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Thread: Exact Dates for the 70th Week

  1. #61
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    Re: Exact Dates for the 70th Week

    Quote Originally Posted by marty fox View Post
    But Gabriel came as an answer to Daniels prayer in the first half of Daniel chapter 9. Daniel knew that the Jews were not repenting so the 7 fold judgement would come upon them and it did. Thus the 70 weeks had to start in 605 BC or the curse of the covenant would not come into effect on those who did not repent-but their grandchildren and great grandchildren-which would violate the principal of the Law of Moses that children pay the price for their parents.

    That should mean 490 years later it would be 115 bc. What was significant about 115 bc in particular?

    I just looked at post #55 after posting this. I'm unable to follow your line of reasoning in that post, unfortunately. All I know is, 490 years later it would be 115 bc if the starting point is 605 bc.

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    Re: Exact Dates for the 70th Week

    Quote Originally Posted by marty fox View Post

    605 B.C.-171 B.C. 62 weeks or 434 years

    587 B.C.-538 B.C. 7 weeks or 49 years

    170/1 B.C.-164/3 B.C. 70th week or 7 years


    First of all the math has to total 490 different years. One can't do that if any of these years are running in parallel.

    You already have 605 B.C.-171 B.C. for the 434 years. 587 B.C.-538 B.C also occurs during 605 B.C.-171 B.C. You can't have those 49 years occurring during this 434 years and expect it to total 490 different years altogether.

    Let's say there were 100 years involved, those being 1900 AD to 2000 AD, and that they are broken down like such. 25 years, 70 years, and 5 years. Let's say the first 25 years started in 1900 AD and ended in 1925 AD. Let's say the 70 years started in 1910 and ended in 1980. And let's say the last 5 years started in 1980 and ended in 1985. Obviously 1985 is not 2000 AD. Obviously 1900 to 1985 is not 100 years, it is only 85 years instead. Obviously this would be the same logic that one would apply to what you are proposing. The math does not work out, thus must be rejected.

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    Re: Exact Dates for the 70th Week

    Cyberseeker,
    I agree completely with your article. I think this prophecy is still unfolding, but has had fulfillment due to historical evidence also. I have often wondered about Daniel 9:24. When it said “to anoint the most Holy”. During the temple times the priest would sprinkle blood on the mercy seat once a year at atonement in Leviticus 16. In Mathew 25 it tells us about the earthquake and the veil being torn. If the earthquake cracked the ground and the ark was sitting below Jesus where it was hidden in that grotto and his blood fell on it, would this not perfectly represent atonement such as the patterns that would have been laid out previously in scripture by anointing the most holy of holy? I don’t think God makes mistakes. I think he would have fulfilled that prophecy perfectly with Jesus blood falling on that mercy seat. I think there will be another fulfillment of the Antichrist. Mark 13. There could be another temple built, but if not we know that WE Are a temple with the Holy Spirit in us. I can also see the AC KILLING THE SAINTS,putting them to death as another AOD. But that is just my opinion and you know what they say about opinions. Have a blessed one.

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    Re: Exact Dates for the 70th Week

    Quote Originally Posted by divaD View Post
    First of all the math has to total 490 different years. One can't do that if any of these years are running in parallel.

    You already have 605 B.C.-171 B.C. for the 434 years. 587 B.C.-538 B.C also occurs during 605 B.C.-171 B.C. You can't have those 49 years occurring during this 434 years and expect it to total 490 different years altogether.

    Let's say there were 100 years involved, those being 1900 AD to 2000 AD, and that they are broken down like such. 25 years, 70 years, and 5 years. Let's say the first 25 years started in 1900 AD and ended in 1925 AD. Let's say the 70 years started in 1910 and ended in 1980. And let's say the last 5 years started in 1980 and ended in 1985. Obviously 1985 is not 2000 AD. Obviously 1900 to 1985 is not 100 years, it is only 85 years instead. Obviously this would be the same logic that one would apply to what you are proposing. The math does not work out, thus must be rejected.
    It doesn't have to be 490 different years it has to be 490 years. Two different prophecy time lines can be at the same time for example Jeremiahs 70 year prophecy ran at the same time as Daniels prophecy about king Neb in chapter 4.

    The reason that Gabriel gave the 70 week prophecy to Daniel was because of Daniels payer in the first half of chapter 9 the people didn't repent so the 70 years then became 70 weeks of years Thus the 70 weeks had to start in 605BC.

    Daniel 9:25
    25 “Know and understand this: From the time the word goes out to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until the Anointed One,[f] the ruler, comes, there will be seven ‘sevens,’ and sixty-two ‘sevens.’ It will be rebuilt with streets and a trench, but in times of trouble.

    So if we use the date of the decree in the verse above as an anchor in time we can understand the time lines

    538 BC King Cyrus issues the decree.

    605BC-171BC 62 weeks Onias 3rd is murdered (cut off and has nothing) the anointed one the last of the Zadokite priesthood the start of the 70th week.

    Zechariah 6:9-15
    9 The word of the Lord came to me: 10 “Take silver and gold from the exiles Heldai, Tobijah and Jedaiah, who have arrived from Babylon. Go the same day to the house of Josiah son of Zephaniah. 11 Take the silver and gold and make a crown, and set it on the head of the high priest, Joshua son of Jozadak.[d] 12 Tell him this is what the Lord Almighty says: ‘Here is the man whose name is the Branch, and he will branch out from his place and build the temple of the Lord. 13 It is he who will build the temple of the Lord, and he will be clothed with majesty and will sit and rule on his throne. And he[e] will be a priest on his throne. And there will be harmony between the two.’ 14 The crown will be given to Heldai,[f] Tobijah, Jedaiah and Hen[g] son of Zephaniah as a memorial in the temple of the Lord. 15 Those who are far away will come and help to build the temple of the Lord, and you will know that the Lord Almighty has sent me to you. This will happen if you diligently obey the Lord your God.”

    We see above that Joshua was the anointed ruler 49 years or 7 weeks before he was anointed was 587 BC when Jerusalem and the temple was destroyed so some of the weeks can happen at the same time as they are not just 70 weeks but 70 weeks of prophecy they are in 3 sets of weeks for a reason.

    Next if we advance 62 1/2 weeks or 437.5 years from 605 BC we come to 167 BC when half way through the 70th week Antiochus Epiphanies desecrates the temple and the Macabean revolt started

    Lastly 164/3 BC Antiochs Epiphanies dies and the temple is rededicated the end of the 70th week

    I can't believe that these dates match up just by coincidence

    On a side note there are 2 different anointed ones one is also the ruler it says that the anointed one will come after 62 & 7 weeks but he is cut off after 62 weeks. How can the anointed one if it is one person come 49 years after he is cut off? This proves that it is two different people. If it is Jesus how could He come 49 years after he dies?

    And let’s not forget that there is no NT mention of Jesus filling any of the 70 weeks


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    Re: Exact Dates for the 70th Week

    Quote Originally Posted by randyk
    Very astute. You're right. John the Baptist likely based his inspired statement on a revelation built on OT prophecies <snip> Dan 9 is quite clear that sin had to be brought to an end and be atoned for 70 Weeks after the decree to rebuild Jerusalem. Apparently this is how John perceived it and stated it. The words are the same, or at worst, very similar.
    Yes, John the Baptist exclaimed, “Behold! The Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world!” (John 1:29). I'm sure he was quoting Daniel’s “Seventy weeks are determined … to make an end of sins!” (Daniel 9:24)

    I often hear people ask why no mention is made of the Seventieth week in the New Testament. But it's actually alluded to in several places. St. Paul also references the Seventieth week.

    This is one of the reasons why I cannot accept countdowns that dont at least try to arrive at Jesus.
    "Your name and renown
    is the desire of our hearts."
    (Isaiah 26:8)

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    Re: Exact Dates for the 70th Week

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyberseeker View Post
    Yes, John the Baptist exclaimed, “Behold! The Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world!” (John 1:29). I'm sure he was quoting Daniel’s “Seventy weeks are determined … to make an end of sins!” (Daniel 9:24)

    I often hear people ask why no mention is made of the Seventieth week in the New Testament. But it's actually alluded to in several places. St. Paul also references the Seventieth week.

    This is one of the reasons why I cannot accept countdowns that dont at least try to arrive at Jesus.
    But on the other hand the NT does state many times when the OT was referred to by saying

    It is written or this was to fulfil what the prophet said

    would you not think that would of been added if that what John was meaning? Could John of not been referring to Jesus replacing lamb sacrifices?
    Last edited by marty fox; Oct 15th 2018 at 01:27 AM. Reason: adden info

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    Re: Exact Dates for the 70th Week

    Matthew was better than John at giving references. Actually, Ive got a few grizzles with John when I get up there.


    But as for your suggestion that John might have been referring to Jesus replacing lamb sacrifices, I don't think so. He talks about the "sin of the WORLD" That is so much bigger than what the Jews were expecting. It was anticipating the inclusion of the Gentiles into the new covenant. Frankly, I cannot see how John the Baptist could have been thinking of anything less than Daniel 9:24.
    "Your name and renown
    is the desire of our hearts."
    (Isaiah 26:8)

  8. #68
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    Re: Exact Dates for the 70th Week

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyberseeker View Post
    Yes, John the Baptist exclaimed, “Behold! The Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world!” (John 1:29). I'm sure he was quoting Daniel’s “Seventy weeks are determined … to make an end of sins!” (Daniel 9:24)

    I often hear people ask why no mention is made of the Seventieth week in the New Testament. But it's actually alluded to in several places. St. Paul also references the Seventieth week.

    This is one of the reasons why I cannot accept countdowns that dont at least try to arrive at Jesus.
    The following are some cross refs for John 1:29. I'm not seeing anything about Daniel 9 at that link.

    https://www.openbible.info/labs/cros...?q=John+1%3A29

  9. #69
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    Re: Exact Dates for the 70th Week

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyberseeker View Post
    Matthew was better than John at giving references. Actually, Ive got a few grizzles with John when I get up there.


    But as for your suggestion that John might have been referring to Jesus replacing lamb sacrifices, I don't think so. He talks about the "sin of the WORLD" That is so much bigger than what the Jews were expecting. It was anticipating the inclusion of the Gentiles into the new covenant. Frankly, I cannot see how John the Baptist could have been thinking of anything less than Daniel 9:24.
    I think -Is 53 was on JTB mind as well as Dan 9

    5
    But He was pierced through for our transgressions,
    He was crushed for our iniquities;
    The chastening for our well-being fell upon Him,
    And by His scourging we are healed.
    6
    All of us like sheep have gone astray,
    Each of us has turned to his own way;
    But the Lord has caused the iniquity of us all
    To fall on Him.
    7
    He was oppressed and He was afflicted,
    Yet He did not open His mouth;
    Like a lamb that is led to slaughter,
    And like a sheep that is silent before its shearers,
    So He did not open His mouth.
    8
    By oppression and judgment He was taken away;
    And as for His generation, who considered
    That He was cut off out of the land of the living
    For the transgression of my people, to whom the stroke was due?


    Etc

    This would make everlasting righteousness possible.
    And those castles made of sand....fall into the sea......eventually

  10. #70
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    Re: Exact Dates for the 70th Week

    Perhaps gen 22 with the promise that God would provide a lamb.


    7 Isaac spoke to Abraham his father and said, “My father!” And he said, “Here I am, my son.” And he said, “Behold, the fire and the wood, but where is the lamb for the burnt offering?” 8 Abraham said, “God will provide for Himself the lamb for the burnt offering, my son.” So the two of them walked on together.

    9 Then they came to the place of which God had told him; and Abraham built the altar there and arranged the wood, and bound his son Isaac and laid him on the altar, on top of the wood. 10 Abraham stretched out his hand and took the knife to slay his son. 11 But the angel of the Lord called to him from heaven and said, “Abraham, Abraham!” And he said, “Here I am.” 12 He said, “Do not stretch out your hand against the lad, and do nothing to him; for now I know that you fear God, since you have not withheld your son, your only son, from Me. 13 Then Abraham raised his eyes and looked, and behold, behind him a ram caught in the thicket by his horns; and Abraham went and took the ram and offered him up for a burnt offering in the place of his son. 14 Abraham called the name of that place The Lord Will Provide, as it is said to this day, “In the mount of the Lord it will be provided.”

    God provided a ram, the lamb of God was yet to come and he did not withhold his own Son from us.
    And those castles made of sand....fall into the sea......eventually

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    Re: Exact Dates for the 70th Week

    Daniel 9:26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.

    In this verse it mentions Messiah. It also mentions the people of the prince that shall come. And it also mentions the prince that shall come. That means the prince that shall come is the last one mentioned in this verse, thus is obviously who verse 27 is referring to.

    And the prince that shall come shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week the prince that shall come shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations the prince that shall come shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

    How in the world can the prince that shall come be meaning Jesus? Obviously the people of Jesus would be Jewish and Gentile Christians if Jesus was meant. One is to believe Christians shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined?

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    Re: Exact Dates for the 70th Week

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyberseeker View Post
    Matthew was better than John at giving references. Actually, Ive got a few grizzles with John when I get up there.


    But as for your suggestion that John might have been referring to Jesus replacing lamb sacrifices, I don't think so. He talks about the "sin of the WORLD" That is so much bigger than what the Jews were expecting. It was anticipating the inclusion of the Gentiles into the new covenant. Frankly, I cannot see how John the Baptist could have been thinking of anything less than Daniel 9:24.
    John was a prophet and saw things that others couldn’t he received the holy sprit while in the womb the holy sprit told him

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    Re: Exact Dates for the 70th Week

    Quote Originally Posted by jeffweeder View Post
    I think -Is 53 was on JTB mind as well as Dan 9

    5
    But He was pierced through for our transgressions,
    He was crushed for our iniquities;
    The chastening for our well-being fell upon Him,
    And by His scourging we are healed.
    6
    All of us like sheep have gone astray,
    Each of us has turned to his own way;
    But the Lord has caused the iniquity of us all
    To fall on Him.
    7
    He was oppressed and He was afflicted,
    Yet He did not open His mouth;
    Like a lamb that is led to slaughter,
    And like a sheep that is silent before its shearers,
    So He did not open His mouth.
    8
    By oppression and judgment He was taken away;
    And as for His generation, who considered
    That He was cut off out of the land of the living
    For the transgression of my people, to whom the stroke was due?


    Etc

    This would make everlasting righteousness possible.
    Definitely Isaiah 53

  14. #74
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    Re: Exact Dates for the 70th Week

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyberseeker View Post
    Yes, John the Baptist exclaimed, “Behold! The Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world!” (John 1:29). I'm sure he was quoting Daniel’s “Seventy weeks are determined … to make an end of sins!” (Daniel 9:24)

    I often hear people ask why no mention is made of the Seventieth week in the New Testament. But it's actually alluded to in several places. St. Paul also references the Seventieth week.

    This is one of the reasons why I cannot accept countdowns that dont at least try to arrive at Jesus.
    You may not accept my view of it, but I believe Jesus actually does reference Daniel 9 in the Olivet Discourse. Jesus said, "As spoken of through the prophet Daniel."

    This, of course, was talking about the "Abomination of Desolation," which I believe is mentioned in Dan 9.27. It is explained in Dan 9.26:
    "After the sixty-two ‘sevens,’ the Anointed One will be put to death and will have nothing. The people of the ruler who will come will destroy the city and the sanctuary. The end will come like a flood: War will continue until the end, and desolations have been decreed."

    So here Jesus is saying that Daniel's 70th Week was to be occasioned by his own death, followed by the destruction of Jerusalem and the temple in 70 AD. The part about his own death is, I believe, an inference, since Jesus had already predicted his death. And he is positioning the judgment of Israel in his own generation to show that it is a rebuke to Israel for rejecting their Messiah.

    Mat 23.37 “Jerusalem, Jerusalem, you who kill the prophets and stone those sent to you,how often I have longed to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, and you were not willing.38 Look, your house is left to you desolate.39 For I tell you, you will not see me again until you say, ‘Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord.’ ”

    Here there is the clear implication, from Dan 9, that Jesus saw himself as the Messiah "cut off" with the temple destruction following.

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    Re: Exact Dates for the 70th Week

    Quote Originally Posted by randyk View Post
    You may not accept my view of it, but I believe Jesus actually does reference Daniel 9 in the Olivet Discourse. Jesus said, "As spoken of through the prophet Daniel."

    This, of course, was talking about the "Abomination of Desolation," which I believe is mentioned in Dan 9.27. It is explained in Dan 9.26:
    "After the sixty-two ‘sevens,’ the Anointed One will be put to death and will have nothing. The people of the ruler who will come will destroy the city and the sanctuary. The end will come like a flood: War will continue until the end, and desolations have been decreed."

    So here Jesus is saying that Daniel's 70th Week was to be occasioned by his own death, followed by the destruction of Jerusalem and the temple in 70 AD. The part about his own death is, I believe, an inference, since Jesus had already predicted his death. And he is positioning the judgment of Israel in his own generation to show that it is a rebuke to Israel for rejecting their Messiah.

    This seems pretty clear to me that Jesus is here identifying himself as the Messiah cut off in Dan 9, with the accompanying judgment of Israel in 70 AD.
    Daniel 9:25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.

    Here are the first 69 weeks. Is there anythng in this verse that occurs outside of this 69 weeks?

    Daniel 9:27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.


    Here is the 70th week. If everything in verse 25 has to occur during that 69 weeks, why wouldn't the same be true of verse 27, that everything in this verse has to occur during this 70th week? Is not the context of verse 25 the first 69 weeks? Is not the context of verse 27 the final week of these 70 weeks?

    One can't have verse 27 being fulfilled at Christ's death and resurrection, and also have some of it fulfilled during 70 AD, without inserting a gap in the 70th week. If a gap between the 69th and 70th week seems illogical to many of you, why doesn't a gap in the 70th week equally seem illogical to many of you? And besides that I thought many of you were arguing for no gap whatsoever in the 70 weeks?

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