Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 18

Thread: Revelation & history part 3

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Pitt Meadows b.c.
    Posts
    4,177
    Blog Entries
    2

    Revelation & history part 3

    Part 3

    Revelation 12:6
    6 The woman fled into the wilderness to a place prepared for her by God, where she might be taken care of for 1,260 days.

    History
    The first christian Jews had 3 1/2 years of protection until the Jewish persecution broke out on the day Stephen was killed

    Acts 7:57-60---Acts 8:1-3
    57 At this they covered their ears and, yelling at the top of their voices, they all rushed at him, 58 dragged him out of the city and began to stone him. Meanwhile, the witnesses laid their coats at the feet of a young man named Saul.
    59 While they were stoning him, Stephen prayed, “Lord Jesus, receive my spirit.” 60 Then he fell on his knees and cried out, “Lord, do not hold this sin against them.” When he had said this, he fell asleep.

    Acts 8:1-3
    1On that day a great persecution broke out against the church in Jerusalem, and all except the apostles were scattered throughout Judea and Samaria. 2 Godly men buried Stephen and mourned deeply for him. 3 But Saul began to destroy the church. Going from house to house, he dragged off both men and women and put them in prison.


    Could it just be a coincidence?

    https://bibleforums.org/showthread.p...history-part-4

  2. #2
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    New Zealand
    Posts
    2,683
    Blog Entries
    4

    Re: Revelation & history part 3

    Well the ‘woman’ represents the true ‘Israel of God’. Whether that means the persecution following Stephan, or not, I’m not sure.
    "Your name and renown
    is the desire of our hearts."
    (Isaiah 26:8)

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Posts
    8,534
    Blog Entries
    1

    Re: Revelation & history part 3

    As it wasn't 3.5 years before persecution started so it is a false connection.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Location
    Pacific NW, USA
    Posts
    9,015

    Re: Revelation & history part 3

    Quote Originally Posted by marty fox View Post
    Part 3

    Revelation 12:6
    6 The woman fled into the wilderness to a place prepared for her by God, where she might be taken care of for 1,260 days.

    History
    The first christian Jews had 3 1/2 years of protection until the Jewish persecution broke out on the day Stephen was killed

    Acts 7:57-60---Acts 8:1-3
    57 At this they covered their ears and, yelling at the top of their voices, they all rushed at him, 58 dragged him out of the city and began to stone him. Meanwhile, the witnesses laid their coats at the feet of a young man named Saul.
    59 While they were stoning him, Stephen prayed, “Lord Jesus, receive my spirit.” 60 Then he fell on his knees and cried out, “Lord, do not hold this sin against them.” When he had said this, he fell asleep.

    Acts 8:1-3
    1On that day a great persecution broke out against the church in Jerusalem, and all except the apostles were scattered throughout Judea and Samaria. 2 Godly men buried Stephen and mourned deeply for him. 3 But Saul began to destroy the church. Going from house to house, he dragged off both men and women and put them in prison.


    Could it just be a coincidence?

    https://bibleforums.org/showthread.p...history-part-4
    3.5 years are also associated with the Reign of Antichrist in Dan 7. The Woman may be Israel preserved from the Antichrist in the land of Israel in the endtimes.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Pitt Meadows b.c.
    Posts
    4,177
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: Revelation & history part 3

    Quote Originally Posted by ForHisglory View Post
    As it wasn't 3.5 years before persecution started so it is a false connection.
    References I have looked into states difference

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Posts
    8,534
    Blog Entries
    1

    Re: Revelation & history part 3

    Quote Originally Posted by marty fox View Post
    References I have looked into states difference
    And...
    We can claim all sorts of things. You need to state when your 3.5 years starts and when it ends.
    Then we can see if your references claim is correct.
    It was approximately 3 years between Jesus' death and the time when Stephen was martyred.
    In Acts 5 though, BEFORE Stephen was martyred, the apostles were flogged, so persecution started before that event.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Outside of the box. Where else?
    Posts
    17,694

    Re: Revelation & history part 3

    Quote Originally Posted by ForHisglory View Post
    And...
    We can claim all sorts of things. You need to state when your 3.5 years starts and when it ends.
    Then we can see if your references claim is correct.
    It was approximately 3 years between Jesus' death and the time when Stephen was martyred.
    In Acts 5 though, BEFORE Stephen was martyred, the apostles were flogged, so persecution started before that event.
    If one is treating the 3.5 years in the literal sense, it has to be exactly 3.5 years then. Not a day more, not a day less. Exactly 3.5 years in full. Approximations and close only counts in horseshoes and hand grenades.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Posts
    8,534
    Blog Entries
    1

    Re: Revelation & history part 3

    Quote Originally Posted by divaD View Post
    If one is treating the 3.5 years in the literal sense, it has to be exactly 3.5 years then. Not a day more, not a day less. Exactly 3.5 years in full. Approximations and close only counts in horseshoes and hand grenades.
    Personally if God says 3 and a half years, then I wouldn't be looking to the exact day, but to the mid point of a year, ie in the 6th month of the year, like in June or whatever from when it started.
    So if they count from the crucifixion, which was Passover, then 6 months later is Tishri and the Feast of booths.
    I expect though that Marty will have Jesus crucified in 30 AD and so the persecution starts in 33 AD.
    This is driven not by facts, but by the need for the 70 weeks to be completed.
    The problem is we aren't told which month Stephen was martyred, and are we to take that as the start of persecution or the earlier event when the apostles are flogged?
    Maybe slightly after when Saul goes about rounding everyone up - or maybe later yet when he goes to Damascus.
    It is a nebulous claim.
    I believe Jesus was crucified in 34 AD, and Stephen was martyred before Passover 37 AD, which is less than 3 years. If you think crucifixion was 33 AD, then the earliest is the end of 36 AD, which is closer to 3 and 3/4 years.
    The reason for this is because Pontius Pilate and Ananias were both on the scene (along with Herod) and so they wouldn't have killed anyone without Pilate allowing it - note what happened for the death of Jesus. When Pilate was gone though then there was a power vacuum for Ananias also left, and the new governor didn't come to Jerusalem.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Pitt Meadows b.c.
    Posts
    4,177
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: Revelation & history part 3

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyberseeker View Post
    Well the ‘woman’ represents the true ‘Israel of God’. Whether that means the persecution following Stephan, or not, I’m not sure.
    But the saints are her other offspring

    Revelation 12:17
    17 Then the dragon was enraged at the woman and went off to wage war against the rest of her offspring—those who keep God’s commands and hold fast their testimony about Jesus.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Pitt Meadows b.c.
    Posts
    4,177
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: Revelation & history part 3

    Quote Originally Posted by ForHisglory View Post
    And...
    We can claim all sorts of things. You need to state when your 3.5 years starts and when it ends.
    Then we can see if your references claim is correct.
    It was approximately 3 years between Jesus' death and the time when Stephen was martyred.
    In Acts 5 though, BEFORE Stephen was martyred, the apostles were flogged, so persecution started before that event.
    I am meaning the persecuting onto death which was the reason most Christians left Jerusalem

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Posts
    8,534
    Blog Entries
    1

    Re: Revelation & history part 3

    Quote Originally Posted by marty fox View Post
    I am meaning the persecuting onto death which was the reason most Christians left Jerusalem
    It is an interesting claim - did all the church scatter?
    On the face of it, all but the apostles left - yet is that the correct meaning Luke wants to give?
    After all we have thousands of believers at this point in time. In Acts 4:4 it is more than 5,000 in Jerusalem it would seem.
    Now many had already returned home, from Pentecost events and brought the gospel.
    This is why Saul wanted to go to Damascus and get rid of the Christians there too.

    IOW many Christians had gone BEFORE persecution unto death had started, and more went after, yet there also remained such a large number that there were thousands in Jerusalem years later when Paul came for the Passover (Acts 21:20).

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Pitt Meadows b.c.
    Posts
    4,177
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: Revelation & history part 3

    Quote Originally Posted by ForHisglory View Post
    It is an interesting claim - did all the church scatter?
    On the face of it, all but the apostles left - yet is that the correct meaning Luke wants to give?
    After all we have thousands of believers at this point in time. In Acts 4:4 it is more than 5,000 in Jerusalem it would seem.
    Now many had already returned home, from Pentecost events and brought the gospel.
    This is why Saul wanted to go to Damascus and get rid of the Christians there too.

    IOW many Christians had gone BEFORE persecution unto death had started, and more went after, yet there also remained such a large number that there were thousands in Jerusalem years later when Paul came for the Passover (Acts 21:20).
    I have no idea what you are trying to argue I didn't say all I said most and I go with what the verse below says

    Acts 8:1-3
    1On that day a great persecution broke out against the church in Jerusalem, and all except the apostles were scattered throughout Judea and Samaria. 2 Godly men buried Stephen and mourned deeply for him. 3 But Saul began to destroy the church. Going from house to house, he dragged off both men and women and put them in prison.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    3,346
    Blog Entries
    21

    Re: Revelation & history part 3

    If in this passage the woman/church is the Jerusalem church core... then that makes Saul and the Sanhedrin the dragon. I'm not sure what the flood from the dragon's mouth would be....

    I'm not throwing out this idea, but if we expand our understanding of Revelation based on this, does Revelation enlighten our understanding of history further, or does it confuse things. If there are not clear associations between the first century church and all the symbols of Revelation 12, it will not hold up well.
    As the "thief" in the night, Christ is going to suddenly appear on the throne of Israel - not the antichrist.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Posts
    8,534
    Blog Entries
    1

    Re: Revelation & history part 3

    Quote Originally Posted by marty fox View Post
    I have no idea what you are trying to argue I didn't say all I said most and I go with what the verse below says

    Acts 8:1-3
    1On that day a great persecution broke out against the church in Jerusalem, and all except the apostles were scattered throughout Judea and Samaria. 2 Godly men buried Stephen and mourned deeply for him. 3 But Saul began to destroy the church. Going from house to house, he dragged off both men and women and put them in prison.
    I was highlighting that we need to read more than a verse in isolation.
    We need to know the story around it and what the author is emphasising.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Outside of the box. Where else?
    Posts
    17,694

    Re: Revelation & history part 3

    Quote Originally Posted by ForHisglory View Post
    Personally if God says 3 and a half years, then I wouldn't be looking to the exact day, but to the mid point of a year, ie in the 6th month of the year, like in June or whatever from when it started.
    So if they count from the crucifixion, which was Passover, then 6 months later is Tishri and the Feast of booths.
    I expect though that Marty will have Jesus crucified in 30 AD and so the persecution starts in 33 AD.
    This is driven not by facts, but by the need for the 70 weeks to be completed.
    The problem is we aren't told which month Stephen was martyred, and are we to take that as the start of persecution or the earlier event when the apostles are flogged?
    Maybe slightly after when Saul goes about rounding everyone up - or maybe later yet when he goes to Damascus.
    It is a nebulous claim.
    I believe Jesus was crucified in 34 AD, and Stephen was martyred before Passover 37 AD, which is less than 3 years. If you think crucifixion was 33 AD, then the earliest is the end of 36 AD, which is closer to 3 and 3/4 years.
    The reason for this is because Pontius Pilate and Ananias were both on the scene (along with Herod) and so they wouldn't have killed anyone without Pilate allowing it - note what happened for the death of Jesus. When Pilate was gone though then there was a power vacuum for Ananias also left, and the new governor didn't come to Jerusalem.
    There is another possibility. The 3.5 years are not meaning literally the amount specified but instead are symbolizing something. What could it be symbolizing? 1/2 of the 70th week, perhaps?

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. Information Revelation & history part 4
    By marty fox in forum End Times Chat
    Replies: 25
    Last Post: Jun 26th 2018, 04:38 AM
  2. Information Revelation & history part 2
    By marty fox in forum End Times Chat
    Replies: 24
    Last Post: May 18th 2018, 02:56 PM
  3. Information Revelation & history part 5
    By marty fox in forum End Times Chat
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: May 18th 2018, 06:09 AM
  4. Information Revelation & history part 1
    By marty fox in forum End Times Chat
    Replies: 13
    Last Post: May 17th 2018, 04:48 AM
  5. Information Revelation & history part 6
    By marty fox in forum End Times Chat
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: May 17th 2018, 04:22 AM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •