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Thread: ezekiel's temple #1000

  1. #61
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    Re: ezekiel's temple #1000

    Quote Originally Posted by Walls View Post
    OK. I quit!

    It was not me who said that the Law would NOT pass in any point UNTIL heaven and earth passed. Since heaven and earth pass AFTER the Millennium, the Law, by decree of Jesus Christ, REMAINS! The Covenant of which it made up the CONDITIONS is REPLACED, but the CONDITIONS - the Law, do not.

    The Law ALWAYS applied to "UNBELIEVERS". Israel is given, and has the Law, AND IS IN UNBELIEF!
    My thought was that the Law was always only for believers.

    Exo 19.3 Then Moses went up to God, and the Lord called to him from the mountain and said, “This is what you are to say to the descendants of Jacob and what you are to tell the people of Israel: 4 ‘You yourselves have seen what I did to Egypt, and how I carried you on eagles’ wings and brought you to myself. 5 Now if you obey me fully and keep my covenant, then out of all nations you will be my treasured possession. Although the whole earth is mine, 6 you will be for me a kingdom of priests and a holy nation.’ These are the words you are to speak to the Israelites.”
    7 So Moses went back and summoned the elders of the people and set before them all the words the Lord had commanded him to speak. 8 The people all responded together, “We will do everything the Lord has said.” So Moses brought their answer back to the Lord.


    Quote Originally Posted by Walls
    How many times did I say that Christ's death took the sins of the whole world away, and how many times did I quote John 1:29 and 2nd John 2:2 - and you still make a statement like this!

    Nevertheless, God bless (genuinely)
    Thankyou. However, I wasn't disagreeing with your notion that Christ died for the sins of the whole world. Rather, I was taking issue with your idea that the Ezekiel temple will be reconstituted to provide, under the Law of Moses, a legal means of cleansing the flesh. And I was saying that "cleansing the flesh" of unbelievers not only makes no sense to me, but it even makes less sense to say that their flesh is cleansed without removing their sin!

  2. #62
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    Re: ezekiel's temple #1000

    Quote Originally Posted by randyk View Post
    My thought was that the Law was always only for believers.

    Exo 19.3 Then Moses went up to God, and the Lord called to him from the mountain and said, “This is what you are to say to the descendants of Jacob and what you are to tell the people of Israel: 4 ‘You yourselves have seen what I did to Egypt, and how I carried you on eagles’ wings and brought you to myself. 5 Now if you obey me fully and keep my covenant, then out of all nations you will be my treasured possession. Although the whole earth is mine, 6 you will be for me a kingdom of priests and a holy nation.’ These are the words you are to speak to the Israelites.”
    7 So Moses went back and summoned the elders of the people and set before them all the words the Lord had commanded him to speak. 8 The people all responded together, “We will do everything the Lord has said.” So Moses brought their answer back to the Lord.
    An empty vow is not belief. Within days of saying this they had built the Golden Calf. From Hebrews 3:12 to 4:11 the word "UN-belief" is applied to Israel in the wilderness FOUR TIMES. This is not UNBELIEF in Jesus. This is plain faithlessness in all the things of God to which they were witness.

    Quote Originally Posted by randyk View Post
    Thankyou. However, I wasn't disagreeing with your notion that Christ died for the sins of the whole world. Rather, I was taking issue with your idea that the Ezekiel temple will be reconstituted to provide, under the Law of Moses, a legal means of cleansing the flesh. And I was saying that "cleansing the flesh" of unbelievers not only makes no sense to me, but it even makes less sense to say that their flesh is cleansed without removing their sin!
    The Temple of Ezekiel will NOT "be reconstituted to provide, under the Law of Moses, a legal means of cleansing the flesh." It is (i) The House of God to which the nations will gather for prayer (Isa.2:2-3, 56:7 Mic.4:2; Mk.11:17), (ii) the House of God for Emmanuel to live in, (iii) the House of God to reflect the completed work of Christ.* THE OFFERINGS ARE THERE FOR THE CLEANSING OF THE FLESH - NOT THE TEMPLE!

    My esteemed brother, I am aware that you, and most probably your Church, have never set out to study why from Chapter 40 of Ezekiel so much detail is given to a House that has never been built. It is Chapter after Chapter of design, measurements and service by the order of Zadok. It is obviously future for such a House with those measurements and design has never yet stood in Jerusalem. One cannot "spiritualize it away" because too many things are real things. I challenge you to take your time and do a treatise - just for yourself, which satisfies all the verses of thes closing Chapters of Ezekiel. The starting point is easy. Since it describes a House, and it pointedly says that the Lord will live in it, and His glory will fill it, and the Priesthood will serve Him, WHEN WILL THIS BE! And if it be future, then why are the OFFERINGS present?

    * For instance, the Tabernacle, Temple of Solomon and that of Zerubbabel had the CURTAIN dividing the Holy Place from the Holy of Holies. It was a "Death Curtain" akin to the fiery sword of Eden. Anyone, except Aaron, who tried to go trough that curtain was slain on the spot. In Ezekiel's Temple there is no Curtain. The first THREE Houses of God housed a Holy God Who could not be approached. The House of Ezekiel is designed that Emmanuel MUST be approached. Israel and all nations must visit and have audience. The curtain is gone - torn from top to bottom indicating that God did it.

  3. #63
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    Re: ezekiel's temple #1000

    The prophecies of the prophets of Israel can be divided into three sections. They are;
    1. Israel - you are being naughty. Mend your ways
    2. Israel - I know you will not mend your ways so disgrace, dispersion and discipline will be your portion
    3. Israel - God loves you and will restore you for both His love's sake and because of His Promises to the Fathers

    But Ezekiel goes further than this. Ezekiel touches that part of God's heart that is very important. That is, His House and the Testimony it brought Him among the nations. Israel had been exceedingly evil and had behaved worse than the heathen nations around them. Even the heathen never swapped their gods, but Israel has swapped the Living and True God for demon-idols. Israel, as per the threats of the Contract of Sinai, was about to be invaded by Nebuchadnezzar, have their City and Temple destroyed, be slaughtered and be carried off to Babylon to serve foreign kings. One thing remained to be done before Nebuchadnezzar entered Jerusalem and defiled and destroyed it. That was, God was to withdraw from the Temple in which He dwelt. This was for two reasons. God's holiness could not tolerate the heathen entering into the same place as He, and if they did, Nebuchadnezzar would have been slain like Uzzah in 2nd Samuel 6. God needed Nebuchadnezzar for further things concerning His glory, so before the Babylonian army could enter Jerusalem, God withdrew His glory from the Temple - His House. This utterly sad event takes up the first few Chapters.

    This is a low point for such a great God. From this moment on, with His House and Testimony gone from earth, God is called, throughout the Book of Daniel, which encompasses the time in Babylon, the "God of heaven", but never the "God of earth". His House and Presence WERE GONE. This solemn matter is dealt with by Ezekiel. Ezekiel is divided roughly into FOUR sections;
    1. The withdrawal of God and His glory from Solomon's Temple - His House
    2. The accusations against Israel that brought about this tragic move
    3. The Promises of Israel's future restoration
    4. The Promise of a return to a greater glory for the House of God predicted in the latter Chapters

    Chapters 37 to 39 give detailed prophecies of Israel's restoration and end with Armageddon at the end of Chapter 39. Then the visions make an abrupt change. They now concern them selves with God's New House. Immediately the Christian will OBJECT. Is not the Church the House of God? And does God live in a House made with hands? The answer is that God's original intention was that man would eat of the Tree of Life and become the HOUSE of God. And since God is a Spirit, He would dwell in the sanctity of the spirit of man. This He finally achieves in the Church. But ... in the process of recovering man, God did TWO things;
    1. He dwelt WITH them to have His presence on earth, and for this a House of a special construction was needed
    2. He caused the Second Person of the God-head to become a Man, and this Man, Jesus, was physical and needed a physical Dwelling

    During His first sojourn on earth, this God-Man Jesus had nowhere to dwell (Matt.8:20; Lk.9:28). His rightful place as God would have been the Temple in Jerusalem, but He is driven from there under threat of death by the rulers of Israel. But at the end of the age, this God-Man will become the ordained, accepted and anointed King of the whole earth by military defeat of His enemies. The question is then, "WHERE WILL HE LIVE PHYSICALLY, AND OF WHAT TYPE WILL HIS HOUSE BE?

    Ezekiel answers this. The House in which Emmanuel (God with us) will live must fulfill a number of qualifications.
    • It must be in Jerusalem
    • It must be a Palace fit for the greatest King ever to live
    • It must be a House that reflects the accomplishments of this great King
    • It must be a House that allows the correct service to such an Holy One
    • It must be a House that everyone of every nation can come up to to pray, worship and have audience with Emmanuel

    Now, Jesus, having set aside His high position in heaven, and having come to earth to serve His Father and serve men, took a very low and humble position. He was devoid of money and dwelling. He was ministered to by women. He was threatened, rejected, reviled, beaten, spat upon, insulted and finally murdered among criminals, naked. This was all done to achieve what His Father needed done to satisfy His righteousness and extend mercy to depraved mankind. So when God sends His Son the second time as military Commander to retake Government of this earth, in His righteousness and justice HE MUST VINDICATE HIS SON IN PROPORTION TO WHAT HE LOST THE FIRST TIME. And part of this vindication is;
    • His personal glory. It is so strong that it can dethrone and cast away the Beast who was the most powerful man on earth (2nd Thess.2:8)
    • His House. The House that the Man Jesus will live in must reflect Who He is and what He has done
    • That men must bow to Him in worship IN HIS PRESENCE AND OUT OF IT (Phil.2:10)

    And this last point necessitates that men who enter His physical presence, like Aaron and all following High Priests did all those years, (i) have their sins put away, and (ii) be cleansed from the defiled flesh. Aaron and his line of High Priests had the Altar and the Laver in the OUTER COURT on and in the which they had to fulfill sacrifice and washing. One for sins and one for uncleanness. The Christian is no different EXCEPT that BECAUSE HE BELIEVES IN THE PERSON AND WORK OF CHRIST, he has BOTH done for Him by Jesus. But the nation of Israel and the nations REFUSED CHRIST. Fortunately, their sin and sins are put away by Christ BUT THEY WERE NEVER WASHED BY CHRIST. Our example of Judas is unequivocal. Judas lived side by side with Jesus for 3½ years and yet did not believe in Him. So when our Lord Jesus washed the disciples in John 13, Judas remained UNCLEAN. That is, UNBELIEVERS ARE UNCLEAN, even if their sins are put away. And if UNCLEAN, THEN THEY NEED TO BE CLEANSED BEFORE AUDIENCE WITH THE GREAT AND HOLY GOD-MAN JESUS IN JERUSALEM EVERY YEAR.

    Now, in the Law of Moses, the requirements for CLEANSING Aaron for audience with God are laid down. They worked! Aaron was not ever slain despite the utter danger of entering the Holy of Holies. And God has decided that this procedure which He ordained for the cleansing of the FLESH is valid UNTIL HEAVEN AND EARTH PASS. After the heaven and earth have passed at the end of the Millennium, all men will have resurrected bodies. 1st Corinthians 15:42 tells us of the corrupted body; "So also is the resurrection of the dead. It (the body) is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption" That is, after the introduction of the Renewed Earth THE CLEANSING OF THE BODY IS NO LONGER NEED. ALL BODIES OF ALL MEN ARE IN INCORRUPTION. SO THE LAW WITH ITS ANIMAL SACRIFICES WILL PASS THEN. Then a different order will reign. The men who have been consigned to the Lake of Fire are regarded as UNCLEAN, and they will not be allowed audience with Jesus. Even a cursory look at Revelation 21:24-27 shows the change of regime.

    24 "And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it (New Jerusalem): and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it.
    25 And the gates of it shall not be shut at all by day: for there shall be no night there.
    26 And they shall bring the glory and honour of the nations into it.
    27 And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life."


    The process on the Renewed Earth is the SAME as the Millennium EXCEPT that all bodies are incorruptible. But those not written in the Book of Life, and who went to the Lake of Fire, are regarded as UNCLEAN and may not have audience with Christ and God. That is why they are called "CARCASSES" in Isaiah 66:24 - to depict their eternal unworthiness to have audience with God.

  4. #64

    Re: ezekiel's temple #1000

    Quote Originally Posted by Soldier_of_Faith View Post
    I think of New Jerusalem the same way we represent the people as a nation here in America. Together, all citizens of USA make up the nation. In the same manner, the City of New Jerusalem is made up of its inhabited people. But the Wall is not made of people literally, and the gates are not the Apostles literally...
    I agree.

    Quote Originally Posted by Soldier_of_Faith View Post
    1 Cor 3:16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? 17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.

    Ephesians 2:19 Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God; 20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone; 21 In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord: 22 In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit.

    This theology is being used by some to exclude a future LITERAL temple. (some exclude the millennial temple, and some the one that is coming before that, and some all temples all together...)
    I think differences in how Christians see these prophecies can be reconciled by understanding that a spiritual temple is represented by literal things. We have no problem understanding in a spiritual way God's detailed instruction to Moses
    in building the tabernacle. (Heb.8:5) It isn't a mystery to us that when Jesus is called the cornerstone, he isn't really a block of marble.

    Quote Originally Posted by Soldier_of_Faith View Post
    ALL TOGETHER IN Christ (as a Body) we are indeed, a temple, a city, a Bride, and many other conglomerate collections. But just because we are, does not mean that a physical Temple and city can not exist AS WELL...

    The Ezekiel Temple will exist, because if not, God is a liar.
    I think it will exist too, only I think Jesus is building it now and when he returns in person it's complete.

  5. #65
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    Re: ezekiel's temple #1000

    Ezekiel 45:16 All the people of the land shall give this oblation for the prince in Israel.


    If meaning post the 2nd coming, who would be meant here as the prince in Israel at that time?


    Ezekiel 48:11 It shall be for the priests that are sanctified of the sons of Zadok; which have kept my charge, which went not astray when the children of Israel went astray, as the Levites went astray.

    Obviously these priests meant here are already long dead and gone by now. And if this is supposed to be meaning post the 2nd coming, maybe the following is supposed to explain things then?? but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.(Rev 20:6)??

  6. #66
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    Re: ezekiel's temple #1000

    Quote Originally Posted by Keraz View Post
    Also, all the peoples who join themselves to the Lord, who serve Him and love His Name, all who keep the Sabbath unprofained and who take hold of My [New] Covenant. These, I shall bring to My Holy place and give them joy in My House of prayer. Their burnt offerings and sacrifices will be accepted on My Altar, for My House shall be called the House of Prayer for all the nations.

    That it makes no sense to you, is explained by Isaiah 55:8
    Wow, kind of presumptuous to add a word to the bible, don't you think? Especially a word like that? Changes the whole meaning of the verse.
    "For a small moment have I forsaken you, and with great mercy will I gather you.With a little wrath did I hide My countenance for a moment from you, and with everlasting kindness will I have compassion on you," said your Redeemer, the Lord."..."For the mountains shall depart and the hills totter, but My kindness shall not depart from you, neither shall the covenant of My peace totter," says the Lord, Who has compassion on you.

    Isaiah 54

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    Re: ezekiel's temple #1000

    Quote Originally Posted by journeyman View Post
    I think it will exist too, only I think Jesus is building it now and when he returns in person it's complete.
    Blessing Brother,

    I have a hard time with saying Christ is building a "temple" in heaven right now. On the other hand I will agree He is building a city. Here is why:

    1) there is already a Temple in Heaven... Jesus Does not need to build one up there...

    Psalm 11:4 The Lord is in his holy temple, the Lord's throne is in heaven: his eyes behold, his eyelids try, the children of men. That same Temple is seen in the end times: Revelation 11:19 And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail.

    The response to this might be "Well, Jesus needs to build one for the New Jerusalem that will come down to earth."

    2) Christ will build places to live in the Heavenly City, which can not be a temple, because there is already a temple in heaven.

    John 14:2 In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. 3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.

    The idea here is dwelling place. And essentially He is preparing the New Jerusalem:

    3) The dwelling Places for the Saints is in the New Jerusalem, and there is CLEARLY no temple in New Jerusalem.

    Rev 21:2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. 3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God... 22 And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it.

    That leaves us with the Spiritual teachings, which we all receive, that tell us our FLESH is our Temple, and the Holy Spirit dwells in that temple. AND, the Church is a Temple wherein Christ Dwells. However, when we die, we loose this temple, and WAIT for a better "temple" (BODY) of Spirit, not flesh. This happens at Christ's appearing, and our Resurrection and the Quickening of the Living.

    1 Cor 6:19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own? 20 For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.

    1 Cor 15:49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.

    2 Cor 5:For we know that if our earthly house of this tabernacle were dissolved, we have a building of God, an house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens. 2 For in this we groan, earnestly desiring to be clothed upon with our house which is from heaven: 3 If so be that being clothed we shall not be found naked. 4 For we that are in this tabernacle do groan, being burdened: not for that we would be unclothed, but clothed upon, that mortality might be swallowed up of life. 5 Now he that hath wrought us for the selfsame thing is God, who also hath given unto us the earnest of the Spirit. 6 Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord: 7 (For we walk by faith, not by sight 8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.

  8. #68

    Re: ezekiel's temple #1000

    Originally posted by Walls
    So when God sends His Son the second time as military Commander to retake Government of this earth, in His righteousness and justice HE MUST VINDICATE HIS SON IN PROPORTION TO WHAT HE LOST THE FIRST TIME.
    Jesus didn't lose anything the first time. He spoiled principalities and powers I don't even fully comprehend. He defeated death. And how? By the holy spirit in the weakness of flesh.

    Doesn't it make sense that Jesus would return and defeat evil in this world by his spirit?

    For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places. Eph.6:12

    Does it make sense that the forces controlling evil mankind, who threw everything they had at Jesus and were defeated by him, are defeated by him in us the same way?

    I heard a well known pastor on the radio yesterday who said, "When Jesus returns, he's going to put an end to evil."

    I understand Jesus will come in person and end all evil, but in the meantime, he is putting an end to evil, because we were evil and aren't anymore.

  9. #69
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    Re: ezekiel's temple #1000

    Quote Originally Posted by journeyman View Post
    Jesus didn't lose anything the first time. He spoiled principalities and powers I don't even fully comprehend. He defeated death. And how? By the holy spirit in the weakness of flesh.

    Doesn't it make sense that Jesus would return and defeat evil in this world by his spirit?

    For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places. Eph.6:12

    Does it make sense that the forces controlling evil mankind, who threw everything they had at Jesus and were defeated by him, are defeated by him in us the same way?

    I heard a well known pastor on the radio yesterday who said, "When Jesus returns, he's going to put an end to evil."

    I understand Jesus will come in person and end all evil, but in the meantime, he is putting an end to evil, because we were evil and aren't anymore.
    I don't know if I agree with Wall's statement "HE MUST VINDICATE HIS SON" either, however I will point out that Jesus did not "defeat" death yet. He OVERCAME it, and Conquered it, but it still exists, so it is not defeated...

    1 Corinthians 15:26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

    Jesus CONQUERED Death, as in put it under His feet, but did not Destroy it.

    Revelation 1:18 I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.

    THIS is the defeat of Death Finally, and has not yet happened:

    Rev 20:11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them. 12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. 13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. 14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. 15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

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    Re: ezekiel's temple #1000

    Quote Originally Posted by Soldier_of_Faith View Post
    3) The dwelling Places for the Saints is in the New Jerusalem, and there is CLEARLY no temple in New Jerusalem.
    I hope you see that "New Jerusalem" is the city proper. The temple is not located within the city walls but in the land given to Judah in the side of the north. Thus the reason for no temple in NJ. This is also the explanation of the following...

    IS 14
    13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:

    EZ 48
    30 And these are the goings out of the city on the north side, four thousand and five hundred measures.
    31 And the gates of the city shall be after the names of the tribes of Israel: three gates northward; one gate of Reuben, one gate of Judah, one gate of Levi.

    8 And by the border of Judah, from the east side unto the west side, shall be the offering which ye shall offer of five and twenty thousand reeds in breadth, and in length as one of the other parts, from the east side unto the west side: and the sanctuary shall be in the midst of it.

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    Re: ezekiel's temple #1000

    Quote Originally Posted by ross3421 View Post
    I hope you see that "New Jerusalem" is the city proper. The temple is not located within the city walls but in the land given to Judah in the side of the north. Thus the reason for no temple in NJ. This is also the explanation of the following...

    IS 14
    13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:

    EZ 48
    30 And these are the goings out of the city on the north side, four thousand and five hundred measures.
    31 And the gates of the city shall be after the names of the tribes of Israel: three gates northward; one gate of Reuben, one gate of Judah, one gate of Levi.

    8 And by the border of Judah, from the east side unto the west side, shall be the offering which ye shall offer of five and twenty thousand reeds in breadth, and in length as one of the other parts, from the east side unto the west side: and the sanctuary shall be in the midst of it.
    There is no need for an External OR internal Temple in the NHNE. Jesus and the Father dwell "IN" the New Jerusalem, and THEY are the Temple. If the temple were outside the City, they would dwell there. The Father MUST dwell IN the temple if it is physical, but it is not, so He IS the Temple Himself.

    In Isaiah 14:13, the mount of the Congregation is the mountain that the city New Jerusalem comes down upon. (It is also the Temple Mount Jesus will reign from for 1000 years...) The temple can not be in that city according to Rev 21:22.

    Ezekiel 48 is the Millennial Kingdom, not the time of the NHNE...

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    Re: ezekiel's temple #1000

    Quote Originally Posted by Soldier_of_Faith View Post
    Ezekiel 48 is the Millennial Kingdom, not the time of the NHNE...
    What if there is no Millennial Kingdom, then what?

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    Re: ezekiel's temple #1000

    Quote Originally Posted by Fenris View Post
    Wow, kind of presumptuous to add a word to the bible, don't you think? Especially a word like that? Changes the whole meaning of the verse.
    Isaiah 56:1-8 is plainly telling us about a future time, when God's Temple will be a House of Prayer for all the nations. Since Jesus has now come and is the Advocate for the New Covenant, then my addition of [New] is applicable.

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    Re: ezekiel's temple #1000

    Quote Originally Posted by Walls View Post
    The prophecies of the prophets of Israel can be divided into three sections. They are;
    1. Israel - you are being naughty. Mend your ways
    2. Israel - I know you will not mend your ways so disgrace, dispersion and discipline will be your portion
    3. Israel - God loves you and will restore you for both His love's sake and because of His Promises to the Fathers

    But Ezekiel goes further than this. Ezekiel touches that part of God's heart that is very important. That is, His House and the Testimony it brought Him among the nations. Israel had been exceedingly evil and had behaved worse than the heathen nations around them. Even the heathen never swapped their gods, but Israel has swapped the Living and True God for demon-idols. Israel, as per the threats of the Contract of Sinai, was about to be invaded by Nebuchadnezzar, have their City and Temple destroyed, be slaughtered and be carried off to Babylon to serve foreign kings. One thing remained to be done before Nebuchadnezzar entered Jerusalem and defiled and destroyed it. That was, God was to withdraw from the Temple in which He dwelt. This was for two reasons. God's holiness could not tolerate the heathen entering into the same place as He, and if they did, Nebuchadnezzar would have been slain like Uzzah in 2nd Samuel 6. God needed Nebuchadnezzar for further things concerning His glory, so before the Babylonian army could enter Jerusalem, God withdrew His glory from the Temple - His House. This utterly sad event takes up the first few Chapters.

    This is a low point for such a great God. From this moment on, with His House and Testimony gone from earth, God is called, throughout the Book of Daniel, which encompasses the time in Babylon, the "God of heaven", but never the "God of earth". His House and Presence WERE GONE. This solemn matter is dealt with by Ezekiel. Ezekiel is divided roughly into FOUR sections;
    1. The withdrawal of God and His glory from Solomon's Temple - His House
    2. The accusations against Israel that brought about this tragic move
    3. The Promises of Israel's future restoration
    4. The Promise of a return to a greater glory for the House of God predicted in the latter Chapters

    Chapters 37 to 39 give detailed prophecies of Israel's restoration and end with Armageddon at the end of Chapter 39. Then the visions make an abrupt change. They now concern them selves with God's New House. Immediately the Christian will OBJECT. Is not the Church the House of God? And does God live in a House made with hands? The answer is that God's original intention was that man would eat of the Tree of Life and become the HOUSE of God. And since God is a Spirit, He would dwell in the sanctity of the spirit of man. This He finally achieves in the Church. But ... in the process of recovering man, God did TWO things;
    1. He dwelt WITH them to have His presence on earth, and for this a House of a special construction was needed
    2. He caused the Second Person of the God-head to become a Man, and this Man, Jesus, was physical and needed a physical Dwelling

    During His first sojourn on earth, this God-Man Jesus had nowhere to dwell (Matt.8:20; Lk.9:28). His rightful place as God would have been the Temple in Jerusalem, but He is driven from there under threat of death by the rulers of Israel. But at the end of the age, this God-Man will become the ordained, accepted and anointed King of the whole earth by military defeat of His enemies. The question is then, "WHERE WILL HE LIVE PHYSICALLY, AND OF WHAT TYPE WILL HIS HOUSE BE?

    Ezekiel answers this. The House in which Emmanuel (God with us) will live must fulfill a number of qualifications.
    • It must be in Jerusalem
    • It must be a Palace fit for the greatest King ever to live
    • It must be a House that reflects the accomplishments of this great King
    • It must be a House that allows the correct service to such an Holy One
    • It must be a House that everyone of every nation can come up to to pray, worship and have audience with Emmanuel

    Now, Jesus, having set aside His high position in heaven, and having come to earth to serve His Father and serve men, took a very low and humble position. He was devoid of money and dwelling. He was ministered to by women. He was threatened, rejected, reviled, beaten, spat upon, insulted and finally murdered among criminals, naked. This was all done to achieve what His Father needed done to satisfy His righteousness and extend mercy to depraved mankind. So when God sends His Son the second time as military Commander to retake Government of this earth, in His righteousness and justice HE MUST VINDICATE HIS SON IN PROPORTION TO WHAT HE LOST THE FIRST TIME. And part of this vindication is;
    • His personal glory. It is so strong that it can dethrone and cast away the Beast who was the most powerful man on earth (2nd Thess.2:8)
    • His House. The House that the Man Jesus will live in must reflect Who He is and what He has done
    • That men must bow to Him in worship IN HIS PRESENCE AND OUT OF IT (Phil.2:10)

    And this last point necessitates that men who enter His physical presence, like Aaron and all following High Priests did all those years, (i) have their sins put away, and (ii) be cleansed from the defiled flesh. Aaron and his line of High Priests had the Altar and the Laver in the OUTER COURT on and in the which they had to fulfill sacrifice and washing. One for sins and one for uncleanness. The Christian is no different EXCEPT that BECAUSE HE BELIEVES IN THE PERSON AND WORK OF CHRIST, he has BOTH done for Him by Jesus. But the nation of Israel and the nations REFUSED CHRIST. Fortunately, their sin and sins are put away by Christ BUT THEY WERE NEVER WASHED BY CHRIST. Our example of Judas is unequivocal. Judas lived side by side with Jesus for 3½ years and yet did not believe in Him. So when our Lord Jesus washed the disciples in John 13, Judas remained UNCLEAN. That is, UNBELIEVERS ARE UNCLEAN, even if their sins are put away. And if UNCLEAN, THEN THEY NEED TO BE CLEANSED BEFORE AUDIENCE WITH THE GREAT AND HOLY GOD-MAN JESUS IN JERUSALEM EVERY YEAR.

    Now, in the Law of Moses, the requirements for CLEANSING Aaron for audience with God are laid down. They worked! Aaron was not ever slain despite the utter danger of entering the Holy of Holies. And God has decided that this procedure which He ordained for the cleansing of the FLESH is valid UNTIL HEAVEN AND EARTH PASS. After the heaven and earth have passed at the end of the Millennium, all men will have resurrected bodies. 1st Corinthians 15:42 tells us of the corrupted body; "So also is the resurrection of the dead. It (the body) is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption" That is, after the introduction of the Renewed Earth THE CLEANSING OF THE BODY IS NO LONGER NEED. ALL BODIES OF ALL MEN ARE IN INCORRUPTION. SO THE LAW WITH ITS ANIMAL SACRIFICES WILL PASS THEN. Then a different order will reign. The men who have been consigned to the Lake of Fire are regarded as UNCLEAN, and they will not be allowed audience with Jesus. Even a cursory look at Revelation 21:24-27 shows the change of regime.

    24 "And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it (New Jerusalem): and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it.
    25 And the gates of it shall not be shut at all by day: for there shall be no night there.
    26 And they shall bring the glory and honour of the nations into it.
    27 And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life."


    The process on the Renewed Earth is the SAME as the Millennium EXCEPT that all bodies are incorruptible. But those not written in the Book of Life, and who went to the Lake of Fire, are regarded as UNCLEAN and may not have audience with Christ and God. That is why they are called "CARCASSES" in Isaiah 66:24 - to depict their eternal unworthiness to have audience with God.
    This is a great dissertation, thanks Walls.
    The only omission I would like to see you address, is the separation of the two Houses of Israel and Judah. They became two peoples and have different destinies.

    Ezekiel's Temple will be built. Why not?
    It is only because people have believed false theories, that they reject a new Temple; it doesn't fit with their wrong beliefs.

  15. #75
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    Re: ezekiel's temple #1000

    Quote Originally Posted by ross3421 View Post
    What if there is no Millennial Kingdom, then what?
    Why disagree with Scripture?

    Look, I understand that the text in Rev 20 does not say exactly that Jesus will sit in the Temple in Jerusalem and reign 1000 years with the Saints that were beheaded for their testimony in Him. Rather it says: 4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years. And this clearly happens AFTER the Wrath of God, and After Armageddon, and DURING Satan's sealing for the same time period.

    What is the issue here really? Do you not accept that there will be 1000 years Christ will reign that has not happened yet (no matter where you think He will reign...)? OR, do you not accept that Jewish belief systems can come back into play upon the earth with temples, sacrifices and the like? OR, is it simply that some or all of this messes with your theology? What is the real issue here for you?

    Top answer you question, if there is no Millennium, then I wont be in heaven with Christ, and there is no hope for any of us, because no scripture is true. All scripture is made up, and God is not real... So then, it WILL exist because I have KNOWN God, and He knows me. I have Seen Jesus and can attest He is real, and He loves you and I very much. I have felt Agape Love, and very few humans have ever felt that (I know of none - actually...) He DOES Exist, and I have seen a real vision of Earth during the Millennium. IT WILL HAPPEN...

    Let me tell you a quick story. When I was 25, I became deathly ill, and was placed in a medically induced coma for "one week". After that week, they could not wake me, and I got worse and worse. The doctor told my wife I had a 7% chance of surviving, and if I did, I would be a vegetable. While I slept, I was taken into the heavens (2nd heavens) and walked with Jesus Himself. he showed me many prophecies, one being the Dragon when he is sealed and cast into the Pit. I saw the DRAGON Himself (even in the form of a Dragon). I saw a great and mighty Angel throw him into the Abyss. I saw the earth below me, as I stood in the heavens above. It was blackened, and burnt. It was deserts and all cities were rubble. I saw as time went by real fast. I saw the waters clear from red and brown to blue. I saw the desert turn to Green forests and grasslands. I also saw great cities rise up all over the earth. Then I saw the great Angel take the Dragon out of the Abyss, and he became a beautiful Angel. He went down to the earth... But I did not see Him from that point. I know according to the Word what happens next though. Rev 20:7-10 happens next.

    I say all this to show that Indeed there are other that still are given prophecy, and I have seen it myself. While recovering from a miraculous awakening from that coma about a month later, I was given a gift from Jesus Himself, the gift of Understanding Prophecy. If I diligently seek the Lord in any Prophecy, and wait on the Holy Spirit, He will show me truth in that text. So, believing I have the Spirit, I say to you and to all, There will be a Millennium with Christ on the Throne in Jerusalem. And the Earth will recover from the great destruction that will be poured out upon it.

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