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Thread: Only the elect are "worthy" to obtain the "age to come."

  1. #1

    Only the elect are "worthy" to obtain the "age to come."

    Christ was asked a hypothetical question about a woman who had 7 husbands, all of which died along with herself. Luke 20:33 records: “in the resurrection whose wife of them is she? for seven had her to wife.”

    Christ tells us in Luke 20:34-36: “The children of this world (or aion or age) marry, and are given in marriage: But they which shall be accounted worthy(or kataxioō) to obtain that world (or aion or age), and the resurrection from the dead, neither marry, nor are given in marriage: Neither can they die any more: for they are equal unto the angels; and are the children of God, being the children of the resurrection.”

    When it says that those that are worthy to inherit the age to come will not experience death in that age we know that we are looking at the eternal state. There is no other age that is exempt from the blight of death. This indeed will be a glorious day. There can be no doubt that we are looking at the introduction of the new heavens and the new earth.

    Attaining unto the age to come is not automatic; it is a reward. Scripture repeatedly makes it clear that Jesus is only Coming for those that are ready, looking and prepared. He is Coming alone for His people. This is clearly confirmed in this text. The age to come is an age exclusively reserved for “the children of God.” Whilst the wicked are not the main focus of this particular text we can still discern that they are excluded from the age to come. They are judged, banished from His presence and damned to eternal punishment when He appears. There are therefore two peoples at Christ’s appearing, one that is rewarded and one that is reprobated.

    The phrase accounted worthy is translated from the Greek word kataxioō and means exactly how it is interpreted. It means to deem entirely deserving. It is found 4 times in the New Testament and carries that consistent sense.

    This narrative totally prohibits mortals and the wicked from populating the new earth. Firstly this age is a reward for the redeemed. The Premil scheme falls apart at this point as it saturates the new earth with unregenerate mortal rebels. In fact, they reward those who attack Jerusalem just prior to the Second Coming and usher them into the semi-corrupt semi-glorious millennial age.

    What is more: those who experience the age to come are not expressly mortals (they don’t die). This obviously exclusively refers to the perfected glorified saints. Those that are “accounted worthy” in Scripture are the elect. Thus, those that obtain that age which is to come are those that have been glorified at the resurrection. They enter the eternal age and don’t die any more – "for they are equal unto the angels.”

    Luke uses this same word in the next chapter also in regard to the Second Coming of the Lord. He is quoting our Lord’s admonition about His appearing. Christ warns, “take heed to yourselves, lest at any time your hearts be overcharged with surfeiting, and drunkenness, and cares of this life, and so that day (the Second Coming) come upon you unawares. For as a snare shall it come on all them that dwell on the face of the whole earth. Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy (or kataxioō) to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man (Luke 21:34-36).

    Those who are accounted worthy to escape the impending wrath of God in this passage are the exact same people who Jesus identifies in Luke 20 who are described as the “children of God” who will be glorified at His Coming and will therefore not “die any more” – because “they are equal unto the angels.”

    These two statements by our Lord in these two passages closely correlate. They impress the necessity of being prepared and qualified to (1) escape the wrath of God that will be poured upon sinful civilisation and (2) inherit the new eternal state that is purged of all corruption when Jesus comes. Scripture has much to say about this great climactic event that will catch the ungodly “unawares” but will find the believer watching. We should not forget it is only a certain calibre of human being that will experience both of these blessings (the rescue and the inheritance). It is the redeemed of God.

    The dual aspect of Christ’s return is also found in II Thessalonians 1:4-10, where we find a 3rd New Testament reference to the same Greek word kataxioō. It similarly says, “we ourselves glory in you in the churches of God for your patience and faith in all your persecutions and tribulations that ye endure: Which is a manifest token of the righteous judgment of God, that ye may be counted worthy (or kataxioō) of the kingdom of God, for which ye also suffer: Seeing it is a righteous thing with God to recompense tribulation to them that trouble you; And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, in flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power; When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.”

    When Jesus appears the righteous and the wicked will be eternally separated. The righteous will inherit the kingdom of God the wicked will be destroyed “from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power.” This reading shows us that men must warrant the kingdom of God; it is not given to everyone. Other clear Scripture tells us that there are but few that will experience the eternal kingdom – only those that are “counted worthy.” It is a meritorious thing, just like the catching away of the saints to escape the wrath of God and the reward of the age to come.

    This passage recognizes only two types of person – saved and lost – and conclusively confirms that it is only those that know God and obey the Gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ that will survive the Second Coming. The rest are expressly destroyed. This agrees with Christ’s words in Luke 20:34-36 that the kingdom of God to come which Christ ushers in at His appearing is solely for those that are suitably qualified.

    The only other time the Greek word in view is used is in Acts 5:41 where the disciples rejoiced in their persecution and the fact “they were counted worthy (or kataxioō) to suffer shame for his name.”

    All the usages of this word therefore relate to the saints of God, and relate to an impending rewarded condition.
    Last edited by wpm; Feb 1st 2014 at 09:20 PM. Reason: Clarified a statement on inheriting the new earth
    "ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free" (John 8:32).

    http://www.evangelicaltruth.com/

    WPM

  2. #2
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    Re: Only the elect are "worthy" to obtain the "age to come."

    Quote Originally Posted by wpm View Post
    Christ was asked a hypothetical question about a woman who had 7 husbands, all of which died along with herself. Luke 20:33 records: “in the resurrection whose wife of them is she? for seven had her to wife.”

    Christ tells us in Luke 20:34-36: “The children of this world (or aion or age) marry, and are given in marriage: But they which shall be accounted worthy(or kataxioō) to obtain that world (or aion or age), and the resurrection from the dead, neither marry, nor are given in marriage: Neither can they die any more: for they are equal unto the angels; and are the children of God, being the children of the resurrection.”

    When it says that those that are worthy to inherit the age to come will not experience death we know that we are looking at the eternal state. There is no other age that is exempt from the blight of death. This indeed will be a glorious day. There can be no doubt that we are looking at the introduction of the new heavens and the new earth.
    You have a strange way with language. You say; "... will not experience death", but scripture says "will not die anymore". That is, they did die but it cannot affect them anymore. Otherwise why does the verses end with "children of the resurrection"? Thus, a large part of your argument following is based on a false supposition. And further to that, if "children of the resurrection", then there are those who are NOT resurrected for a further thousand years (Rev.20:5-7). This brings your timing of the New Heavens and New Earth in disrepute immediately as the last enemy - death, is not yet conquered for a further thousand years. So who can then speak of "the eternal state"?

    I think your posting it is a measure of the fallibility of your doctrine. Maybe it is time to consider that those who hold that it is the thousand years that is the reward and not the "eternal state" are correct after all.

  3. #3

    Re: Only the elect are "worthy" to obtain the "age to come."

    Quote Originally Posted by Walls View Post
    You have a strange way with language. You say; "... will not experience death", but scripture says "will not die anymore". That is, they did die but it cannot affect them anymore. Otherwise why does the verses end with "children of the resurrection"? Thus, a large part of your argument following is based on a false supposition. And further to that, if "children of the resurrection", then there are those who are NOT resurrected for a further thousand years (Rev.20:5-7). This brings your timing of the New Heavens and New Earth in disrepute immediately as the last enemy - death, is not yet conquered for a further thousand years. So who can then speak of "the eternal state"?

    I think your posting it is a measure of the fallibility of your doctrine. Maybe it is time to consider that those who hold that it is the thousand years that is the reward and not the "eternal state" are correct after all.
    I have to disagree. Whatever way you look at it there is no more death on the future earth and the age to come. Luke 20:34-36 forbids the Premil paradigm. This is something you sidestep. Premil has a continuation of pain, sin, death, suffering, tears, hatred, war, funerals. Amil and Postmil (in accordance with Scripture) looks for Christ and the abolition of all unrighteousness, bondage and corruption and the introduction of eternal peace, rest and harmony.

    Revelation 21:1-5 locates the fulfillment of this age and relates it to the new earth after the millennium: “And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea. And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God. And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away (or departed). And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.

    If you let Scripture interpret Scripture you will quickly see that the age to come is introduced at the Second Coming, and is expressly perfect pristine and eternal.

    1 Corinthians 15:50-55 declares, flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption (phthora or decay) inherit incorruption (aphthrsia or unending existence). Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory. O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory?”

    This passage closely mirrors Romans 8, confirming that the last enemy is demolished at “the last trump.” Corruption finds it end when Christ comes in all His glory. This corroborates what Paul was teaching about “the bondage of corruption” being terminated when the elect are redeemed at Christ’s appearing. No one can deny the correlation between the glorification of the elect and the glorification of the earth. God’s people cannot populate an incorrupt earth. They need their bodies suitably attired in perfection to be able to enjoy that eternal state.
    "ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free" (John 8:32).

    http://www.evangelicaltruth.com/

    WPM

  4. #4

    Re: Only the elect are "worthy" to obtain the "age to come."

    Quote Originally Posted by wpm View Post
    there is no more death on the future earth and the age to come. This forbids the Premil paradigm.
    One, you're using the word 'paradigm' incorrectly.

    Two, you're employing yet another fallacy in argument: you preclude a Millennium and then say the Millennium is impossible. That's called a circular argument.

    Three, you're on a mission: your agenda is to battle against your old demon: the Millennium. You don't need it so you fight so no one else can have it.

  5. #5

    Re: Only the elect are "worthy" to obtain the "age to come."

    Quote Originally Posted by Marcus O'Reillius View Post
    One, you're using the word 'paradigm' incorrectly.

    Two, you're employing yet another fallacy in argument: you preclude a Millennium and then say the Millennium is impossible. That's called a circular argument.

    Three, you're on a mission: your agenda is to battle against your old demon: the Millennium. You don't need it so you fight so no one else can have it.
    So will you actually address the Scriptures and the attached arguments instead of avoiding the issues - as usual?
    "ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free" (John 8:32).

    http://www.evangelicaltruth.com/

    WPM

  6. #6

    Re: Only the elect are "worthy" to obtain the "age to come."

    .
    Right after you stop fighting with Scripture and include all the passages which conflict with your eschatology.

    I have to get ready for a four-day trip. I have more important things to do than jump at your beck and call. I'm going to go fly a transcon.

    Good luck with tilting at your windmills wpm.

    Fourth point included above: you pick and choose your verses and ignore the rest. Bring it up to you: you throw it away. You refuse to see what you don't want to see.

  7. #7

    Re: Only the elect are "worthy" to obtain the "age to come."

    Quote Originally Posted by Marcus O'Reillius View Post
    .
    Right after you stop fighting with Scripture and include all the passages which conflict with your eschatology.

    I have to get ready for a four-day trip. I have more important things to do than jump at your beck and call. I'm going to go fly a transcon.

    Good luck with tilting at your windmills wpm.

    Fourth point included above: you pick and choose your verses and ignore the rest. Bring it up to you: you throw it away. You refuse to see what you don't want to see.
    You are going to have to start addressing the Scriptures presented that forbid Premil instead of ducking around them and ranting. I will take your avoidance as an admission that you have no rebuttal.
    "ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free" (John 8:32).

    http://www.evangelicaltruth.com/

    WPM

  8. #8
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    Re: Only the elect are "worthy" to obtain the "age to come."

    Quote Originally Posted by wpm View Post
    So will you actually address the Scriptures and the attached arguments instead of avoiding the issues - as usual?
    As if you addressed my objection in posting #2....

  9. #9

    Re: Only the elect are "worthy" to obtain the "age to come."

    Quote Originally Posted by Walls View Post
    As if you addressed my objection in posting #2....
    So why are you replying to my response to Marcus and ignoring my response to you?
    "ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free" (John 8:32).

    http://www.evangelicaltruth.com/

    WPM

  10. #10
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    Re: Only the elect are "worthy" to obtain the "age to come."

    Quote Originally Posted by wpm View Post
    So why are you replying to my response to Marcus and ignoring my response to you?
    Because your response did not address my objection. You know very well that;
    (1) In relation to the New heavens and New Earth Isaiah 65:20 says;
    "There shall be no more thence an infant of days, nor an old man that hath not filled his days: for the child shall die an hundred years old; but the sinner being an hundred years old shall be accursed."
    Is there death here?

    (2) When the Lord comes His judgment will cause tears IN THE KINGDOM. Luke 13:28 says;
    "There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when ye shall see Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, and all the prophets, in the kingdom of God, and you yourselves thrust out."

    (3) The New Covenant that God makes with united Israel is a Covenant of Law, and the death penalty is in the Law.

    (4) The Covenant of the Rainbow, made with all men who were in Noah's loins, requires the death penalty - and this covenant continues, "... While the earth remaineth, seedtime and harvest, and cold and heat, and summer and winter, and day and night shall not cease" (Genesis 8:22). And Isaiah above, within the context of the New Heaven and New Earth, speaks of planting.

    Just because you disagree, does not constitute a response. You must overcome the objection or acquiesce.

    Maybe you are used to using one scripture to defeat another. I cannot dictate what you do with God's Word, but a solid argument RECONCILES scripture. The Millennium reconciles the period between the resurrection of those who "are the Lord's AT HIS COMING" (1st Cor.15:23) and the end when death is swallowed in victory (verses 24-26). The time frame in Revelation 20:4-7 inserts a thousand years between the resurrection of those who are the Lord's and the "rest of the dead".

  11. #11

    Re: Only the elect are "worthy" to obtain the "age to come."

    Quote Originally Posted by Walls View Post
    You have a strange way with language. You say; "... will not experience death", but scripture says "will not die anymore". That is, they did die but it cannot affect them anymore. Otherwise why does the verses end with "children of the resurrection"? Thus, a large part of your argument following is based on a false supposition. And further to that, if "children of the resurrection", then there are those who are NOT resurrected for a further thousand years (Rev.20:5-7). This brings your timing of the New Heavens and New Earth in disrepute immediately as the last enemy - death, is not yet conquered for a further thousand years. So who can then speak of "the eternal state"?

    I think your posting it is a measure of the fallibility of your doctrine. Maybe it is time to consider that those who hold that it is the thousand years that is the reward and not the "eternal state" are correct after all.
    The children of the resurrection begin their eternal resurrection life in this age. And because they have resurrection life, bodily death does not render them without life in Christ. To say "they will not experience death", or "they will not die any more" both accurately describe the children of the resurrection.

    Christ is not speaking of physical corpses when He says, "the hour NOW is, when the dead shall hear the voice".

    John 5:24-27 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life. Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live. For as the Father hath life in himself; so hath he given to the Son to have life in himself; And hath given him authority to execute judgment also, because he is the Son of man.

    These are the children of the resurrection, who having heard His voice have passed from death unto life. Because they have entered into eternal life in this age. Death for them has been swallowed up in victory, for even though their bodies die, they live with Christ now, in this age, and in the age to come they will live with Christ throughout eternity.

  12. #12

    Re: Only the elect are "worthy" to obtain the "age to come."

    Quote Originally Posted by Walls View Post
    Because your response did not address my objection. You know very well that;
    (1) In relation to the New heavens and New Earth Isaiah 65:20 says;
    "There shall be no more thence an infant of days, nor an old man that hath not filled his days: for the child shall die an hundred years old; but the sinner being an hundred years old shall be accursed."
    Is there death here?
    Firstly, does the new heavens and a new earth arrive at the beginning of the millennium or after according to the book of Revelation? This is not a difficult one!!!
    Secondly, how can there be no tears on the new earth and yet still be death? That is nonsensical and absurd.
    Thirdly, let us look at Isaiah 65:20.
    Isaiah 65:17-20 says, “For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind. But be ye glad and rejoice for ever in that which I create: for, behold, I create Jerusalem a rejoicing, and her people a joy. And I will rejoice in Jerusalem, and joy in my people: and the voice of weeping shall be no more heard in her, nor the voice of crying.”

    The one thing we know for sure is that Scripture does not contradict itself in any way. The way some theologians tip-toe round this passage would lead you to believe that this passage is the one exception to this rule in Scripture. Of course we know it isn’t (or can’t). This much-debated passage therefore before us must beautifully correlates with other similar Scripture, which informs us that the Coming of Christ is climactic and that the new earth is totally free of the curse. It is essential that we always interpret difficult passages like this with other clearer and simpler passages.

    Death on the new earth???

    Let us look at the Hebrew in Isaiah 65:20, after all, that is what it was written in:

    Lo'- yihªyeh mishaam `owd `uwl yaamiym wªzaaqeen 'ªsher
    Not become thence more babe days, old man’s after

    What is this telling us?

    Basically: a child will never become old on the new earth.

    lo'- yªmalee''et- yaamaayw Kiy hana`ar ben- mee'aah shaanaah yaamuwt
    Not filled your days like the child old an hundred years die

    This text reinforces what has just been said. It confirms the thought of the impending reality of no more death in the eternal state for the righteous. In eternity there will be no more aging or dying. It is not going to be like our corrupt age where infants eventually get old. It will not be like it is now where a man could live to be an old person of a hundred years of age and then die.

    The new heavens and new earth will indeed be a glorious victorious perfect state where death is unknown. God is saying that the eternal state will actually be free of death for young and old alike.

    The Hebrew word Lo' (Strong’s 3808) meaning “no” or “not.” The word is a simple negation. The word is found twice in this much-debated new heavens and new earth verse. So many Premils have used this to support their doctrine, when in fact it says then opposite to what they are claiming. This passage is telling us that there will be no more death on the new earth!

    No (Lo') longer will an infant become like an old man,
    No
    (Lo') longer will a child reach one hundred and die.

    Death was the awful result of the fall. The curse brought death and decay upon every living organism – including all human life. The good news for man is that the introduction of the new heavens and new earth will witness the elimination of the curse. It will see the final downfall of death on earth. Only the wicked remain in a perpetual state of death – eternal death (the second death) – in the Lake of Fire. Our participation with Christ in His death, burial, and glorious resurrection lifts us from the power, pain and penalty of sin and the second death.

    This reading tries in some way to impress the glory and splendor of the eternal existence within the new heavens and new earth upon the finite human mind. It reinforces the great truth that the curse will be removed. That is hard for us that have been subject to it in this life to fully comprehend.

    Synonymous parallelism


    The repeating of things twice is pervasive in Scripture, especially in the Hebrew Scriptures. Scripture often presents a truth and then immediately re-presents it, only in a slightly different way and from a marginally different angle. This is done to reinforce the truth being expounded. This is called “synonymous parallelism.” It is a grammatical form that involves the repetition of a thought. In
    synonymous parallelism the idea of the second line is a restatement of the idea of the first line. They are set in parallel to give the reader a fuller picture of the particular truth being relayed.

    www.gotquestions.org defines synonymous parallelism: “Synonymous parallelism is a poetic literary device which involves the repetition of one idea in successive lines. The first half of a verse will make a statement, and the second half will essentially say the same thing in different words. The statements are ‘parallel’ in that they are juxtaposed, or side by side, and they often share similar syntax. The statements are ‘synonymous’ in that they say the same thing, with some minor variations.”
    "ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free" (John 8:32).

    http://www.evangelicaltruth.com/

    WPM

  13. #13

    Re: Only the elect are "worthy" to obtain the "age to come."

    Quote Originally Posted by Walls View Post
    (2) When the Lord comes His judgment will cause tears IN THE KINGDOM. Luke 13:28 says;
    "There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when ye shall see Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, and all the prophets, in the kingdom of God, and you yourselves thrust out."
    The wicked???

    The wicked are outside of the kingdom. 1 Corinthians 6:9 confirms: “Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God?”

    They are judged and banished into eternal punishment at Christ's Coming. 1 Corinthians 15:50 declares, flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.” This reading makes plain, “flesh and blood” or mortal believers cannot inherit a glorified earth that has been purified by fire of every last vestige of the curse. Man in his sinful corruptible state cannot inherit an incorruptible regenerated earth. Nothing could be plainer.

    Inheriting the kingdom (Matthew 25:34) is synonymous with inheriting life eternal(Matthew 25:46).

    According to Scripture the ungodly are forbidden from this new glorified earth.

    Psalm 37:9-11 says, "For evildoers shall be cut off: but those that wait upon the LORD, they shall inherit the earth. For yet a little while, and the wicked shall not be: yea, thou shalt diligently consider his place, and it shall not be. But the meek shall inherit the earth; and shall delight themselves in the abundance of peace."

    The meek alone possess the new earth - those that have been redeemed by His precious blood.

    Tears???

    Actually Revelation 21:4 confirms: "And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away."

    (3) The New Covenant that God makes with united Israel is a Covenant of Law, and the death penalty is in the Law.
    It was made with God's people Israel in the OT and is applicable to all that believe. We have been grafted into to true Israel in the NT through the blood of Christ and His new covenant. The context of Ephesians 2:10-19 is basically comparing the dark hopeless condition the Gentiles were in before the cross to the liberated enlightened position those who embraced Christ were after the cross. It is only upon conversion that our sins are washed away and the blood of Jesus becomes effectual. Through Calvary, the believing Gentile has been brought into a new dominion and therefore enjoys a new citizenship, with its consequential new benefits. The believing Gentile has been given favour with God and has now fully entered into:

    • Christ
    • The citizenship of Israel
    • The covenants of promise
    • Spiritual hope
    • Union with God in this present world


    This passage is speaking of five distinct, yet inextricably linked, states of alienation that the Gentile believer once suffered before they received the glorious Gospel of Christ. Paul the Apostle makes it clear that all five have been graciously opened up to the Gentiles since Christ’s first advent. The Gentile believer can now experience God in the same way the Jew could prior to the cross through their surrender to Christ and their trust in “the blood of Christ.”

    (4) The Covenant of the Rainbow, made with all men who were in Noah's loins, requires the death penalty - and this covenant continues, "... While the earth remaineth, seedtime and harvest, and cold and heat, and summer and winter, and day and night shall not cease" (Genesis 8:22). And Isaiah above, within the context of the New Heaven and New Earth, speaks of planting.

    Just because you disagree, does not constitute a response. You must overcome the objection or acquiesce.

    Maybe you are used to using one scripture to defeat another. I cannot dictate what you do with God's Word, but a solid argument RECONCILES scripture. The Millennium reconciles the period between the resurrection of those who "are the Lord's AT HIS COMING" (1st Cor.15:23) and the end when death is swallowed in victory (verses 24-26). The time frame in Revelation 20:4-7 inserts a thousand years between the resurrection of those who are the Lord's and the "rest of the dead".
    What are you actually saying here? It doesn't make sense. Contrary to what you imagine, the age to come is not sin-cursed, goat-infested, and death-blighted but rather perfect and curse free.
    "ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free" (John 8:32).

    http://www.evangelicaltruth.com/

    WPM

  14. #14
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    Re: Only the elect are "worthy" to obtain the "age to come."

    Regarding the scriptures presented in the OP, where do we get the notion that there are 2 resurrections seperated by a thousand years?
    Perhaps you only get this idea from Rev 20....something that the thessalonican church new nothing about.

    Paul commends them on their growing love and perseverance as they endure afflication by Gospel rejectors.....with a view to God pouring out his righteous judgment on those afflicters when Jesus returns in a flame of fire, seperating them from all who have believed forever.

    Jesus said exactly the same thing in Matt 25 regarding what he will do when he comes..
    Their is nothing to suggest that this seperation will last a very very long time.

    In fact it happens suddenly..., in a twinkling....,at a certain hour when all in the tomb will hear his vioce and rise to either glorification or eternal seperation.

    The time for becoming a child of the resurrection " NOW IS".. and all who have been born again look forward to coming out of the tomb to inherit the redemption of our body....a NHNE where only the righteous will dwell.

    Today is the day of salvation, Gods patience, that none perish but are rather saved in these times of amazing Grace.
    And those castles made of sand....fall into the sea......eventually

  15. #15
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    Re: Only the elect are "worthy" to obtain the "age to come."

    Quote Originally Posted by RogerW View Post
    The children of the resurrection begin their eternal resurrection life in this age. And because they have resurrection life, bodily death does not render them without life in Christ. To say "they will not experience death", or "they will not die any more" both accurately describe the children of the resurrection.
    Then it is as i said in posting #2. You have a strange way with language. How, pray tell us, does someone who "will not experience death" be "resurrected"?

    And later you write;

    These are the children of the resurrection, who having heard His voice have passed from death unto life. Because they have entered into eternal life in this age. Death for them has been swallowed up in victory, for even though their bodies die, they live with Christ now, in this age, and in the age to come they will live with Christ throughout eternity.
    But the issue in your first posting was "children of the resurrection". Resurrection has to do with a body dead and returned to the elements being enlivened again. Your first posting does not address the enlivening of the spirit of man at rebirth.

    If we can get past that logic, maybe we can go further.

    Christ is not speaking of physical corpses when He says, "the hour NOW is, when the dead shall hear the voice".
    But resurrection has to do with corpses! You did not produce this scripture from John in your initial posting. You introduced "children of the resurrection" attaining to the next age from Luke, and then go on to say that they "will not experience death." I have seldom seen such befuddlement.

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