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Thread: Nephilim

  1. #211

    Re: Nephilim

    Quote Originally Posted by Aristarkos View Post
    No, it is not, it is based on the term son(s) of God in the O.T..

    Aristarkos
    Which you (or someone in this thread) just got done saying (days ago? ) that this phrase is only found in Genesis 6 and Job 1, 2, and 38.

    So my point is to say, that many people conclude [wrongly, I believe] that Job 1 and 2 sound like an UP IN HEAVEN setting (I thoroughly disagree with this conclusion), and therefore conclude that Gen6 must also refer to "angels" (fallen ones).


    When Satan was asked "From whence comest thou?" and he answers "FROM going to and fro [roaming] in the earth, and FROM walking up and down [all over] in it," it does not imply that he has arrived UP IN HEAVEN, just that he has stopped "roaming" (and has settled on one spot in the earth: Job's location).


    By the way, Psalm 2:2 also uses H3320 (just as Job 1:6 and 2:1 do), and that setting is not "up in Heaven" and involves "humans" as well.

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    Re: Nephilim

    Quote Originally Posted by Aristarkos View Post
    Well then supply the Scripture so we all learn something.

    Aristarkos
    1st you claim that I need to believe Scripture and what it says.
    2nd you make a claim upon what Scripture says.
    3rd I disagree with you.
    4th you ask "What Scripture?"

    Fine

    Genesis 6:2-7
    Exodus 4:22-23
    2 Samuel 7:14
    1 Chronicles 17:13
    1 Chronicles 22:10
    1 Chronicles 28:6
    Job 1:6
    Psalm 2:7
    Hosea 1:10
    Jeremiah 31:20

    And that's just the OT. You want all of the NT ones laid out for you too?
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  3. #213
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    Re: Nephilim

    Quote Originally Posted by Aristarkos View Post
    This is a completely other subject, are you sure you want to discuss this here? I've already said it to you before when you brought this up. Does your handkerchief or apron heal people? When a serpent bites you, do you shake it of and just go on with your business? Have you lately raised anybody from the dead? I know the answer is no, so why should our wives wear head cover?
    What have these topics to do with the angelic version of Gen 6?

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    Re: Nephilim

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDivineWatermark View Post
    I, too, disagree... and believe that that is based on the ASSUMPTION that the SETTING of Job 1 and 2 was up IN HEAVEN (which the text does not support that notion).
    why does location matter?

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    Re: Nephilim

    Quote Originally Posted by ProDeo View Post
    See post #208 for answers and if you believe it follow suit and tell women to cover their heads because on a bad day an angel may rape them.
    I haven't made that argument. Nothing you say there pertains to me.

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    Re: Nephilim

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDivineWatermark View Post
    Which you (or someone in this thread) just got done saying (days ago? ) that this phrase is only found in Genesis 6 and Job 1, 2, and 38.

    So my point is to say, that many people conclude [wrongly, I believe] that Job 1 and 2 sound like an UP IN HEAVEN setting (I thoroughly disagree with this conclusion), and therefore conclude that Gen6 must also refer to "angels" (fallen ones).


    When Satan was asked "From whence comest thou?" and he answers "FROM going to and fro [roaming] in the earth, and FROM walking up and down [all over] in it," it does not imply that he has arrived UP IN HEAVEN, just that he has stopped "roaming" (and has settled on one spot in the earth: Job's location).
    good points. Then there's Lucifer. For those that believe he and Satan are one and the same he was on earth with a lot of other creatures of some sort working, before man no doubt. If angels, and who else would they be, they would be "native" to earth as it has been claimed they are not.

  7. #217

    Re: Nephilim

    Quote Originally Posted by Noeb View Post
    why does location matter?
    I added some to my post #211. Read that, and see if that helps you see my point.

    It's that some, when viewing all of the related/similar passages, conclude that one of them MUST be referring to "up in Heaven" [Job1-2 (I don't believe refers to Heaven but on the earth)] that the rest must also be referring to angels/fallen angels rather than to "humans". See that post, and see if you can see where I'm coming from (no pun intended ).


    EDIT: just now seeing your latest post. (I did add a bit more to my post, than what you seem to have quoted here, so... )

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    Re: Nephilim

    Quote Originally Posted by BrianW View Post
    "What Scripture?"

    Fine

    Genesis 6:2-7
    Those are angels according to me and Scripture for that matter.

    Exodus 4:22-23
    This is about the nation of Israel, not a man, they are not called son of God.

    2 Samuel 7:14
    I will be his father, and he shall be my son. , are not called son of God.

    1 Chronicles 17:13
    Same as 2 Sam. 7:14

    1 Chronicles 22:10
    and he shall be my son, and I will be his father , are not called son of God.

    1 Chronicles 28:6
    Same as 1 Chr. 22:10

    Job 1:6
    Here it says Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them . These are clearly angels, not human, which human comes before the Lord while Satan is there? This is even more clear from the next verse where Satans says From going to and fro in the earth .

    Psalm 2:7
    This verse is about Christ, He is the Son of God.

    Hosea 1:10
    This is a prophecy about Israel in the future aion, they are called sons of the living God, therefore are the new creation, not sons of God.

    Jeremiah 31:20
    Is Ephraim my dear son ? Not son of God.

    Where does the term son(s) of God occur in Scripture?

    In Gen. 6:2 That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose .

    Gen. 6:4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown .

    Job 1:6 Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them .

    Job 2:1 Again there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them to present himself before the LORD .

    Job 38:7 When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy ?

    They are all angels, it's that simple. When the earth was put on its place the sons of God shouted for joy, sons of God are angels.

    Aristarkos

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    Re: Nephilim

    Quote Originally Posted by ProDeo View Post
    What have these topics to do with the angelic version of Gen 6?
    I have no idea but you asked the question. You are talking about the church of God that's what Paul talks about in 1 Cor. 11:10. If this still has to be followed now then where are the gifts?

    Aristarkos

  10. #220

    Re: Nephilim

    Quote Originally Posted by Athanasius View Post
    I've already alluded to two instances: one where angels blind the men of Sodom and Gomorrah, and another where an angel slaughters 185,000 Assyrian soldiers. Men aren't capable of these things. Are these examples not in your Bible?
    Of course men are capable of these things. Read the exploits of the sons of Jacob in Jasher...
    Jesus said, "Out of the hardness of your hearts Moses gave a writ of divorce; but from the beginning it was not so." How many more things do you suppose are, "From the beginning, NOT so?"

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    Thumbsup Re: Nephilim

    Wisest comment I ever heard about Genesis 6 was from Norman Geisler. This quote isnt verbatim, but it is accurate to what he said.

    There are four different views about the sons of God in Genesis 6. Ive held all four. So Ive been wrong 75% of the time.

    There really is no room for dogmatic arrogance on this subject. And how would it affect what you or I do today anyway?

    If anyone wants to know the correct view though, PM me and Ill tell you which I hold to.

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    Re: Nephilim

    Quote Originally Posted by Aristarkos View Post
    Those are angels according to me and Scripture for that matter.

    They are all angels, it's that simple. When the earth was put on its place the sons of God shouted for joy, sons of God are angels.

    Aristarkos
    Riiight. Nit pick away and throw context out of the window. Oh well, whatever floats your boat I guess.
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  13. #223
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    Re: Nephilim

    Quote Originally Posted by Falconcheff View Post
    Of course men are capable of these things. Read the exploits of the sons of Jacob in Jasher...
    Not without technology men can't, and that appeal doesn't hold as here I'm comparing the natural ability of humans against the natural ability of angels. We have no reason to suspect that angels don't have this ability, or that their ability derives from technology. An angel can blind a town from within a home, or kill 185,000 soldiers in a night without anyone realizing until morning. We cannot, at least not without the aid of technology.

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    Re: Nephilim

    Quote Originally Posted by Athanasius View Post
    Not without technology men can't, and that appeal doesn't hold as here I'm comparing the natural ability of humans against the natural ability of angels. We have no reason to suspect that angels don't have this ability, or that their ability derives from technology. An angel can blind a town from within a home, or kill 185,000 soldiers in a night without anyone realizing until morning. We cannot, at least not without the aid of technology.
    ability is not connected to nature. Should God decide to make me spirit and a flame of fire like he does angels, no problem. My nature prevents me from being translated from one location to another in an instant, yet it has happened to me.

  15. #225
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    Re: Nephilim

    Quote Originally Posted by Noeb View Post
    ability is not connected to nature. Should God decide to make me spirit and a flame of fire like he does angels, no problem. My nature prevents me from being translated from one location to another in an instant, yet it has happened to me.
    It's pretty obvious you aren't grasping what I mean when I refer to nature (ability is not connected to nature, really? So it's you, not God, who translated you from place to place?), so I'm afraid we're at an impasse. I'll be happy to continue if/when you do, if you're up for it still. This will be my last reply between us for now.

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