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Thread: the wound of the beast

  1. #16
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    Re: the wound of the beast

    Quote Originally Posted by randyk View Post
    But that then renders all of the prophecy "unuseable" for Christians in the 1st century, let alone for Christians all through the ages. How then would this be useful as a "revelation" to Christians all through the ages, if all it is about is speculation for the future?

    That's my point. Something about the "wound of the beast" had to be valuable in John's day, as well as in our own day. We have to either know that the Beast can be killed, or we have to be warned that though he is killed, that can't stop him! Which is it?

    In the days of the Roman Empire the Christians had their own "beast" in imperial Rome. Caesar was their Antichrist! So what would the "wounding of the beast" mean with that particular application? "Was it about the fact that assassinating a Caesar would not stop him? Or, was it about God's guarantee that Caesar's rule would indeed be fatally wounded in the end?

    In reality, this seems to discourage the idea that Caesar, or Antichrist, can be assassinated. Or it may be a guarantee that the Roman Empire, in its day, would not ultimately prevail--it would be fatally wounded, even before the endtime Antichrist arises.
    In John's day God received a mortal head wound.......... Jesus. He was also the was, is not, yet is. He received a wound yet lived.

    Thus the readers thoughout history should be able relate and understand Satan it to counterfeit this event for deception. John describes this so we can know and understand the deception.

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    Re: the wound of the beast

    Let's also not forget the only ONE of the heads was wounded. The beast himself was not killed.

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    Re: the wound of the beast

    Quote Originally Posted by randyk View Post
    There are probably many threads on this, but I wish to briefly revisit it with my own spin. Do you think of Bible Prophecy as a kind of "crystal ball" session? Should we get all emotional about the news like some Prophecy Teachers, thinking that Antichrist is under every rock, or can be tagged on any current irreligious world leader?

    So what about the wound of the Beast? Do you think John meant for Christians in his time to read this, and then start speculating about who the Beast was, and whether he would be "wounded" in some particular way? Or, was John referring to something that was currently understandable, and perhaps even applicable?

    What would the "wound of the beast" mean to John? Would it be some future Antichrist rising up at the end of the age, and then being struck down dead, only to rise again? Though that's possible, it doesn't seem consistent to me with biblical prophecy overall. Most biblical prophecy has a current application, even if the fulfillment of the prophecy is future.

    So how could the "wound of the beast" be applied in John's day? We *know* the Antichrist would be long after John's day, and still has not come yet!

    I think John meant for Christians in his day to see applications of antichrist in their own day, in the same figure of the future Antichrist. They had to deal with persecution in their own day, and with the need to endure. They had to deal with the antichristian persecution of the Roman Empire.

    What then was the "wound of the beast?" It would be a blow struck against the current "antichrist," which was Rome. It would be a blow against the imperial power of Rome, whether something done against Rome spiritually and legally at the cross, or physically, in 476 AD, when Rome was defeated.

    In other words, seeing the wound of the Beast as a future event, with Antichrist physically struck down, does not seem to be the biblical method in prophecy. It is not about news sensationalism, or trying to pinpoint prophecies on current events, on a particular identification, on a particular act of murder, with an accompanying miracle.

    Rather, the method of biblical prophecy is to instruct Christians *in all generations.* What do you think?
    100 percent spot on with one exception brother. The timing of the Mortal Wound isn't about when Rome fades, losses its dominion per se, even though they do eventually lose dominion. Its about Israel, as much of the bible is, all of the Beasts had a commonality unto them, they enslaved, ruled or Conquered Israel.

    I think the Mortal Wound happens when Rome disperses Israel around the world circa 70-125 AD. Its this big seven headed Beast (WORLD POWERS over Israel), and as one head conquers the other it continues on over Israel, until one day there is no Israel, then there is no Beast, because how can there be, there is no Israel to Beast over. CATCH 22. So that, IMHO, is when the Mortal Wound takes place. The Anti-Christ Conquering Jerusalem heals that Mortal Wound of the Seven Headed Beast. It lay dormant or as dead for some odd 2000 years. Then God brought Israel back to life as per His servant Ezekiel's prophecy (1948), then and only then could there be a Beast come forth, and this man (Anti-Christ) will do just that and Conquer Jerusalem/Israel for 42 months.

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    Re: the wound of the beast

    Quote Originally Posted by ross3421 View Post
    In John's day God received a mortal head wound.......... Jesus. He was also the was, is not, yet is. He received a wound yet lived.

    Thus the readers thoughout history should be able relate and understand Satan it to counterfeit this event for deception. John describes this so we can know and understand the deception.
    So the purpose of the Antichrist is to show Christians that he is a counterfeit Christ? That would mean, I assume, that instead of dying to atone for sins Antichrist is rising from the dead to show his seeming power over death?

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    Re: the wound of the beast

    Quote Originally Posted by ross3421 View Post
    Let's also not forget the only ONE of the heads was wounded. The beast himself was not killed.
    So that would mean that one of a string of kings could be actually killed, and yet live on through a successor? I suppose that would impress the world if defeating one king would result in yet another king of the same kind?

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    Re: the wound of the beast

    Quote Originally Posted by Revelation Man View Post
    100 percent spot on with one exception brother. The timing of the Mortal Wound isn't about when Rome fades, losses its dominion per se, even though they do eventually lose dominion. Its about Israel, as much of the bible is, all of the Beasts had a commonality unto them, they enslaved, ruled or Conquered Israel.

    I think the Mortal Wound happens when Tome disperses Israel around the world circa 70-125 AD. Its this big seven headed Beast (WORLD POWERS over Israel), and as one head conquers the other it continues on, over Israel, until one day there is no Israel, then there is no Beast, because how can there be, there is no Israel to Beast over. CATCH 22. So that, IMHO, is when the Mortal Wound takes place. The Anti-Christ Conquering Jerusalem heals that Mortal Wound of the Seven Headed Beast. It lay dormant or as dead for 2000 years. When God brought Israel back to life as per His servant Ezekiel's prophecy (1948), then and only then could there be a Beast come forth, it this man will do just that and Conquer Jerusalem/Israel for 42 months.
    Yes, I can see your logic here. Israel has disappeared for a long time, as has Israel's conqueror, Rome. But in modern times Israel has reemerged, and apparently so will her tormentor? Who do you think her tormentor will be?

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    Re: the wound of the beast

    Quote Originally Posted by randyk View Post
    Yes, I can see your logic here. Israel has disappeared for a long time, as has Israel's conqueror, Rome. But in modern times Israel has reemerged, and apparently so will her tormentor? Who do you think her tormentor will be?
    I had to tidy up my spelling there a we bit, was eating this morning.

    Yes, she is alive again, and thus the Beast can reemerge again also.

    In Dan. 11:36-45 we are told he is the King of the North. We are also told the King of the South pushes at him. Then we are told about the Anti-Christ conquering much of North Africa. I think the King of the South is the MANY spoken of in Dan. 8:25 and 9:27 that makes a Covenant (agreement) with him, its probably Turkey, Saudi Arabia, Qatar, and much of North Africa. The King of the North will thus be a MAN born in Greece (Hence the lineage shown in Dan. 11 has a purpose) via Dan. 8, but who comes to power via the E.U. as it says in Dan. ch. 7 (or out of the Fourth Beasts Territory/HEAD).

    That also fits with Dan. ch. 8 where it says he attacks (pushes) toward the South, the East and towards Israel. I look at a map and Europe is Northwest of Israel and the Mediterranean Sea Region. It fits the explanation of where he pushes or attacks from.

    Dan. 8:9 And out of one of them came forth a little horn, which waxed exceeding great, toward the south, and toward the east, and toward the pleasant land.

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    Re: the wound of the beast

    Quote Originally Posted by marty fox View Post

    I see the near fatal wound in the empire as Rome when Rome was almost destroyed after Nero's death in the year of four Caesars. The Roman historian Tacitus describes this season as the worst time in the history of Rome in the cavil wars between different leaders who were fighting for the throne until Vespasian took control and revived the empire from near death

    You then have to make all all of that work with the following parts.

    1...and all the world wondered after the beast(The revived Roman Empire).

    2...And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast(The revived Roman Empire).

    3...and power was given him(The revived Roman Empire) over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.

    4...And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him(The revived Roman Empire), whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

    5...And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon.
    And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him(The revived Roman Empire), and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast(The revived Roman Empire), whose deadly wound was healed. And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men, And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast(The revived Roman Empire); saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast(The revived Roman Empire), which had the wound by a sword, and did live.
    And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast(The revived Roman Empire), that the image of the beast(The revived Roman Empire) should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast(The revived Roman Empire) should be killed.



    These parts prove you are making up stuff as you go along, because if the beast is meaning the Roman Empire 2000 years ago, that conclusion makes nonsense of the text above. But let's assume it were the Roman Empire. None of your Preterist conclusions fit any of the
    5 things above though. None of the the 5 things above was true 2000 years ago. There wasn't a 2nd beast who was deceiving those on the earth at the time with false wonders, etc. 2000 years ago all of the wonders and miracles were legit and of God and not of satan instead.

    I have read enough of your posts over the years to know that you are capable of being reasonable when you want to be. For some reason though, you're not wanting to be reasonable here. I have been saying this forever, and if only other folks would do this. Whatever one concludes this or that means, simply insert that conclusion into the text, then see wherther the text is making sense or nonsense.

    Such as...


    And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth 2000 years ago; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon.
    And he exerciseth all the power of the revived Roman Empire 2000 years ago before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the revived Roman Empire 2000 years ago, whose deadly wound was healed. And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men 2000 years ago, And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the revived Roman Empire 2000 years ago; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the the revived Roman Empire 2000 years ago, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.


    Marty, get a clue. There is not a single thing in Rev 13 that was fulfilled 2000 years ago. And the part about doing the fake wonders in the sight of the first beast proves it. Until one of the heads on the first beast is healed of a deadly wound, there can't yet be a 2nd beast doing fake wonders in the sight of the first beast, who's deadly wound was healed.

    Even though I may not have all of the answers myself, I still have enough sense to know when someone is wrong about something. Let's get serious here and not waste our time chasing Preterist theories about Rev 13.

    According to Revelation 17 we see this about the beast in Rev 13.

    Revelation 17:8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.

    At the time John wrote this, he indicates the beast was. Then he indicates it is not. And finally he indicates it yet is. Past=was, Present=and is not, future=and yet is. Assuming that is correct, that would be meaning during John's day. And if folks would consider Babylon, maybe this fits the beast. After all, Rev 18 has quite a bit to say about Babylon.

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    Re: the wound of the beast

    Quote Originally Posted by Revelation Man View Post
    I had to tidy up my spelling there a we bit, was eating this morning.

    Yes, she is alive again, and thus the Beast can reemerge again also.

    In Dan. 11:36-45 we are told he is the King of the North. We are also told the King of the South pushes at him. Then we are told about the Anti-Christ conquering much of North Africa. I think the King of the South is the MANY spoken of in Dan. 8:25 and 9:27 that makes a Covenant (agreement) with him, its probably Turkey, Saudi Arabia, Qatar, and much of North Africa. The King of the North will thus be a MAN born in Greece (Hence the lineage shown in Dan. 11 has a purpose) via Dan. 8, but who comes to power via the E.U. as it says in Dan. ch. 7 (or out of the Fourth Beasts Territory/HEAD).

    That also fits with Dan. ch. 8 where it says he attacks (pushes) toward the South, the East and towards Israel. I look at a map and Europe is Northwest of Israel and the Mediterranean Sea Region. It fits the explanation of where he pushes or attacks from.

    Dan. 8:9 And out of one of them came forth a little horn, which waxed exceeding great, toward the south, and toward the east, and toward the pleasant land.
    Well, then I have a problem with that, because I believe Dan 8 and 11 focuses primarily on Antiochus 4, and not on Antichrist. Nevertheless, at one time I made a big deal of seeing Dan 8 and 11 as *symbolic* of the Antichrist. So perhaps there is something to your views? I remain open...

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    Re: the wound of the beast

    Quote Originally Posted by divaD View Post
    You then have to make all all of that work with the following parts.

    1...and all the world wondered after the beast(The revived Roman Empire).

    2...And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast(The revived Roman Empire).

    3...and power was given him(The revived Roman Empire) over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.

    4...And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him(The revived Roman Empire), whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

    5...And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon.
    And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him(The revived Roman Empire), and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast(The revived Roman Empire), whose deadly wound was healed. And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men, And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast(The revived Roman Empire); saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast(The revived Roman Empire), which had the wound by a sword, and did live.
    And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast(The revived Roman Empire), that the image of the beast(The revived Roman Empire) should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast(The revived Roman Empire) should be killed.



    These parts prove you are making up stuff as you go along, because if the beast is meaning the Roman Empire 2000 years ago, that conclusion makes nonsense of the text above. But let's assume it were the Roman Empire. None of your Preterist conclusions fit any of the
    5 things above though. None of the the 5 things above was true 2000 years ago. There wasn't a 2nd beast who was deceiving those on the earth at the time with false wonders, etc. 2000 years ago all of the wonders and miracles were legit and of God and not of satan instead.

    I have read enough of your posts over the years to know that you are capable of being reasonable when you want to be. For some reason though, you're not wanting to be reasonable here. I have been saying this forever, and if only other folks would do this. Whatever one concludes this or that means, simply insert that conclusion into the text, then see wherther the text is making sense or nonsense.

    Such as...


    And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth 2000 years ago; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon.
    And he exerciseth all the power of the revived Roman Empire 2000 years ago before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the revived Roman Empire 2000 years ago, whose deadly wound was healed. And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men 2000 years ago, And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the revived Roman Empire 2000 years ago; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the the revived Roman Empire 2000 years ago, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.


    Marty, get a clue. There is not a single thing in Rev 13 that was fulfilled 2000 years ago. And the part about doing the fake wonders in the sight of the first beast proves it. Until one of the heads on the first beast is healed of a deadly wound, there can't yet be a 2nd beast doing fake wonders in the sight of the first beast, who's deadly wound was healed.

    Even though I may not have all of the answers myself, I still have enough sense to know when someone is wrong about something. Let's get serious here and not waste our time chasing Preterist theories about Rev 13.

    According to Revelation 17 we see this about the beast in Rev 13.

    Revelation 17:8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.

    At the time John wrote this, he indicates the beast was. Then he indicates it is not. And finally he indicates it yet is. Past=was, Present=and is not, future=and yet is. Assuming that is correct, that would be meaning during John's day. And if folks would consider Babylon, maybe this fits the beast. After all, Rev 18 has quite a bit to say about Babylon.
    This is why I am *not* to be called a Preterist! I agree with you that Rev 13-14 have a *future fulfillment,* that it could *not* have been fulfilled in the ancient Roman Empire. But I can, however, identify with Marty in the sense that I believe Rev 13-14 was written *for the time in which Christians lived under the Roman Empire!* And this is *very significant,* I think. Have you thought about this?

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    Re: the wound of the beast

    Quote Originally Posted by randyk View Post
    This is why I am *not* to be called a Preterist! I agree with you that Rev 13-14 have a *future fulfillment,* that it could *not* have been fulfilled in the ancient Roman Empire. But I can, however, identify with Marty in the sense that I believe Rev 13-14 was written *for the time in which Christians lived under the Roman Empire!* And this is *very significant,* I think. Have you thought about this?
    I haven't thought about it because I'm apparently not grasping what you are getting at. I have no idea what you mean here. Take prophecies in the OT about Christ, for example. Clearly Christ wouldn't even be here physically until well beyond their day and time. Using an example like this, can you show me how that would have been significant for those who wouldn't even be alive to witness the first coming, let alone the 2nd coming?

    As to the deadly wound in Revelation 13, how could that possibly be applicable to anyone 2000 years ago if this deadly wound is still yet to be healed?

    If the beast that was, and is not, and yet is, is meaning the Roman empire, that would have to mean when John received and wrote the visions, at that present time the Roman empire was in the past but not in the present, and will be revived in the future. Marty's view is that Revelation was written prior to 70 AD. For the sake of argument, let's say we agree with that conclusion. That conclusion can't fit the text then, because in John's day, who or whatever is meant by the beast, it's not existing in the present, but instead is in the bottomless pit, apparently.

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    Re: the wound of the beast

    Quote Originally Posted by randyk View Post
    This is why I am *not* to be called a Preterist! I agree with you that Rev 13-14 have a *future fulfillment,* that it could *not* have been fulfilled in the ancient Roman Empire. But I can, however, identify with Marty in the sense that I believe Rev 13-14 was written *for the time in which Christians lived under the Roman Empire!* And this is *very significant,* I think. Have you thought about this?
    Revelation 13 mentions 42 months. There can only be one 42 month period, not multiple ones. This 42 month period has to be followed by the 2nd coming and not a 2000 year gap then the 2nd coming. With this in mind as well, I have no clue what you or Marty is getting at.

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    Re: the wound of the beast

    Quote Originally Posted by divaD View Post
    You then have to make all all of that work with the following parts.

    1...and all the world wondered after the beast(The revived Roman Empire).

    2...And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast(The revived Roman Empire).

    3...and power was given him(The revived Roman Empire) over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.

    4...And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him(The revived Roman Empire), whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

    5...And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon.
    And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him(The revived Roman Empire), and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast(The revived Roman Empire), whose deadly wound was healed. And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men, And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast(The revived Roman Empire); saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast(The revived Roman Empire), which had the wound by a sword, and did live.
    And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast(The revived Roman Empire), that the image of the beast(The revived Roman Empire) should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast(The revived Roman Empire) should be killed.



    These parts prove you are making up stuff as you go along, because if the beast is meaning the Roman Empire 2000 years ago, that conclusion makes nonsense of the text above. But let's assume it were the Roman Empire. None of your Preterist conclusions fit any of the
    5 things above though. None of the the 5 things above was true 2000 years ago. There wasn't a 2nd beast who was deceiving those on the earth at the time with false wonders, etc. 2000 years ago all of the wonders and miracles were legit and of God and not of satan instead.

    I have read enough of your posts over the years to know that you are capable of being reasonable when you want to be. For some reason though, you're not wanting to be reasonable here. I have been saying this forever, and if only other folks would do this. Whatever one concludes this or that means, simply insert that conclusion into the text, then see wherther the text is making sense or nonsense.

    Such as...


    And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth 2000 years ago; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon.
    And he exerciseth all the power of the revived Roman Empire 2000 years ago before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the revived Roman Empire 2000 years ago, whose deadly wound was healed. And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men 2000 years ago, And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the revived Roman Empire 2000 years ago; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the the revived Roman Empire 2000 years ago, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.


    Marty, get a clue. There is not a single thing in Rev 13 that was fulfilled 2000 years ago. And the part about doing the fake wonders in the sight of the first beast proves it. Until one of the heads on the first beast is healed of a deadly wound, there can't yet be a 2nd beast doing fake wonders in the sight of the first beast, who's deadly wound was healed.

    Even though I may not have all of the answers myself, I still have enough sense to know when someone is wrong about something. Let's get serious here and not waste our time chasing Preterist theories about Rev 13.

    According to Revelation 17 we see this about the beast in Rev 13.

    Revelation 17:8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.

    At the time John wrote this, he indicates the beast was. Then he indicates it is not. And finally he indicates it yet is. Past=was, Present=and is not, future=and yet is. Assuming that is correct, that would be meaning during John's day. And if folks would consider Babylon, maybe this fits the beast. After all, Rev 18 has quite a bit to say about Babylon.
    If you saw my post #37 on your identity of the beast thread it would explain some of this.

    As I stated the beast is not just the revived roman empire but a demon influencing its leaders. This demon was in John's past was not at the time of the writing of Revelation but was soon to come out of the abbyss.

    Here are some answers

    1...and all the world wondered after the beast(The revived Roman Empire).


    Now was the whole world always meaning the whole world in the bible? Not according to the verses below but just the area the people were living in.

    John 12:19
    So the Pharisees said to one another, "See, this is getting us nowhere. Look how the whole world has gone after him!"

    John 18:20
    20 “I have spoken openly to the world,” Jesus replied. “I always taught in synagogues or at the temple, where all the Jews come together. I said nothing in secret.

    2...And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast(The revived Roman Empire).

    Again a demon and Romes leaders and the Roman people worshiped the Cesar's which unknowingly to them was worshiping satan

    3...and power was given him(The revived Roman Empire) over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.

    Cesar was the lord over many different nations

    4...And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him(The revived Roman Empire), whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

    Same answer as above

    I will post my study on the false prophet below which explains my view of your number 5 point

    A case for the false prophet being apostate Israel

    Does the bible shows us that the Beast out of the earth also known the false prophet is apostate Israel?

    I believe the false prophet was a demon controlling apostate Israel in the first century.

    A false prophet would have to come through Israel where the true prophets came from and its purpose is to divert the Jews away from the Messiah. The false prophet is the only beast in the bible who is described as a clean animal which would represent Israel

    The false prophet along with the beast were cast into the lake of fire alive this doesn't happen to people all people will be judged before being cast into the lake of fire. We do see that satan who we know is a demon will be cast into the lake of fire alive in the future.

    The false prophet along with the beast out of the sea (who I believe is a demon in control of Rome and its leaders in the first century) and satan makeup the unholy trinity. I believe the unholy trinity's purpose was to turn the Jews away from Jesus thier Messiah and have the people kill Him. What could of been a more important task for Satan to do?

    A description of the false prophet
    Revelation 13:11
    Then I saw a second beast, coming out of the earth. He has 2 horns like a lamb but speaks like a dragon he looks gentle but he is evil.

    How did Jesus describe false prophets and who did He say false prophets were?

    Jesus talking about the Pharisees and describes them in
    Matthew 7:15
    Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves.
    Jesus above links the false prophet to the Pharisees

    Rev 13:13-16
    13 And he doth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men,14 And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live. 15 The second beast was given power to give breath to the image of the first beast, so that the image could speak and cause all who refused to worship the image to be killed. 16 It also forced all people, great and small, rich and poor, free and slave, to receive a mark on their right hands or on their foreheads,

    Mosses warned us about this in.

    Deuteronomy 13:1-3
    If a prophet, or one who foretells by dreams, appears among you and announces to you a sign or wonder, 2 and if the sign or wonder spoken of takes place, and the prophet says, “Let us follow other gods” (gods you have not known) “and let us worship them,” 3 you must not listen to the words of that prophet or dreamer. The Lord your God is testing you to find out whether you love him with all your heart and with all your soul

    Mosses above also links false prophets to the Jews

    The false prophet is of Satan and Jesus said this about the Jewish leadership in

    John 8:44
    44 You belong to your father, the devil, and you want to carry out your father’s desires. He was a murderer from the beginning, not holding to the truth, for there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks his native language, for he is a liar and the father of lies

    Jesus above links the Pharisees to satan.

    The false prophet gave power to the beast (Rome) when they had the people say "we have no king but Caesar". They received the symbolic mark on their forehead and hand by being devoted to Rome and doing its will.

    Who could be more evil than the Pharisees who's job it was to reveal the Messiah to the Jews but instead persuaded the Jews to reject and kill Him? They turned their people away from their true King (God) and had the people call Cesar their king that is the true definition of a false prophet.

    Although not every event of the second beast is exhausted with apostate Israel it was the main purpose of the second beast and he did was very successful but God still has a plan

  14. #29
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    Re: the wound of the beast

    Quote Originally Posted by randyk View Post
    So the purpose of the Antichrist is to show Christians that he is a counterfeit Christ?
    Yes. ALA second coming......

    That would mean, I assume, that instead of dying to atone for sins Antichrist is rising from the dead to show his seeming power over death?
    No.

    Jesus was on earth, is not (now in heaven), yet is (second coming). Not "yet lives" my bad.

    Satan was on earth, is not (thrown in hell rev 12), Yet is (rises up Rev 13 aka second coming counterfeit).

  15. #30
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    Re: the wound of the beast

    Quote Originally Posted by randyk View Post
    So that would mean that one of a string of kings could be actually killed, and yet live on through a successor? I suppose that would impress the world if defeating one king would result in yet another king of the same kind?
    You start with an incorrect premise that the kings are in succesion.....I know that is the common thought but all these kings, 4 beasts, 7 heads rise up together and are of one kingdom. Just like the 4 beasts and the 7 angels in God's kingdom.

    Babylon
    MP
    Greece

    They above are not 3 of the 4 beasts.

    4th kingdom = one kingdom with four beasts rise up together

    Lion Head 1
    Bear Head 2
    Leopard Heads 3 4 5 6
    Beast Head 7

    Little horn = 8th head

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