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  • DavidC
    replied
    Re: I am having a Hard time with Chrsitians

    Originally posted by Frank Lee View Post
    Dear DavidC;

    This is for you...

    I just asked Him and He did it. Everyone that asks receives Jesus said. God wants to do you with His Holy Spirit more than you want it. The gift of speaking in tongues goes along with being filled with the Holy Spirit. I'm currently writing an indepth article and here are scriptures I'll be using.

    First let me tell you how it happened to me. I was saved outside of any church. Jesus sent His Holy Spirit to convict me of sin at our rural mountain home. I repented if my sins and asked Him to save me which He so wonderfully did.

    I then needed to be filled/baptized with His Holy Spirit but didn't know that. Just like you. I saw a woman on TV that was in trouble but she was saved. She was crying out to God for help and she noticed Y her click that she had bee praying in a language she'd never learned for a good while.

    I'd never heard of such a thing myself. Later that day I was crying out to God and thought if that woman. A thought came that "if God did that for this woman maybe He'd do that for you too". In childlike faith I began to make up words, mumbling, jibberjsh, anything at all. In just a minute I wasn't making up words any more. He filled me up with His spirit and gave me the gift of tongues and my life has never been the same. That was 40 years ago and I an still praying I the spirit!

    I was praying I the spirit when He gavene the interpretation telling me that after 14 childless years my wife was pregnant! It was so! J could write you a large book on what we've seen Him do. Praise God for His gift of Jesus!

    Scriptures O the infilling of the Holy Spirit and the gift of tongues;

    Baptism in the Holy Spirit and the gift of tongues


    Job 29:21 — Job 29:23 (NKJV)
    “Men listened to me and waited,
    And kept silence for my counsel.
    After my words they did not speak again,
    And my speech settled on them as dew.
    They waited for me as for the rain,
    And they opened their mouth wide as for the spring rain.

    Intercessory prayer I the spirit


    Job 32:18 — Job 32:20 (NKJV)
    For I am full of words;
    The spirit within me compels me.
    Indeed my belly is like wine that has no vent;
    It is ready to burst like new wineskins.
    I will speak, that I may find relief;
    I must open my lips and answer.


    Isaiah 28:11-12 KJVS
    For with stammering lips and another tongue will he speak to this people.
    [12] To whom he said, This is the rest wherewith ye may cause the weary to rest; and this is the refreshing: yet they would not hear.

    Zephaniah 3:9 KJVS
    For then will I turn to the people a pure language, that they may all call upon the name of the Lord , to serve him with one consent.

    Mark 16:17 KJVS
    And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;

    Acts 1:8 KJVS
    But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth.

    Acts 2:1-4 KJVS
    And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place.
    [2] And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting.
    [3] And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.
    [4] And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.


    Acts 19:1-7 KJVS
    And it came to pass, that, while Apollos was at Corinth, Paul having passed through the upper coasts came to Ephesus: and finding certain disciples,
    [2] He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost.
    [3] And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism. [4] Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.
    [5] When they heard this , they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.
    [6] And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied.
    [7] And all the men were about twelve.

    1 Corinthians 12:7-11 KJVS
    But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal. [8] For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit;
    [9] To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit;
    [10] To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues:
    [11] But all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as he will.


    Pursue love, and earnestly desire the spiritual gifts, especially that you may prophesy. For one who speaks in a tongue speaks not to men but to God; for no one understands him, but he utters mysteries in the Spirit. On the other hand, the one who prophesies speaks to people for their upbuilding and encouragement and consolation. The one who speaks in a tongue builds up himself, but the one who prophesies builds up the church. Now I want you all to speak in tongues, but even more to prophesy. The one who prophesies is greater than the one who speaks in tongues, unless someone interprets, so that the church may be built up. I thank God that I speak in tongues more than all of you. Nevertheless, in church I would rather speak five words with my mind in order to instruct others, than ten thousand words in a tongue. So, my brothers, earnestly desire to prophesy, and do not forbid speaking in tongues.
    1 Corinthians 14:1*-‬5*, ‬18*-‬19*, ‬39 ESV

    praying at all times in the Spirit, with all prayer and supplication. To that end, keep alert with all perseverance, making supplication for all the saints,
    Ephesians 6:18 ESV


    Jude 1:20 (NKJV)
    But you, beloved, building yourselves up on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Spirit
    Hi Frank Lee,

    Thanks for your post, it's full of wisdom!

    There is a follow-up for me I'd like to share, I read a book and prayed about being baptized and so I believe I am now. Praise God. I had no idea there was a difference, but God is good and faithful!

    Thanks again!

    Leave a comment:


  • Frank Lee
    replied
    Re: I am having a Hard time with Chrsitians

    Dear DavidC;

    This is for you...

    I just asked Him and He did it. Everyone that asks receives Jesus said. God wants to do you with His Holy Spirit more than you want it. The gift of speaking in tongues goes along with being filled with the Holy Spirit. I'm currently writing an indepth article and here are scriptures I'll be using.

    First let me tell you how it happened to me. I was saved outside of any church. Jesus sent His Holy Spirit to convict me of sin at our rural mountain home. I repented if my sins and asked Him to save me which He so wonderfully did.

    I then needed to be filled/baptized with His Holy Spirit but didn't know that. Just like you. I saw a woman on TV that was in trouble but she was saved. She was crying out to God for help and she noticed Y her click that she had bee praying in a language she'd never learned for a good while.

    I'd never heard of such a thing myself. Later that day I was crying out to God and thought if that woman. A thought came that "if God did that for this woman maybe He'd do that for you too". In childlike faith I began to make up words, mumbling, jibberjsh, anything at all. In just a minute I wasn't making up words any more. He filled me up with His spirit and gave me the gift of tongues and my life has never been the same. That was 40 years ago and I an still praying I the spirit!

    I was praying I the spirit when He gavene the interpretation telling me that after 14 childless years my wife was pregnant! It was so! J could write you a large book on what we've seen Him do. Praise God for His gift of Jesus!

    Scriptures O the infilling of the Holy Spirit and the gift of tongues;

    Baptism in the Holy Spirit and the gift of tongues


    Job 29:21 — Job 29:23 (NKJV)
    “Men listened to me and waited,
    And kept silence for my counsel.
    After my words they did not speak again,
    And my speech settled on them as dew.
    They waited for me as for the rain,
    And they opened their mouth wide as for the spring rain.

    Intercessory prayer I the spirit


    Job 32:18 — Job 32:20 (NKJV)
    For I am full of words;
    The spirit within me compels me.
    Indeed my belly is like wine that has no vent;
    It is ready to burst like new wineskins.
    I will speak, that I may find relief;
    I must open my lips and answer.


    Isaiah 28:11-12 KJVS
    For with stammering lips and another tongue will he speak to this people.
    [12] To whom he said, This is the rest wherewith ye may cause the weary to rest; and this is the refreshing: yet they would not hear.

    Zephaniah 3:9 KJVS
    For then will I turn to the people a pure language, that they may all call upon the name of the Lord , to serve him with one consent.

    Mark 16:17 KJVS
    And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;

    Acts 1:8 KJVS
    But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth.

    Acts 2:1-4 KJVS
    And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place.
    [2] And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting.
    [3] And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.
    [4] And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.


    Acts 19:1-7 KJVS
    And it came to pass, that, while Apollos was at Corinth, Paul having passed through the upper coasts came to Ephesus: and finding certain disciples,
    [2] He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost.
    [3] And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism. [4] Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.
    [5] When they heard this , they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.
    [6] And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied.
    [7] And all the men were about twelve.

    1 Corinthians 12:7-11 KJVS
    But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal. [8] For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit;
    [9] To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit;
    [10] To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues:
    [11] But all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as he will.


    Pursue love, and earnestly desire the spiritual gifts, especially that you may prophesy. For one who speaks in a tongue speaks not to men but to God; for no one understands him, but he utters mysteries in the Spirit. On the other hand, the one who prophesies speaks to people for their upbuilding and encouragement and consolation. The one who speaks in a tongue builds up himself, but the one who prophesies builds up the church. Now I want you all to speak in tongues, but even more to prophesy. The one who prophesies is greater than the one who speaks in tongues, unless someone interprets, so that the church may be built up. I thank God that I speak in tongues more than all of you. Nevertheless, in church I would rather speak five words with my mind in order to instruct others, than ten thousand words in a tongue. So, my brothers, earnestly desire to prophesy, and do not forbid speaking in tongues.
    1 Corinthians 14:1*-‬5*, ‬18*-‬19*, ‬39 ESV

    praying at all times in the Spirit, with all prayer and supplication. To that end, keep alert with all perseverance, making supplication for all the saints,
    Ephesians 6:18 ESV


    Jude 1:20 (NKJV)
    But you, beloved, building yourselves up on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Spirit

    Leave a comment:


  • doug3
    replied
    Re: I am having a Hard time with Chrsitians

    Originally posted by DavidC View Post
    How do you do that? Get baptized by the Holy Spirit?
    Congratulations! You have just opened a major can of worms!

    Basically, there are two camps of opinion in this matter. One camp believes that Christians are baptized in the Holy Spirit (Holy Ghost) at the point when they are born again; and that it is sometimes accompanied by “signs” such as speaking in tongues and prophesying.

    The second camp believes that Spirit baptism, or Holy Ghost baptism, is a “second blessing” that the born- again believer experiences at some point after salvation if they diligently seek and ask God, and that it is always accompanied by “signs” such as speaking in tongues and prophesying.

    I know sincere, well-rooted and grounded, and spiritually-gifted believers with very different opinions in this area

    In my opinion, it is up to the individual believer to come to their own understanding in this matter, by diligent study of the scriptures as well as listening to the teaching and opinions of others.

    I would suggest that you might start by comparing the accounts of the manifestation of the spirit in Acts 2:1-4 and related text, with Acts 10:44-48 and related text (it is very important to read these accounts in their context).


    P.S. Being "filled" with the Spirit is something different. I'll leave that to someone else to follow-up. Need to get to sleep here.

    Leave a comment:


  • DavidC
    replied
    Re: I am having a Hard time with Chrsitians

    Originally posted by Frank Lee View Post
    It's a shocking Revelation but many many that profess to be Christians are not. Many of those that see nothing wrong with this person's dress are in the same sinking boat. Denominationalized but unsaved.

    Multitudes that are born again Christians are not baptized in the Holy Spirit. Until you have been born again and baptized in the Holy Spirit you are not equipped to walk rightly. Acts chapter 19 tells us about it.

    Yoga is just another ploy of Satan to take eyes and ears away from God. This woman is unsaved and needs to be really born again and filled with God's Holy Spirit.
    How do you do that? Get baptized by the Holy Spirit?

    Leave a comment:


  • Frank Lee
    replied
    Re: I am having a Hard time with Chrsitians

    It's a shocking Revelation but many many that profess to be Christians are not. Many of those that see nothing wrong with this person's dress are in the same sinking boat. Denominationalized but unsaved.

    Multitudes that are born again Christians are not baptized in the Holy Spirit. Until you have been born again and baptized in the Holy Spirit you are not equipped to walk rightly. Acts chapter 19 tells us about it.

    Yoga is just another ploy of Satan to take eyes and ears away from God. This woman is unsaved and needs to be really born again and filled with God's Holy Spirit.

    Leave a comment:


  • Trivalee
    replied
    Re: I am having a Hard time with Chrsitians

    Originally posted by BCV View Post
    Attending church doesn't make you a Christian - as much as sitting in a garage doesn't make you a car......
    True. Takes more to be a Christian.

    Leave a comment:


  • timf
    replied
    Re: I am having a Hard time with Chrsitians

    There are many different "Christian" denominations. In Galatians Paul calls these one of the works of the flesh ("herisis" or divisions Gal. 5). Satan has been advancing this assault on Christians for centuries. The result is people who claim Christ and despise other Christians when the most singular identifying characteristic of Christians should be their love for each other.

    Here is a web page that describes some of the many divisions in Christianity.

    http://christianpioneer.com/lib/rchurch/rchurch.htm

    I would suggest avoiding those who seem disinterested or unable to seek the deeper things of the Lord and seek out older wiser Christians who are better examples and able to show you how to draw ever closer to our Savior.

    Leave a comment:


  • BCV
    replied
    Re: I am having a Hard time with Chrsitians

    Attending church doesn't make you a Christian - as much as sitting in a garage doesn't make you a car......

    Leave a comment:


  • grams
    replied
    Re: I am having a Hard time with Chrsitians

    I believe you need to find a different church ! If for any reason this is not what you can do..

    at least find one on the computer and write to them for help........ do more then one , that way you should get a answer.

    Just make it as clear as possible and short as possible....... Blessing to you !

    Leave a comment:


  • BrianW
    replied
    Re: I am having a Hard time with Chrsitians

    WannaBeHannah,

    You were absolutely right about the yoga itself and yes, you should be concerned when an assistant pastors wife shows up to church in shorts that barely cover her backside. And yes, you should be able to have a conversation with her about it and she should have taken the time to discuss it with you via the web or, better yet, face to face over some coffee or similar.

    And yes, you should be concerned that no one else in the church seems to have a problem with it or, if they do, remain silent. Could you have handled things better? No matter how ell we handle these situations we always, always look back in hindsight and recognize that we could have done better.

    Not all local churches are at the level of maturity they should be and neither are all who have become pastors. Some people attend church their entire lives and claim Christ but don't know Him at all. But please don't look at one local church and think the entire Church ( which is composed of all we are born again ) is the same. We aren't.

    You should be able talk to your pastor directly about your concerns ( and I don't mean the yoga and shorts specifically at first ) and see how it goes. You can also visit other local churches to see if you can find a better fit for you and your growth right now. Just because your family attends this church doesn't mean that you have to. And if they have a problem with any of this?

    You have to work out your own salvation sister and your relationship with and love for God comes before all else. Just never forget that without love we have nothing. You can be absolutely right and correct in speaking of all things but if you don't do so out of love for God and your brothers and sisters in Christ you can do more harm than good.

    Edit to add: We as Christians are called to edify and uplift each other. We are directly told not to forsake fellowship with our brothers and sisters in Christ. We have clear Scripture telling us that if we see someone in the church that is in the wrong that we should approach them and gives steps about how these things are to be handled.
    You are in the right and I hope you never lose your fire and passion for the Lord.
    Good luck sister. You will have trouble, you will have strife and you will have others telling you that we shouldn't judge what God has clearly called sin.

    Through it all continue to trust in Him and remember that He is your hope and that He is your joy and that He is the life and things will turn out fine in the end.
    Last edited by BrianW; Jun 17 2017, 12:39 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • grams
    replied
    Re: I am having a Hard time with Chrsitians



    Oh this is so sad........... I tried to save my friends after I got saved............. I wanted to help every one.....

    Bad idea............ I did not know my bible as yet....... and that made me loose these friends......

    So please , be sure you have a lot of scripture from the bible that you can use......

    I did not and I wish some one would have mentioned some thing lie this to me......

    Leave a comment:


  • Pbminimum
    replied
    Re: I am having a Hard time with Chrsitians

    Originally posted by Saved7 View Post
    There ar very few Christians I call friend for the same reasons. As Scooby Snacks quoted, "deep calls unto deep". Be strong and stay faithful my friend.
    I have a hard time understanding this. I have many Christians I call friends. In fact, almost ALL of my friends are Christians.

    Perhaps the problem is deeper than you know.

    Leave a comment:


  • Saved7
    replied
    Re: I am having a Hard time with Chrsitians

    There ar very few Christians I call friend for the same reasons. As Scooby Snacks quoted, "deep calls unto deep". Be strong and stay faithful my friend.

    Leave a comment:


  • Aijalon
    replied
    Re: I am having a Hard time with Chrsitians

    Originally posted by WannaBeHannah View Post
    immediately she attacked me saying that God had never convicted her of yoga being wrong and I don't really understand what I was talking about. Because of the aggressive attack I continued the conversation with her via instant message.
    One of the things she commented on was " I use Yoga to reduce my anxiety"
    I asked her if she would tell those words to an unsaved person? I asked and then answered that If I was unsaved and a Christian had told me to worship Jesus but yoga will reduce your stress, I would be heavily confused as to what God had more power..... And honestly, if yoga god is reducing stress and jesus god wants me to sacrifice, I am going with yoga god......
    She returned that email with an email that said she didn't want to talk about it anymore so I ended the conversation without replying.
    Before warning her and possibly offending her that she is performing (maybe) a pagan ritual, stop and think about whether her awareness of that is of importance to God and in light of the conscience.

    Paul makes a very key point about the conscience. Don't offend the conscience of someone unnecessarily. For you, Yoga is unnatural and points to a pagan worship practice.

    To others, Yoga is merely an exercise. Consider the merits and benefits of a merely secular Yoga, and also consider you might be wrong about the pagan worship. Suppose that the pagan deity and yoga poses are simply coincidental. Suppose that we have adopted a formerly pagan ritual as a method of exercise. It is possible that the yoga poses do have mental and physical benefits. Physical exercise of all kinds is beneficial for anxiety by releasing stress and regulating the mood - just from a scientific standpoint.

    Can you readily discern that her Yoga studio is following truly pagan practices, chants, or techniques? Don't try to add guilt onto someone where there is no need.

    I have seen this so many times over the last two years. People born and raised in the church and there is absolutely no difference between them and the world.
    On this note, you have a great point it is hard to discern between the two sometimes. I would suggest asking anyone to tell you what they hope for ... that's a good marker.

    I had a sister have an abortion and I was the devil child in my family for being sad about it...... I heard so many excuses as why it was forgivable..... I felt like this sister had the abortion but I am the one being judged for being tormented by that act.... And my entire family says they are saved. Been in the church for their and our entire lives.....
    That one is troubling. Seems a callous view by your family on the value of life. That said, you realize that the act is forgivable, yes? God put the life of a human within the life of a woman. She is in the driver seat and sin as it may be, women feel a sense of entitlement to do as they please with their body. The Fetus is viewed as merely an extension of the body by some, but to others like you an extension of the image of God. Rather than throw guilt, try to add to their viewpoint a sense of awe and magnificence in being created in the image and likeness of God! In so doing, they may see abortion as a terrible crime.

    I made a comment the other day about google giving tribute to the homosexual man that "invented the rainbow
    ( he put together the homosexual flag colors) and was instantly attacked by Christians saying we need to love everyone..... I don't really see that in the Bible I read. I see a very angry God that hates abortion, hates homosexuality, hates hypocrites in the church hates sin and wants us to turn away from it. I do see a very loving God that came to earth and died for our sins that we can be with him. I know God wants us to not have our noses up in the air , looking down on people. I know God wants me to share his love with everyone, but I don't agree with this systems form of love
    Of course homosexuality and love are not the same thing. Teaching the world that love is expressed on the cross is the key thing. Love is self-LESS-ness. Homosexuallity is merely lust. Consider that homosexuality is not the main thing Jesus came here to solve. Like abortion it wrecks the image of God by confusing the natural design of the human form. Is God horrified at sex sins any more than other lusts, like greed, or abuse of power? Nope.

    THink about this. Sexual sins were ADDITINALLY penalized as crimes in ancient Israel. Consider that the sin and the crime no longer equate in our time, being as we are not tasked to build a holy nation. God ended that period and we entered a new period, not the Lion's rules, but the Lamb's rules. We learn from Leviticus the principles behind the laws which were enforced but we don't enforce them.

    It is NOT loving to me not to warn someone they are in danger. It is not loving to avoid hard conversations with people and not tell them about God because they might be offended. It is not loving to me to leave people in sin and hope they find their way out of it.

    I am so heavily conflicted about sin. MY OWN ESPECIALLY!!!
    A broken heart God will not despise! don't attempt to BREAK someone's heart artificially.

    Express to sinners how you were forgiven, that gives them hope too. Convicting others of sin is mainly the Spirit's job, reminding Christians to stay on course away from sin is our -prophetic- job. Badgering the worldly about their sin is NOT our job.

    Isn't it love thy enemy- the world is enemies with God therefor , they are our enemies and we are called to love them. But they are our enemies, and they need us to do the tough thing and tell them about Christ and hell and repentance right?
    WOW. I think you just REVERSED the point of that passage. If you view them as an enemy, that in itself isn't loving. Consider that the point was to not view them as an enemy but to behave as Christ did, and to LOVE ALL. God so LOVED the world. That does mean he loves everyone. No hate. (Don't confuse atonement and love though)


    Am I supposed to be quiet ?
    Yes, and no. Strive to live a quiet and peaceful life (1 Thess 4:11) But be ready to defend the Gospel at all times but remember that the meek inherit the earth, not the bold or brave. Follow the narrow path


    I am not confused as to what to do with the unsaved. I expect them to be in sin, because they are without God.
    I am just so shocked by the Christians that stay in sin and then justify it and judge me when I bring it up.


    Should we bring up these things to our brothers and sisters?
    Do we stay silent ?

    I want so badly to Love Gods people, but I honestly feel exhausted by it
    God's people are free from the condemnation of sin. Sometimes that manifests as a license to sin, and in certain ways, it's true, God is willing to forgive and will indeed overlook many sins. Why be exhausted by Love? I think you are misplacing love and prophecy. Prophecy reminds God's people who have strayed to come back to him and renew the bond of the covenant. Be careful that you don't misplace prophecy with works-righteousness, as if we must follow a strict task list of do's and don'ts to either be saved or maintain salvation.

    We don't maintain our salvation, we are held in state of sanctification until the day of our salvation comes.

    Peace to you.

    Leave a comment:


  • Pbminimum
    replied
    Re: I am having a Hard time with Chrsitians

    Originally posted by Enoch987 View Post
    Consider the two teaching missing from Christianity is the right to protect oneself and the responsibility to be ethical and to encourage others to do both. Both are in the Old Testament but not so much in the New. I'd like someone to argue the both are in the New. I see it some but it's more in the Old. The US constitution is written for both. We come to Jesus to save us then the church tells us to love others but don't protect ourselves? It doesn't make sense.
    Who said the church doesn't allow us to protect ourselves ? There are clear guidelines about handling strife in the body. The problem I see is too many people are looking for problems about things that are temporary in nature.

    Leave a comment:

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