Page 1 of 11 1234567891011 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 155

Thread: “About The Great Tribulation”

  1. #1

    “About The Great Tribulation”

    For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.” Matthew 24:21.

    As we begin to discuss about the great tribulation, it is important we first understand the meaning of the keyword ‘tribulation’ as used in the opening text…

    The word translated as ‘tribulation’ in the opening text, is from the Greek word ‘thlipsis’, meaning—pressure. It means pressure—either literally or figuratively. Other synonyms of the word tribulation as translated in the New Testament are: affliction, anguish, burden, persecution, and trouble.

    All through the ages, since the fall of Adam and Eve, mankind has faced several kinds of tribulation and disaster. Some God-made—by his sovereign ideal; some man-made; and some others, devils’-made…

    Even Israel—the chosen nation of God—also went through tribulations from God as a result of their evil deeds. Then the Church of Christ, since her emergence after the death, resurrection and ascension of Christ, has also suffered tribulations, especially in the form of persecution from non-believers.

    But concerning the great tribulation, the Lord tells us in his own words that the great tribulation is a special kind of tribulation. That has never been experienced since the beginning of the world till the time he was speaking…

    And that the great tribulation will not have its kind after it. Many Christian theologians are divided on their understanding and explanation of the great tribulation as mentioned by the Lord. Especially concerning its features and timing. So in this article, we want to see exactly what the scriptures say concerning the great tribulation.

    The Features of the Great Tribulation

    Having already known the meaning of the word ‘tribulation’, the great tribulation can therefore be explained as a period of great and unusual affliction. On the entire world and its inhabitants. And the major features of the great tribulation from scriptures are as follows:


    1. A Period of Great Deception: “For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect”—Matthew 24:24. A major feature of the great tribulation is an unusual emergence of deception.

      Which will be masterminded by the anti-Christ and his false prophet (see 2 Thessallonians2:9-11; Revelation 13:13-15) the bible says the deceptions at the great tribulation will be so strong that if it were possible, the very elect of God shall also be deceived.
    2. A Period of Great Persecution of the Saints: “And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues and nations”—Revelation 13:7 (see also Daniel 8:24).

      Another prominent feature of the great tribulation is an unusual persecution of the Church. Yes, the church and saints of God of all ages have been persecuted and even martyred in large scale. But the persecution of the saints at the great tribulation will be far greater.

      The world will be subjected to many kinds of idolatry and rituals of which anyone that fails to follow suit, will be killed or ostracised (see Revelation 13:12, 14-15).
    3. A Period of God’s Wrath: The final stage of the great tribulation is a period of unusual disaster from God (Revelation 16:1-14). And this last phase of the great tribulation will happen after the rapture of the Church at the second coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. The bible says the true believers will not partake of God’s wrath (1 Thessalonians 5:9).

      To better understand this fact, the words of our Lord Jesus give us an eye-opener. Here are his exact words: “But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. For as in the days that were before the flood, they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered the ark; and knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.”—Matthew 24:37-39.

      So amidst the great tribulation, Christ will come and rapture his church and after that, the remaining inhabitants of the earth will face the wrath of God as it was in the days of Noah.

    Admonishment to the Church Concerning the Great Tribulation

    With the above three features of the great tribulation, it is very clear that the saints or believers will partake of the great tribulation. Especially the periods of great deception and persecution. But the believers will not partake of the last phase of the great tribulation which is the wrath of God or the judgement of God.

    However, concerning the great tribulation, the Lord admonishes the believers thus:

    “Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man”—Luke 21:36.

    From the above scripture, the Lord admonishes us concerning the great tribulation to be watchful and prayerful always. So we may be accounted worthy of escaping the things that shall come to pass at the great tribulation so that in the end, we will be able to stand before him—the Son of man.

    Escape as used in the above scripture, can take either of two forms… Either escaping through death or martyr; or escaping through the rapture at the second coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

    Those who do not escape the great tribulation will be taken in the tribulation. Either they are taken by the great deception or are taken by the great persecution through personal subjection…

    And that is why the Lord admonishes us to be watchful and prayerful always. Because it’s only through these two spiritual tools we would be able to escape the great deception and persecution of the end-time at the great tribulation…

    And finally be able to stand before our Lord and saviour Jesus Christ in paradise forever.

    Remain Blessed!

    Emeke Odili
    Emeke Odili is a Christian Teacher, Preacher, Author, Writer and Blogger. He has a divinely given vision of practically teaching people how to make success in life through absolute righteousness and faith. Emeke is married to his best friend, Joy. He shares life-transforming articles at his blog: www.righteousfaith.wordpress.com

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Durban ,South Africa
    Posts
    7,415

    Re: “About The Great Tribulation”

    What things was the Lord referring to in Luke 21:36?

    34 “Be careful, or your hearts will be weighed down with carousing, drunkenness and the anxieties of life, and that day will close on you suddenly like a trap. 35 For it will come on all those who live on the face of the whole earth. 36 Be always on the watch, and pray that you may be able to escape all that is about to happen, and that you may be able to stand before the Son of Man.”

    Be careful to escape carousing, drunkenness, anxieties.

    Some would like to apply the escape to the entire tribulation. But they are told to endure faithfully without carousing and drunkenness, that they then escape everything without having to endure everything makes no sense.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Posts
    9,138
    Blog Entries
    1

    Re: “About The Great Tribulation”

    Just a couple of points:
    1) 1 Thess 5:9 is NOT about God's wrath on earth, but about His wrath as opposed to salvation. The context means it is about our eternal destiny, and thus about His judgement. However just as Israel was in Egypt when the plagues came, and Noah was in an Ark, and endured the storm for 40 days and then a further period floating around, so we too go through the period of God's wrath. It simply isn't directed at us.
    2) We don't escape through rapture. That isn't us escaping, but of God and so isn't the escape in view here. Nor is it saying you die or are martyred. Instead it is about having the strength to get through ALL the difficulties of the tribulation.

  4. #4

    Re: “About The Great Tribulation”

    Quote Originally Posted by DurbanDude View Post
    What things was the Lord referring to in Luke 21:36?

    34 “Be careful, or your hearts will be weighed down with carousing, drunkenness and the anxieties of life, and that day will close on you suddenly like a trap. 35 For it will come on all those who live on the face of the whole earth. 36 Be always on the watch, and pray that you may be able to escape all that is about to happen, and that you may be able to stand before the Son of Man.”

    Be careful to escape carousing, drunkenness, anxieties.

    Some would like to apply the escape to the entire tribulation. But they are told to endure faithfully without carousing and drunkenness, that they then escape everything without having to endure everything makes no sense.
    If you read the OP carefully I did say the escape takes two forms. Either death or staying through till the coming of Jesus and escaping through the rapture.

    And of course, staying through requires endurance.
    Emeke Odili is a Christian Teacher, Preacher, Author, Writer and Blogger. He has a divinely given vision of practically teaching people how to make success in life through absolute righteousness and faith. Emeke is married to his best friend, Joy. He shares life-transforming articles at his blog: www.righteousfaith.wordpress.com

  5. #5

    Re: “About The Great Tribulation”

    Quote Originally Posted by ForHisglory View Post
    Just a couple of points:
    1) 1 Thess 5:9 is NOT about God's wrath on earth, but about His wrath as opposed to salvation. The context means it is about our eternal destiny, and thus about His judgement. However just as Israel was in Egypt when the plagues came, and Noah was in an Ark, and endured the storm for 40 days and then a further period floating around, so we too go through the period of God's wrath. It simply isn't directed at us.
    2) We don't escape through rapture. That isn't us escaping, but of God and so isn't the escape in view here. Nor is it saying you die or are martyred. Instead it is about having the strength to get through ALL the difficulties of the tribulation.
    Well,

    In the two cases you mentioned-- Israel in Egypt during the plague and Noah in the Ark. If you check very well, you'll see that God had to separate his people before carrying out his action. So where do you think God is going to separate his own to before his wrath?

    Then I am with you when you talk about the strength to get through ALL the difficulties of the tribulation. But its scripturally obvious that the rapture of the saints at the coming of Christ will be the end of the difficulties for those who do wait through till the Lord's return.

    Then after the rapture of the saints to heaven, then the wrath of God can then go on. As was the flood and fire(and brimstone) in the days of Noah and Lot respectively.
    Emeke Odili is a Christian Teacher, Preacher, Author, Writer and Blogger. He has a divinely given vision of practically teaching people how to make success in life through absolute righteousness and faith. Emeke is married to his best friend, Joy. He shares life-transforming articles at his blog: www.righteousfaith.wordpress.com

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Europe
    Posts
    5,411

    Re: “About The Great Tribulation”

    Instead of rebutting certain points, which profit little, I wish to lay down my understanding of the Great Tribulation.

    Since Abel, people who align themselves with God suffer tribulation. The natural, or carnal mind of men is at enmity with God (Rom.8:7) so anyone standing for the things of God will immediately be hated by the rest of men. Next, we have a very powerful angel who is at enmity with God and he adds his portion of tribulation as far as God allows him (see the Book of Job). Next, even in a man who walks after God's precepts, has his flesh to contend with, and this internal war causes much discomfort (Gal.5:17). Our Lord Jesus said that a man involved in denying himself is akin to death (Matt.16:24-25). Finally, God makes it clear that even those He loves and cherishes He disciplines, and that this discipline can be "grievous" (Heb.12:11). So tribulation is the portion of every Godly man. In fact, without it, a Christian cannot be a co-king with Jesus when He returns to set up His Kingdom on earth. Acts 14:22 says; "Confirming the souls of the disciples, and exhorting them to continue in the faith, and that we must through much tribulation enter into the kingdom of God." And 2 Timothy 2:12 confirms it. "If we suffer, we shall also reign with him: if we deny him, he also will deny us."

    But is the above tribulation, which in every case is PERSONAL, THE Great Tribulation? Let scripture show. Romans 2:5-16 addresses NOT the follower of God but His enemy. In it it says ...

    5 "But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;
    6 Who will render to every man according to his deeds
    ...
    8 But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath,
    9 Tribulation and anguish
    , upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile;
    ...
    16 In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel."


    Summarized, this text tells that there is a "day of WRATH" for the ungodly, both Jew and Gentile. It says that God ADMINISTERS INDIGNATION, WRATH, TRIBULATION AND ANGUISH on them. And Romans 1:16-18 says that the gospel is the "power of SALVATION from this wrath" - a, "... wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness."

    And so in the Book of Revelation, which comes from the Greek word "Apokalypsis" and which means "the revealing" or "the UNVEILING", and which deals with the days and their events surrounding the REVEALING of Jesus from Heaven, we read that the WRATH OF GOD is poured out on men. In 13 verses of the Book of Revelation the word "WRATH" appears. And in TEN of them it is the WRATH OF GOD! There have been 6,000 years since Adam, and God has poured out His wrath LOCALLY, like Sodom and Israel. In these 6,000 years Satan has poured out his wrath on men LOCALLY. So also in this time have men poured out their wrath on other men. But ONLY GOD has poured out His WRATH ON THE WHOLE EARTH. He did it at Noah's time and all men save eight died. And He will pour it out again at the end of this age at the "UNVEILING" of His Son Jesus as He returns to earth.

    The verse proffered in the OP was Matthew 24:21; "For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be." This is decisive in one point. The Tribulation experienced in this time will be greater than that of Noah's time. And if verse 22 had been added, "And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened", it would have been noticed that this Tribulation is on ALL FLESH - that is, UNIVERSAL on both man and beast.

    The short of this discourse is that
    1. LOCAL AND PERSONAL TRIBULATION is the portion of every Godly man
    2. LOCAL TRIBULATION like Israel's 3˝ years of drought at Elijah's time can be administered by God
    3. UNIVERSAL TRIBULATION ON ALL FLESH IS ONLY ADMINISTERED BY GOD

    So all that remains to be shown is, "IS THERE AN ESCAPE?" And this question has already been answered above in Romans 1:16; "For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek."

    I am prepared to expound on three proofs that CERTAIN men escape "THE" Great Tribulation. But I would first like to hear from those who DENY any means of escape. Anyone who DENIES an escape from the WRATH of God DENIES THE GOSPEL OF JESUS CHRIST! For what then, do I ask, is the GOSPEL of Jesus Christ? Is the "GOOD NEWS OF JESUS CHRIST" NEWS THAT THE BELIEVER MUST FACE THE WRATH OF GOD?" Is the gospel a "POWER" so IMPOTENT!? Is the accomplished work of Jesus UNABLE TO SAVE a man from GOD'S WRATH? If so, what then is your gospel?

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Kansas City
    Posts
    4,334
    Blog Entries
    1

    Re: “About The Great Tribulation”

    The GT is only 45 maximum days in length. And actually probably much shorter as first folks scatter to the hills ect... The GT is a compressed event which encompasses God's wrath in the 7 vials.

    Dan 12
    11 And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days.

    Matt 24
    15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand
    21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.


    Day 1 (daily sacrifice taken away)----------------Day 1290 (AOD)----------GT-------Day 1335


    So then the events after not before verse 15 are details what occurs during the GT.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Location
    Thames, New Zealand
    Posts
    1,970
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: “About The Great Tribulation”

    Quote Originally Posted by emekrus View Post
    If you read the OP carefully I did say the escape takes two forms. Either death or staying through till the coming of Jesus and escaping through the rapture.

    And of course, staying through requires endurance.
    There is another way. In my Revised English Bible, Luke 21:36 does not have 'escape' at all. It says pass safely through all that is to come.
    Many prophesies tell us about God's protection for His people during HIs wrath. Isaiah 43:2 is a good example.

    We WILL be here, we WILL have to endure until the end. Revelation 14:12, 1 Corinthians 10:13


    Re the Great Tribulation of the Seven Trumpets and the Seven Bowls. These things will take place during the last 3 1/2 years before Jesus Returns. But be careful not to confuse or combine the Sixth Seal worldwide disaster with the GT. The SS event will happen first and will set the scene for all that must happen before Jesus Returns.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Europe
    Posts
    5,411

    Re: “About The Great Tribulation”

    Quote Originally Posted by Walls View Post
    I am prepared to expound on three proofs that CERTAIN men escape "THE" Great Tribulation. But I would first like to hear from those who DENY any means of escape. Anyone who DENIES an escape from the WRATH of God DENIES THE GOSPEL OF JESUS CHRIST! For what then, do I ask, is the GOSPEL of Jesus Christ? Is the "GOOD NEWS OF JESUS CHRIST" NEWS THAT THE BELIEVER MUST FACE THE WRATH OF GOD?" Is the gospel a "POWER" so IMPOTENT!? Is the accomplished work of Jesus UNABLE TO SAVE a man from GOD'S WRATH? If so, what then is your gospel?
    When Korah rebelled against Moses, we find God's instruction to Israel; "He spake unto the congregation, saying, Depart, I pray you, from the tents of these wicked men, and touch nothing of theirs, lest ye be consumed in all their sins" (Num.16:26). Any man who dared to stand near the rebels was in danger of being burned alive and/or swallowed by the earth. In Revelation 18:4 we have an almost identical scene. It reads; "And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues." In both cases a hoard of God's people were in danger of His wrath because they had joined too near to the object of God's wrath. Throughout both Old and New Testaments, we find the call by God for His people, Israel, and the Church, to SEPARATE themselves from objects of God's wrath.

    The Law of Moses given to Israel required that they distance themselves from the traditions of the nations which surrounded them. They did not. They JOINED them in their polluting practices and anon, Israel too, like the Canaanites, were ejected from their Land. The gospel of Jesus Christ promises a number of things, but it also requires men to distance themselves from what pollutes. In 1st Corinthians Chapter 5 for instance, the Assembly at Corinth was commanded to distance themselves from the incestuous brother because, "... a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump" (5:6). So, in Romans 1:16, which reads; "For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek", the gospel is the POWER of God unto SALVATION ONLY IF OBEYED!

    When a man andd/or woman takes an ocean cruise, the very first thing after being shown one's cabin is emergency drills. Everyone MUST attend. Gathering points are defined, life rafts are demonstrated and the use of life-jackets is explained. All these instructions lead to SALVATION in the event of the ship sinking. But they only work IF THEY ARE OBEYED! So also the gospel. If Noah disobeyed he would not have had the Ark. Israel, with every advantage failed because they disobeyed. And any Christian who is found fraternizing with Babylon the Great when her day of destruction comes, will be made PARTAKER OF HER SUFFERING AND DESTRUCTION.

    Now, every Christian knows SOME Christians who are hot for the Lord, deny themselves, live righteously and are a testimony for Jesus. And sadly, they also know a LOT of Christians who are indifferent to the Lord, live lives that pander to the flesh, are divisive, cheat and steal, are liars and who love the world (the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life - 1st John 2:16. These TWO TYPES of Christians are contrasted throughout the New Testament. So when the "DAY OF THE LORD" arrives, what will happen to these two groups of Christians? Will the gospel of Jesus Christ SAVE THEM ALL, or will it be true to itself and only save THEM THAT OBEYED? Let us see.

    In Luke Chapter 21 nobody denies that the first 26 verses of the Chapter predict events of 70 AD and after. But in verse 27 we have an abrupt change of context. It is the "Apocalypse" - the "Revealing of Jesus from Heaven". And the subject of verse 34 is "that Day". Verse 34 says that because men were involved with worldly things the "DAY" would catch them "unawares". Verse 35 says that it is no good day, but a "snare", and goes on to say that this day will affect. "... all them that dwell on the face of the whole earth!". Verse 36 then gives the SOLUTION. It is, "Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man." From the grammar we deduce that;
    • Only SOME will be COUNTED WORTHY - those that watch and pray always
    • Many will NOT BE COUNTED WORTHY. Who are they? They are the DISCIPLES! It is "Watch YE ... " and our Lord is addressing His disciples
    • Those WORTHY will ESCAPE what happens to ALL on the WHOLE earth. One above has quoted a Bible version that says "shall pass safely through". But the Greek word - a compound word - is Greek Word, "ek-pheugo". It is made up of "ek" which means "out of", and "pheugo", which means to "escape by fleeing". It by no means indicates that one will "pass safely through". No literal translation renders it this way. All literal translations render it as "escaping out of the situation by flight".
    • The proof is in the next phrase, "and to stand before the Son of man". All is clear if we can show WHERE THE SON OF MAN IS AT THAT TIME. Is He in heaven? Or is He in the clouds just above earth. Or is He on earth suffering the Great Tribulation? Matthew 24:29-30 answers for us! It reads;

    29 "Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
    30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory."


    The Son of man ONLY APPEARS AFTER THE GREAT TRIBULATION FROM THE CLOUDS! Thus, to "stand before the Son of man" while "all these things come to pass on the WHOLE earth" means that those accounted worthy are in the clouds WITH HIM. If the woeful events encompass ALL flesh and on the WHOLE earth, then "escaping OUT OF by flight" means that you are not present anywhere on the WHOLE earth. And it goes on to say WHERE YOU WILL BE - STANDING BEFORE THE SON OF MAN WHO HAS NOT YET ARRIVED ON EARTH!

    This is the first of three proofs that CERTAIN Christians, those accounted worthy, those who obey the gospel, those who watch and pray always, WILL ESCAPE THE GREAT TRIBULATION BY NOT BEING ON EARTH. The sad and somber thing is .... it is ONLY CERTAIN CHRISTIANS - NOT ALL! Those NOT watching, NOT praying, fraternizing with the world, living un-sanctified lives, living unrighteously, and living in indifference to the Person of Jesus WILL PASS THROUGH THE GREAT TRIBULATION BECAUSE THEY WERE TOO NEAR TO THE WORLD THAT GOD'S WRATH IS POURED OUT ON!

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    London, England
    Posts
    6,610
    Blog Entries
    13

    Re: “About The Great Tribulation”

    Quote Originally Posted by emekrus View Post
    If you read the OP carefully I did say the escape takes two forms. Either death or staying through till the coming of Jesus and escaping through the rapture.

    And of course, staying through requires endurance.
    Naturally, those who are rooted in Christ will have the grace to endure.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Apr 2018
    Location
    Central Iowa, USA
    Posts
    227

    Re: “About The Great Tribulation”

    Well, I see it really two ways. Either the redeemed at the start of this are removed to not go thru it, or everyone gets to partake in the madness.

    Of the latter, I am not sure any form of "being ready" to deal with what is coming will work. All the evil that has transpired on the earth has basically been "leaks" that the Holy Spirit has not restrained. When the Holy Spirit steps aside and allows evil to charge thru at full fury, I am not sure that even the most Biblically astute among us can fully grasp what will be going down. Yeshua Himself said that many would keel over from heart attacks just seeing what is coming upon the earth.

    The Holy Spirit gives us little glimpses regarding this, but that is about it. And there could be good reason for that. First, to make sure we don't waste all our time focussing on these things. Second, that those who are of the redeemed when the horror show begins will not experience any of it.

    We can have debates on how it all plays out, but I am pretty confident that none of us really have every detail worked out perfectly. Just to read and hear some talk about being prepared to go thru that exhibits a myopic view of what really will be going down at that time. As the Lord clearly said, it will be a time that will be worse than any other time that has preceded it, nor will ever be again. Everything in history up to that period will have been a cake walk. When the real deal goes down, man, what a terrible time that will be.

    Now, given that, and knowing in whom I have placed my trust, it seems rather counter to His nature that He would have those who He has already redeemed go thru that. And those who think so, I am not sure they really grasp what that period is all about and who it is intended for.

    So, even if I am wrong and we all end up going into that period, I see no real way that anyone can be prepared for it. It will make anything we imagine pale in relation to reality. All those "left behind" type of movies barely scratch the surface. And I am not convinced any "pepper" stuff will make any difference.

    And believing that the redeemed up to the start of this stuff are removed prior to it, it is a major motivation to try and get the word to as many as possible so that they also can become part of the redeemed of Yeshua. Time is critical. And there is a lot of work that needs done. It is possible that holding onto a position that everyone has to go thru all of that can make one complacent in their outreach to the world.

    While I like to look at end times things and speculate, my motivation has become more focused on what is truly critical.
    Last edited by Cliff; Oct 23rd 2018 at 02:03 AM. Reason: Spelling
    Israel.... the Believer's insurance policy!

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Durban ,South Africa
    Posts
    7,415

    Re: “About The Great Tribulation”

    Quote Originally Posted by emekrus View Post
    If you read the OP carefully I did say the escape takes two forms. Either death or staying through till the coming of Jesus and escaping through the rapture.

    And of course, staying through requires endurance.
    Good to hear, when you said we can escape the great tribulation through the rapture you seemed to be pointing to an earlier rapture, but you do clarify the escape occurs at the second coming.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Location
    Thames, New Zealand
    Posts
    1,970
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: “About The Great Tribulation”

    Walls said: Those WORTHY will ESCAPE what happens to ALL on the WHOLE earth. One above has quoted a Bible version that says "shall pass safely through". But the Greek word - a compound word - is Greek Word, "ek-pheugo". It is made up of "ek" which means "out of", and "pheugo", which means to "escape by fleeing". It by no means indicates that one will "pass safely through". No literal translation renders it this way. All literal translations render it as "escaping out of the situation by flight". Quote Walls.

    Yes, escape is the usual meaning of 'ek pheugo'.
    But to use it in Luke 21:35, especially thinking it means a rapture removal; is a direct contradiction of the immediately preceding verse, which plainly states this disaster will come upon all who dwell on the face of the whole earth.

    The REBible renders it correctly, pass safely through, so as to avoid any contradiction.
    And as I showed, many prophesies say how the Lord intends to protect His people, not to remove them. Here is our instructions: Joel 2:32, Acts 2:21


    So Cliff, you are wrong and we will all experience the events as prophesied. We must be tested; 1 Peter 4:12, James 1:12, 1 Corinthians 10:13, +
    And if some avoid testing and discipline, then they are illegitimate and not true children of God. Hebrews 12:8

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Posts
    9,138
    Blog Entries
    1

    Re: “About The Great Tribulation”

    Quote Originally Posted by emekrus View Post
    Well,

    In the two cases you mentioned-- Israel in Egypt during the plague and Noah in the Ark. If you check very well, you'll see that God had to separate his people before carrying out his action. So where do you think God is going to separate his own to before his wrath?
    Actually the people were living in the land of Egypt, and though they had land in Goshem they actually were directly affected by rivers turning to blood etc.
    If they did not bring in their flocks then those flocks would have been killed just as the Egyptians flocks were killed.
    So there was no separation in a physical sense, only a separation brought through a response to God.
    We remain in the world, and the troubles thereof affect us, just as they do the sinner.
    This is why Rev 16:15 tells us of the need for patient endurance.

    Then I am with you when you talk about the strength to get through ALL the difficulties of the tribulation. But its scripturally obvious that the rapture of the saints at the coming of Christ will be the end of the difficulties for those who do wait through till the Lord's return.
    Then after the rapture of the saints to heaven, then the wrath of God can then go on. As was the flood and fire(and brimstone) in the days of Noah and Lot respectively.
    This is where I take issue as the rapture does occur with Jesus coming, but that doesn't happen until AFTER the 7 vials in which God's wrath on the earth happens.
    As I noted above Rev 16:15 which is given when the 6th vial has been poured, has the saints STILL enduring through the GT.
    Your premise seems to be based on the idea that because we are not destined to wrath, that therefore we are not on the earth whilst God's wrath is poured out on others.
    However the period of the Two Witnesses shows plagues given whilst we are on the earth.
    The period of the Trumpets shows hardship and tribulation whilst we are on the earth.
    When you read the vials you will note the 1st vial specifically affects those who take the mark of the beast. There will be other people who have not, and they will not have such sores. It might be dressed up as a reaction to chemicals in the mark, which is why only those people suffer.
    The 4th vial again is on people - which Christians are not included within - and they refuse to repent.
    The 5th vial is specifically against those in the AC's kingdom.
    There is also the call to leave the place of Babylon (Rev 18:4) which shows Christians living amongst such people even at that time. If they don't respond and leave then they will be caught up in what happens, thus showing a physical location as being important.

    There is NO pre-trib rapture and there is NO pre-wrath rapture.
    You advocate pre-wrath yet if you read Rev 15:1 we are told the 7 vials are the last, for with them God's wrath is finished, which means the earlier plagues and events are also part of God's wrath. We are told in Rev 8:13 about woe to ALL who dwell on the earth, due to the trumpets.

  15. #15

    Re: “About The Great Tribulation”

    Quote Originally Posted by ForHisglory View Post
    Actually the people were living in the land of Egypt, and though they had land in Goshem they actually were directly affected by rivers turning to blood etc.
    If they did not bring in their flocks then those flocks would have been killed just as the Egyptians flocks were killed.
    So there was no separation in a physical sense, only a separation brought through a response to God.
    We remain in the world, and the troubles thereof affect us, just as they do the sinner.
    This is why Rev 16:15 tells us of the need for patient endurance.


    This is where I take issue as the rapture does occur with Jesus coming, but that doesn't happen until AFTER the 7 vials in which God's wrath on the earth happens.
    As I noted above Rev 16:15 which is given when the 6th vial has been poured, has the saints STILL enduring through the GT.
    Your premise seems to be based on the idea that because we are not destined to wrath, that therefore we are not on the earth whilst God's wrath is poured out on others.
    However the period of the Two Witnesses shows plagues given whilst we are on the earth.
    The period of the Trumpets shows hardship and tribulation whilst we are on the earth.
    When you read the vials you will note the 1st vial specifically affects those who take the mark of the beast. There will be other people who have not, and they will not have such sores. It might be dressed up as a reaction to chemicals in the mark, which is why only those people suffer.
    The 4th vial again is on people - which Christians are not included within - and they refuse to repent.
    The 5th vial is specifically against those in the AC's kingdom.
    There is also the call to leave the place of Babylon (Rev 18:4) which shows Christians living amongst such people even at that time. If they don't respond and leave then they will be caught up in what happens, thus showing a physical location as being important.

    There is NO pre-trib rapture and there is NO pre-wrath rapture.
    You advocate pre-wrath yet if you read Rev 15:1 we are told the 7 vials are the last, for with them God's wrath is finished, which means the earlier plagues and events are also part of God's wrath. We are told in Rev 8:13 about woe to ALL who dwell on the earth, due to the trumpets.
    But...

    I believe Jesus' comparison should clarify things.

    You know, he specifically mentions the case of Noah and Lot.

    In the both case, the children of God had to be separated from God's wrath.

    So we should also expect the same. Would you agree?
    Emeke Odili is a Christian Teacher, Preacher, Author, Writer and Blogger. He has a divinely given vision of practically teaching people how to make success in life through absolute righteousness and faith. Emeke is married to his best friend, Joy. He shares life-transforming articles at his blog: www.righteousfaith.wordpress.com

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. Discussion Tribulation, Great Tribulation, and the Wrath of God
    By seeker_truth in forum End Times Chat
    Replies: 90
    Last Post: Jun 6th 2018, 05:28 AM
  2. the Great Tribulation and the AoD
    By randyk in forum End Times Chat
    Replies: 160
    Last Post: Jan 28th 2018, 03:03 PM
  3. The great tribulation. Only one? Or more than one?
    By divaD in forum End Times Chat
    Replies: 183
    Last Post: Feb 14th 2017, 10:31 PM
  4. Information What is the Great Tribulation
    By Vakeros in forum End Times Chat
    Replies: 66
    Last Post: Mar 29th 2013, 10:39 PM
  5. The Great Tribulation
    By jeffweeder in forum End Times Chat
    Replies: 58
    Last Post: Dec 10th 2009, 07:04 AM

Tags for this Thread

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •