sisters,
                        who accuses them before our God day and night,
                        has been hurled down.
                        11 They triumphed over him
                        by the blood of the Lamb
                        and by the word of their testimony;
                        they did not love their lives so much
                        as to shrink from death.
                        12 Therefore rejoice, you heavens
                        and you who dwell in them!
                        But woe to the earth and the sea,
                        because the devil has gone down to you!
                        He is filled with fury,
                        because he knows that his time is short.

                        Satan is a "fallen star", he goes from accuser in heaven, to "filled with fury" on earth.

                        Actually I tend to think this could be the case as well. Yet what puzzles me, the locusts let out are not meant to attack God's people, but are meant to attack satan's people. Why would satan want to have people who are lost to begin with, tormented? To accomplish what? Does he want them to repent or something?

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                        • Re: The False Prophet

                          Originally posted by ewq1938 View Post

                          I believe the same angel has the key. A star falling and an angel coming down is the same exact thing.
                          When one sees a shooting star, what is it like? Isn't it usually real quick, like a flash of lightning perhaps?

                          Luke 10:18 And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven.

                          I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven....and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth

                          To me, if it was meaning in a literal sense, though it isn't, lightning fall from heaven...a star fall from heaven...appears to be describing the same thing.

                          Comment


                          • Re: The False Prophet

                            Originally posted by ewq1938 View Post
                            Satan isn't the angel who has the key to the pit. A different angel has that key and imprisons Satan in the pit. Wouldn't make sense if the most evil person in history has the key to his own prison.
                            You have a good point there.

                            Comment


                            • Re: The False Prophet

                              Originally posted by divaD View Post
                              Actually I tend to think this could be the case as well. Yet what puzzles me, the locusts let out are not meant to attack God's people, but are meant to attack satan's people. Why would satan want to have people who are lost to begin with, tormented? To accomplish what? Does he want them to repent or something?
                              Good point, it is confusing.

                              I see the beast territory as mainly devoid of all Christians, kind of like Syria under Isis. Christians there will be nearly all martyred, even with some months of the GT still left.

                              Under these conditions, judgement comes early there in the kingdom of the beast, torment day and night from sores and darkness for a number of months before the second coming.

                              I think God allows Satan to bring pain and suffering during judgements. That's my current thinking, but you ask a good question and am open to other views on this.

                              Comment


                              • Re: The False Prophet

                                Originally posted by ross3421 View Post



                                Well we are in Chapter 12. The beast is cast into the sea, the sea in which he comes up from in Rev 13.
                                Revelation 12:12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.


                                I'm assuming you are concluding that based on what this verse says. The verse says...Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! If sea is meaning the bp, and that there are inhabiters of the bp, why would satan have great wrath against the inhabiters of the bp while he is chained up inside of it? Therefore verse 12 could not be leading to his binding for a thousand years. He would not have great wrath while bound in the pit.

                                The last place satan is seen before he is cast to the earth, is heaven. I don't think the bp is in heaven, so this should at least tell us he is not bound in the bp a thousand years, prior to him being cast unto the earth.

                                If we consider Rev 20 for a moment, we see this.

                                Revelation 20:13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

                                This says...And the sea gave up the dead which were in it. Could this have anything to do with...Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time?

                                But would the sea in these contexts be meaning the bp where satan is bound a thousand years? I'm not seeing how it would be.

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