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Thread: Did Habakkuk porphesy about the world today?

  1. #1
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    Did Habakkuk porphesy about the world today?

    With regard to the following scripture is the prophesy delivered by Habakkuk being fulfilled today?

    Habakkuk 2

    6 ¶"Will not all of these take up a taunt-song against him, Even mockery and insinuations against him, And say, `Woe to him who increases what is not his -- For how long -- And makes himself rich with loans?´
    7 "Will not your creditors rise up suddenly, And those who collect from you awaken? Indeed, you will become plunder for them.
    8 "Because you have looted many nations, All the remainder of the peoples will loot you -- Because of human bloodshed and violence done to the land, To the town and all its inhabitants.
    9 ¶"Woe to him who gets evil gain for his house To put his nest on high To be delivered from the hand of calamity!
    10 "You have devised a shameful thing for your house By cutting off many peoples; So you are sinning against yourself.


    With the banking and housing fall, is the world seeing what it was warned against 500 some years before Jesus even visited this world. Most Christians and non Christians alike have the mindset that loans are needed if one buys something of great value, like a house or car. Where I see the need for a loan on a house, a car can be obtained without a loan if we want to do it the right way. Have we as a society become to complacent to buy into the same mindset and we along with the non believers of the world paying the price for our wants leading to our destruction? This is not just limited to personal finance, but also corporations both Christian and non Christian.

    So I would like to explore this with the scriptures in mind and if anyone has other scripture to add to the discussion please feel free to share them.
    I am a Christian man in the Devil's land, spreading the gospel man to man.
    Have you laid your burdens down?


  2. #2
    It seems like the question is, for all purposes, assuming that loaning and debt didn't exist except in word all the centuries ago... I don't think you are assuming this, but just because something a prophet says is applicable to our time today doesn't mean it was originally directed at our time today.

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    Quote Originally Posted by markedward View Post
    It seems like the question is, for all purposes, assuming that loaning and debt didn't exist except in word all the centuries ago... I don't think you are assuming this, but just because something a prophet says is applicable to our time today doesn't mean it was originally directed at our time today.
    Many believe this scripture in question is unfulfilled prophesy. I have no idea what you believe in regard to that, but whether it is or not should not make that big of a difference. Are you saying it does not apply to today? Does any prophesy relate to us today for that matter. I am of the belief that we should heed the warning as the word of God is timeless. Now I understand that some prophesy was fulfilled by Jesus and that can't be fulfilled again, but aside from that do you think this prophesy applies to what we are living through today?
    I am a Christian man in the Devil's land, spreading the gospel man to man.
    Have you laid your burdens down?


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    Quote Originally Posted by TrustingFollower View Post
    With regard to the following scripture is the prophesy delivered by Habakkuk being fulfilled today?

    Habakkuk 2

    6 ¶"Will not all of these take up a taunt-song against him, Even mockery and insinuations against him, And say, `Woe to him who increases what is not his -- For how long -- And makes himself rich with loans?´
    7 "Will not your creditors rise up suddenly, And those who collect from you awaken? Indeed, you will become plunder for them.
    8 "Because you have looted many nations, All the remainder of the peoples will loot you -- Because of human bloodshed and violence done to the land, To the town and all its inhabitants.
    9 ¶"Woe to him who gets evil gain for his house To put his nest on high To be delivered from the hand of calamity!
    10 "You have devised a shameful thing for your house By cutting off many peoples; So you are sinning against yourself.


    With the banking and housing fall, is the world seeing what it was warned against 500 some years before Jesus even visited this world. Most Christians and non Christians alike have the mindset that loans are needed if one buys something of great value, like a house or car. Where I see the need for a loan on a house, a car can be obtained without a loan if we want to do it the right way. Have we as a society become to complacent to buy into the same mindset and we along with the non believers of the world paying the price for our wants leading to our destruction? This is not just limited to personal finance, but also corporations both Christian and non Christian.

    So I would like to explore this with the scriptures in mind and if anyone has other scripture to add to the discussion please feel free to share them.
    Was not the section you quoted part of God's judgement against the Babylonians?
    Do not say, “Why were the old days better than these?” For it is not wise to ask such questions.
    Ecc 7:10

    John777 exists to me only in quoted form.



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    Quote Originally Posted by teddyv View Post
    Was not the section you quoted part of God's judgement against the Babylonians?
    Chapter two is looked at as God's answer to the vision given Habakkuk. This is even quoted in the NT and is mostly speaks about the righteous living by faith. Yes it was while Israel was captive in Babylon, but that does not factor in as to say that this is only directed at those living then. We can see for Ezekiel that not all prophesy given back then was only for then.
    I am a Christian man in the Devil's land, spreading the gospel man to man.
    Have you laid your burdens down?


  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by TrustingFollower View Post
    With regard to the following scripture is the prophesy delivered by Habakkuk being fulfilled today?
    Even a cursory reading of the context shows that this was fulfilled centuries ago. God has revealed to Habakkuk that he will raise up the Babylonians to deal with rebellious Israel (1:6). No doubt distressed that ungodly pagans shall take part in bringing justice to Israel (1:13-14), Habakkuk complains that there is little to no hope in this (1:16). Chapter two therefore is about how God will humble mighty Babylon, specifically its king who of course is an anti-Messiah. Seeing how this happened in history already, there is no reference to today's circumstances.

    Perhaps the Biblical question at stake is which king of Babylon is being referred to. When Habakkuk wrote, the most obvious king of Babylon (and the one who conquered Judah) was Nebuchadnezzar. But Nebuchadnezzar was humbled within his lifetime according to Daniel, and eventually converted to recognize Israel's God. His "son" (don't take that as a literal son) Belshazzar was the Babylonian king who not only never realizes the power (much less the sovereignty) of Israel's God, but of whom fits the description found in Hab 2:5 (compare Dan 5) of being drunk with wine. It could just be that this is a condemnation of the entire state of Babylon, despite its particular ruler in power (perhaps the best explanation). At any rate, God certainly humbled the state of Babylon by raising up the Persians, fulfilling the promise found in this chapter.
    ~Clay

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by TrustingFollower View Post
    Chapter two is looked at as God's answer to the vision given Habakkuk. This is even quoted in the NT and is mostly speaks about the righteous living by faith. Yes it was while Israel was captive in Babylon, but that does not factor in as to say that this is only directed at those living then. We can see for Ezekiel that not all prophesy given back then was only for then.
    Right! Very true! Habakkuk was shown a vision of the Babylonians coming to Israel. After the vision, Habakkuk went to get on the tower to warn the people of what is coming soon on them. But - God had Habakkuk make a change in plans.

    v 2
    "Write the vision, and make it plain upon tables, that he may run that readeth it."
    WHY?
    v3
    "For the vision...for an appointed time, but at the end it shall speak..."
    WHAT IS GOING TO HAPPEN?

    v 4
    "...his soul...not upright..."
    v5
    "...he transgresseth by wine...a proud man...gathereth the naitions, and heapeth unto him all people;"

    This part of prophecy is about the man of sin and that he will come from Chaldea.~

    v 6
    "For, lo, I raise up the Chaldeans...hasty nation..."
    v12
    "...established them for correction."
    /as in the Chaldeans are to bring Israel in line - take them back to they will want to obey God
    v17
    "...not spare continually to slay the nations?"

    Acts 13:40
    "Beware therefore, lest that come upon you, which is spoken of in the prophets."
    v 41
    "...for I work a work which ye shall in no wise believe..."

    Habakkuk chapter 1
    v5
    "...for I will work a work..."

    I find it also interesting that the words used for the time of this wicked proud gathers the nations man tie right to the 4th seal rider.
    death and hell
    Last edited by vinsight4u8; May 22nd 2009 at 02:50 AM.

  8. #8
    As for buying things on credit >somewhere in the first sections of the OT, it tells how Israel couldn't charge their own people usury, but could others.

  9. #9
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    Does the fact that Revelation talks about Babylon rising make this a prophesy that may have been fulfilled back then and also will or is being fulfilled at a later time?
    I am a Christian man in the Devil's land, spreading the gospel man to man.
    Have you laid your burdens down?


  10. #10
    Rev. 18 speaks of the future events as to Babylon. Attention has to be given as to how the chapter begins. "And after these things I saw..."
    So John is no longer telling the same story that he was in chapter 17. Just as in 19:1 "And after these things I heard..." also shows a new sequence of events will begin to get linked together.

    What is in chapter 17 - is not part of chapter 19.
    Just as Rev. 7 and Rev. 6 are not to be one continuing play by play message.


    Rev. 7:1
    "And after these things I saw..."
    John could now be anywhere along the timeline of the end events. We have to take the words of chapter 7 and figure out just what point he is experiencing.

    Rev. 18:1
    "And after these things I saw another angel come down from heaven, having great power..."
    So this is not the first time that John has seen an angel come down from heaven in the overall book of Revelation.
    v2
    "...Babylon the great is fallen..."
    v3
    "For all nations have drunk of the wine..."
    When did they drink of Babylon's cup? Jeremiah 25:15 shows it was back in the days of Nebuchadnezzar.
    Babylon was given seventy years for her kings to rule the nations, but Cyrus took the kingdom down before that time was over.
    B.C.
    605 - Nebuchadnezzar
    539 -Cyrus of Persia

    Jeremiah 25:11-13 shows Babylon's own king time must be seventy years total.

    Compare Isaiah 47 as to the Chaldeans -and Rev. 18.

    Rev. 18:7 and Isa. 47:8

    as to "am no widow"
    and "shall not sit as a widow"

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