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Thread: Possible Explanation of first 5 seals

  1. #1

    Possible Explanation of first 5 seals

    The first tetrarchy of the Roman empire was from AD 293 to AD 305. Diocletian, a cavalry commander, shared his empire with 3 co-emperors.

    1st seal: Constantius Chloros -- kind to Christians, "conqueror of the Germans 2 times, conqueror of the Sarmatians 2 times, conqueror of the Persians 2 times, conqueror of the Britons, conqueror of the Carpi, conqueror of the Armenians, conqueror of the Medes, conqueror of the Adiabeni"

    2nd seal: Maximian -- quelled rebellion in Gaul (bagaudae)

    3rd seal: Diocletian -- issued Edict for Maximum Prices in AD 301 to combat inflation, including wheat at 100 denarii per kastrensis modius (k. mod) = 6.4 denarii for 1 choenix (1 k. mod = 17.5 L, 1 choenix = 1.1 L, see https://www.academia.edu/23644199/Ne...f_Diocletianus), and barley at 60 denarii per k. mod = 3.8 denarii for 3 choenixes. Higher prices than in Rev. 6:6, so probably Rev. 6:6 refers to a time between AD 275 when wheat was at 0.17 denarii/choenix and AD 301.

    4th seal: Galerius, followed by Maximinus Daia -- ruled 1/4 of the Roman empire, killed lots of Christians and other innocent people during the Great Persecution from AD 303 to AD 313. Galerius died in AD 311. Maximinus carried on persecution until AD 313. Killed by the sword, by famine, by fire, by torture, by drowning, and by wild beasts.

    5th seal: Martyrs pray for vengeance. Constantius Cholos died in AD 305. Maximian died in AD 310. Galerius frees prisoners and died a few days later in AD 311. Diocletian died in AD 311. Maximinus died in AD 313. Great Persecution ends.

    Do you think it matches well?

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    Re: Possible Explanation of first 5 seals

    Quote Originally Posted by greenonions View Post
    The first tetrarchy of the Roman empire was from AD 293 to AD 305. Diocletian, a cavalry commander, shared his empire with 3 co-emperors.

    1st seal: Constantius Chloros -- kind to Christians, "conqueror of the Germans 2 times, conqueror of the Sarmatians 2 times, conqueror of the Persians 2 times, conqueror of the Britons, conqueror of the Carpi, conqueror of the Armenians, conqueror of the Medes, conqueror of the Adiabeni"

    2nd seal: Maximian -- quelled rebellion in Gaul (bagaudae)

    3rd seal: Diocletian -- issued Edict for Maximum Prices in AD 301 to combat inflation, including wheat at 100 denarii per kastrensis modius (k. mod) = 6.4 denarii for 1 choenix (1 k. mod = 17.5 L, 1 choenix = 1.1 L, see https://www.academia.edu/23644199/Ne...f_Diocletianus), and barley at 60 denarii per k. mod = 3.8 denarii for 3 choenixes. Higher prices than in Rev. 6:6, so probably Rev. 6:6 refers to a time between AD 275 when wheat was at 0.17 denarii/choenix and AD 301.

    4th seal: Galerius, followed by Maximinus Daia -- ruled 1/4 of the Roman empire, killed lots of Christians and other innocent people during the Great Persecution from AD 303 to AD 313. Galerius died in AD 311. Maximinus carried on persecution until AD 313. Killed by the sword, by famine, by fire, by torture, by drowning, and by wild beasts.

    5th seal: Martyrs pray for vengeance. Constantius Cholos died in AD 305. Maximian died in AD 310. Galerius frees prisoners and died a few days later in AD 311. Diocletian died in AD 311. Maximinus died in AD 313. Great Persecution ends.

    Do you think it matches well?
    Sure it does. I can't say that's what the book of Revelation meant to indicate, but it sure does fit well.

    I've always had a problem understanding the 4 horsemen. I do think the book of Revelation was written for all of NT history, even though it paints a climax at the end of history, in the 3.5 years of Antichrist's reign.

    Another possible interpretation is that the 4 horsemen are 4 angels who are preparing for the coming of Christ's Kingdom. All of these elements are present in history, and at the end of the age. The 4th Empire of Dan 7 does appear to be the major focus in the endtimes, which I believe is the Roman Empire. The conquests of great empires in history were designed to quell rebellions and to establish social order. They were also to bring peace on earth.

    At the same time the advance of pagan civilization brought economic adversity, along with plagues and a variety of tribulations. Paganism can never be blessed of God, even though God may use pagan governments to establish order.

    With the rise of Christianity in Europe we still had the same old pagan Roman sins. And so we still had conquests to establish peace, along with the curses of sin.

    The end of it all will be Antichrist, who will attempt to establish his own brand of peace on earth through conquest. It also will result in plagues from God, and ultimately, Armageddon.

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    Re: Possible Explanation of first 5 seals

    Quote Originally Posted by greenonions View Post
    The first tetrarchy of the Roman empire was from AD 293 to AD 305. Diocletian, a cavalry commander, shared his empire with 3 co-emperors.

    1st seal: Constantius Chloros -- kind to Christians, "conqueror of the Germans 2 times, conqueror of the Sarmatians 2 times, conqueror of the Persians 2 times, conqueror of the Britons, conqueror of the Carpi, conqueror of the Armenians, conqueror of the Medes, conqueror of the Adiabeni"

    2nd seal: Maximian -- quelled rebellion in Gaul (bagaudae)

    3rd seal: Diocletian -- issued Edict for Maximum Prices in AD 301 to combat inflation, including wheat at 100 denarii per kastrensis modius (k. mod) = 6.4 denarii for 1 choenix (1 k. mod = 17.5 L, 1 choenix = 1.1 L, see https://www.academia.edu/23644199/Ne...f_Diocletianus), and barley at 60 denarii per k. mod = 3.8 denarii for 3 choenixes. Higher prices than in Rev. 6:6, so probably Rev. 6:6 refers to a time between AD 275 when wheat was at 0.17 denarii/choenix and AD 301.

    4th seal: Galerius, followed by Maximinus Daia -- ruled 1/4 of the Roman empire, killed lots of Christians and other innocent people during the Great Persecution from AD 303 to AD 313. Galerius died in AD 311. Maximinus carried on persecution until AD 313. Killed by the sword, by famine, by fire, by torture, by drowning, and by wild beasts.

    5th seal: Martyrs pray for vengeance. Constantius Cholos died in AD 305. Maximian died in AD 310. Galerius frees prisoners and died a few days later in AD 311. Diocletian died in AD 311. Maximinus died in AD 313. Great Persecution ends.

    Do you think it matches well?
    Not quite but if you read the first six seals and the signs that Jesus showed in Matthew chapter 24 you will see that they line up quite nicely and happened within the first century leading up to 70AD

    1st Seal = ???
    (Rev. 6:2) Behold, a white horse. He who sat on it had a bow; and a crown was given to him, and he went out conquering and to conquer.

    (Matt. 24:4-5)"Take heed that no one deceives you. For many will come in my name, saying I am the Christ, and will deceive many."

    2nd Seal = Widespread Warfare
    (Rev. 6:4)Another, a fiery red horse, went out. And it was granted to the one who sat on it to take peace from the earth, and that people should kill one another; and there was given to him a great sword.

    (Matt. 24:6-7)"And you will hear of wars and rumors of wars. See that you are not troubled; for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet. For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom."

    3rd Seal = Famine
    (Rev. 6:5-6) There was a black horse, and its rider held a scale in his hand. Then I heard what sounded like a voice among the four living creatures, saying, "A quart of wheat for a day's wages, and three quarts of barley for a day's wages, and do not damage the oil and the wine!"

    (Matt. 24:7)"There will be famines . . ."

    4th Seal = Death of 1/4 of Mankind from First Four Seals
    (Rev. 6:8)There before me was a pale green horse! Its rider was named Death, and Hades was following close behind him. He was given power over a fourth of the earth to kill by sword, famine and pestilence, and by the wild beasts of the earth.


    (Matt. 24:7-8)"There will be . . . pestilences and earthquakes in various places. All these are the beginning of sorrows."

    5th Seal = Martyrdom of Believers
    (Rev. 6:9-11) I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God and for the testimony which they held. And they cried with a loud voice, saying, "How long, O Lord, holy and true, until You judge and avenge our blood on those who dwell on the earth?" Then a white robe was given to each of them; and it was said to them that they should rest a little while longer, until both the number of their fellow servants and their brethren, who would be killed as they were, was completed.

    (Matt. 24:9-10)"Then they will deliver you up to tribulation and kill you, and you will be hated by all nations for my name's sake. And then many will be offended, will betray one another, and will hate one another."

    6th Seal = Heavenly Signs
    (Rev. 6:12-14)Behold, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became like blood. And the stars of heaven fell to the earth, as a fig tree drops its late figs when it is shaken by a mighty wind. Then the sky receded as a scroll when it is rolled up, and every mountain and island was moved out of its place.


    (Matt. 24:29)Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken."

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    Re: Possible Explanation of first 5 seals

    Quote Originally Posted by greenonions View Post
    The first tetrarchy of the Roman empire was from AD 293 to AD 305. Diocletian, a cavalry commander, shared his empire with 3 co-emperors.

    1st seal: Constantius Chloros -- kind to Christians, "conqueror of the Germans 2 times, conqueror of the Sarmatians 2 times, conqueror of the Persians 2 times, conqueror of the Britons, conqueror of the Carpi, conqueror of the Armenians, conqueror of the Medes, conqueror of the Adiabeni"

    2nd seal: Maximian -- quelled rebellion in Gaul (bagaudae)

    3rd seal: Diocletian -- issued Edict for Maximum Prices in AD 301 to combat inflation, including wheat at 100 denarii per kastrensis modius (k. mod) = 6.4 denarii for 1 choenix (1 k. mod = 17.5 L, 1 choenix = 1.1 L, see https://www.academia.edu/23644199/Ne...f_Diocletianus), and barley at 60 denarii per k. mod = 3.8 denarii for 3 choenixes. Higher prices than in Rev. 6:6, so probably Rev. 6:6 refers to a time between AD 275 when wheat was at 0.17 denarii/choenix and AD 301.

    4th seal: Galerius, followed by Maximinus Daia -- ruled 1/4 of the Roman empire, killed lots of Christians and other innocent people during the Great Persecution from AD 303 to AD 313. Galerius died in AD 311. Maximinus carried on persecution until AD 313. Killed by the sword, by famine, by fire, by torture, by drowning, and by wild beasts.

    5th seal: Martyrs pray for vengeance. Constantius Cholos died in AD 305. Maximian died in AD 310. Galerius frees prisoners and died a few days later in AD 311. Diocletian died in AD 311. Maximinus died in AD 313. Great Persecution ends.

    Do you think it matches well?
    No it doesn't match well.
    You have a conqueror - yet all the Caesar's lay claim to this.
    You have a rebellion which somehow it meant to fit war.
    You have someone who sets the price of foods even though it is a different price and would therefore be irrelevant
    You have martyrs praying for vengeance but don't get it and simply note that those who were persecuting die at a certain time.

    I think it was an interesting exercise, but don't see a connection.

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    Re: Possible Explanation of first 5 seals

    I agree with FHG, Your theory that the first Five Seals have happened via the Roman Emperors is interesting, but wrong.
    Those Seals were opened by Jesus at His Ascension. Proved by the Fifth one showing what God does with the souls of those martyred for their faith. Plus the simple fact of there having been and are continuing to be; wars, famines, plagues and economic disasters aplenty, from then until now.
    We await the Sixth Seal, the event that will change the world and lead up to the glorious Return of Jesus for His Millennium reign.

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    Re: Possible Explanation of first 5 seals

    Quote Originally Posted by greenonions View Post
    The first tetrarchy of the Roman empire was from AD 293 to AD 305. Diocletian, a cavalry commander, shared his empire with 3 co-emperors.

    1st seal: Constantius Chloros -- kind to Christians, "conqueror of the Germans 2 times, conqueror of the Sarmatians 2 times, conqueror of the Persians 2 times, conqueror of the Britons, conqueror of the Carpi, conqueror of the Armenians, conqueror of the Medes, conqueror of the Adiabeni"

    2nd seal: Maximian -- quelled rebellion in Gaul (bagaudae)

    3rd seal: Diocletian -- issued Edict for Maximum Prices in AD 301 to combat inflation, including wheat at 100 denarii per kastrensis modius (k. mod) = 6.4 denarii for 1 choenix (1 k. mod = 17.5 L, 1 choenix = 1.1 L, see https://www.academia.edu/23644199/Ne...f_Diocletianus), and barley at 60 denarii per k. mod = 3.8 denarii for 3 choenixes. Higher prices than in Rev. 6:6, so probably Rev. 6:6 refers to a time between AD 275 when wheat was at 0.17 denarii/choenix and AD 301.

    4th seal: Galerius, followed by Maximinus Daia -- ruled 1/4 of the Roman empire, killed lots of Christians and other innocent people during the Great Persecution from AD 303 to AD 313. Galerius died in AD 311. Maximinus carried on persecution until AD 313. Killed by the sword, by famine, by fire, by torture, by drowning, and by wild beasts.

    5th seal: Martyrs pray for vengeance. Constantius Cholos died in AD 305. Maximian died in AD 310. Galerius frees prisoners and died a few days later in AD 311. Diocletian died in AD 311. Maximinus died in AD 313. Great Persecution ends.

    Do you think it matches well?
    No, the First 5 Seals will be opened by Jesus at the Mid way point of the 70th Week.

  7. #7

    Re: Possible Explanation of first 5 seals

    Quote Originally Posted by randyk View Post
    Sure it does. I can't say that's what the book of Revelation meant to indicate, but it sure does fit well.

    I've always had a problem understanding the 4 horsemen. I do think the book of Revelation was written for all of NT history, even though it paints a climax at the end of history, in the 3.5 years of Antichrist's reign.

    Another possible interpretation is that the 4 horsemen are 4 angels who are preparing for the coming of Christ's Kingdom. All of these elements are present in history, and at the end of the age. The 4th Empire of Dan 7 does appear to be the major focus in the endtimes, which I believe is the Roman Empire. The conquests of great empires in history were designed to quell rebellions and to establish social order. They were also to bring peace on earth.

    At the same time the advance of pagan civilization brought economic adversity, along with plagues and a variety of tribulations. Paganism can never be blessed of God, even though God may use pagan governments to establish order.

    With the rise of Christianity in Europe we still had the same old pagan Roman sins. And so we still had conquests to establish peace, along with the curses of sin.

    The end of it all will be Antichrist, who will attempt to establish his own brand of peace on earth through conquest. It also will result in plagues from God, and ultimately, Armageddon.
    Thanks for your feedback. The difficulty with 4 horsemen being 4 angels is that they cannot be identified by humans, but I see your point about these types of problems being present in history. I looked into the price of wheat and was somewhat forced to conclude that the only time period for the 3rd seal was around 300 AD. The denarius is a coin, that has long since depreciated to a negligible value and is no longer legal tender, which also seems to limit the literal fulfillment to that time period. There are thousands of possible symbolic fulfillments, so I thought interpreting the four horsemen as a tightly-knit group is essential.

  8. #8

    Re: Possible Explanation of first 5 seals

    Quote Originally Posted by marty fox View Post
    Not quite but if you read the first six seals and the signs that Jesus showed in Matthew chapter 24 you will see that they line up quite nicely and happened within the first century leading up to 70AD
    Thanks for your feedback. Yes, I have noticed the correspondence between the seals and Matthew 24, but I don't see that it all happened before AD 70.

    1st Seal = ???
    (Rev. 6:2) Behold, a white horse. He who sat on it had a bow; and a crown was given to him, and he went out conquering and to conquer.

    (Matt. 24:4-5)"Take heed that no one deceives you. For many will come in my name, saying I am the Christ, and will deceive many."
    We are agreed that the rider of the white horse could refer to someone who appears like Christ.

    2nd Seal = Widespread Warfare
    (Rev. 6:4)Another, a fiery red horse, went out. And it was granted to the one who sat on it to take peace from the earth, and that people should kill one another; and there was given to him a great sword.

    (Matt. 24:6-7)"And you will hear of wars and rumors of wars. See that you are not troubled; for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet. For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom."
    Yes, there was war between AD 30 and AD 70.

    3rd Seal = Famine
    (Rev. 6:5-6) There was a black horse, and its rider held a scale in his hand. Then I heard what sounded like a voice among the four living creatures, saying, "A quart of wheat for a day's wages, and three quarts of barley for a day's wages, and do not damage the oil and the wine!"

    (Matt. 24:7)"There will be famines . . ."
    The book of Acts mentions famines. I haven't found evidence of the above mentioned prices before AD 70. It could be buried in history.

    4th Seal = Death of 1/4 of Mankind from First Four Seals
    (Rev. 6:8)There before me was a pale green horse! Its rider was named Death, and Hades was following close behind him. He was given power over a fourth of the earth to kill by sword, famine and pestilence, and by the wild beasts of the earth.

    (Matt. 24:7-8)"There will be . . . pestilences and earthquakes in various places. All these are the beginning of sorrows."
    The word translated "pestilence" in Revelation 6:8 is thanato, which is more literally "death". I don't think it matches pestilences and earthquakes very closely, but they can cause death.

    5th Seal = Martyrdom of Believers
    (Rev. 6:9-11) I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God and for the testimony which they held. And they cried with a loud voice, saying, "How long, O Lord, holy and true, until You judge and avenge our blood on those who dwell on the earth?" Then a white robe was given to each of them; and it was said to them that they should rest a little while longer, until both the number of their fellow servants and their brethren, who would be killed as they were, was completed.

    (Matt. 24:9-10)"Then they will deliver you up to tribulation and kill you, and you will be hated by all nations for my name's sake. And then many will be offended, will betray one another, and will hate one another."
    Agreed.

    6th Seal = Heavenly Signs
    (Rev. 6:12-14)Behold, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became like blood. And the stars of heaven fell to the earth, as a fig tree drops its late figs when it is shaken by a mighty wind. Then the sky receded as a scroll when it is rolled up, and every mountain and island was moved out of its place.


    (Matt. 24:29)Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken."
    Yes, they match.

  9. #9

    Re: Possible Explanation of first 5 seals

    Quote Originally Posted by ForHisglory View Post
    No it doesn't match well.
    Thanks for your specific criticism.

    You have a conqueror - yet all the Caesar's lay claim to this.
    You seem to say that there could be multiple other candidates. Do you mean all the other 3 co-emperors, or the thousands of kings throughout history? I found that identifying a specific conqueror was pretty impossible unless we view the four horsemen as a closely connected unit. If you look for a conqueror within a group of 4 people, it narrows down the choices significantly. I picked Constantius as the rider of the white horse because he is described as a relatively good person, compared to the other three.

    You have a rebellion which somehow it meant to fit war.
    Maximian used his legions to attack the rebels, which is using the sword to take away peace and make men slay each other. Revelation 6:4 does not mention the word "war", so it doesn't need to fit war. I was thinking in terms of civil war. Maximian fought other wars against the Germanic tribes.

    You have someone who sets the price of foods even though it is a different price and would therefore be irrelevant
    We have someone who has a balance, who is concerned with weights and measurements -- e.g. of food. The price is from the midst of the four living creatures -- God decreed that there would be significant inflation. Diocletian's edict of maximum prices tells us that the level of inflation was exceeded by that time, meaning that it was probably fulfilled before AD 301.

    You didn't mention the 4th seal. Does it match?

    You have martyrs praying for vengeance but don't get it and simply note that those who were persecuting die at a certain time.
    The martyrs were told to rest until the number of those killed were completed. When the last martyr of the Great Persecution was killed in AD 313, all of the persecutors were dead. Concerning vengeance. The Great Persecution began in AD 303. In AD 304, Diocletian got a disease, from which he almost died, then survived, but was too sick to continue as emperor. Maximian tried to kill Constantine, but was caught, and chose to strangle himself. Galerius had worms in his intestines for a long and died a horrible death. Diocletian died seeing his plans to prevent civil war through the tetrarchy fail completely. Maximinus took poison, but didn't die, suffering torments instead. He hit his head against wall and didn't die, but his eyes fell out. He thought he saw God judging him and yelled as someone being tortured and died a horrible death. (https://people.ucalgary.ca/~vandersp.../lactperf.html)

    I think it was an interesting exercise, but don't see a connection.

  10. #10

    Re: Possible Explanation of first 5 seals

    Quote Originally Posted by Keraz View Post
    I agree with FHG, Your theory that the first Five Seals have happened via the Roman Emperors is interesting, but wrong.
    Those Seals were opened by Jesus at His Ascension. Proved by the Fifth one showing what God does with the souls of those martyred for their faith. Plus the simple fact of there having been and are continuing to be; wars, famines, plagues and economic disasters aplenty, from then until now.
    We await the Sixth Seal, the event that will change the world and lead up to the glorious Return of Jesus for His Millennium reign.
    Do you mean that all 5 seals were opened around AD 33, before Stephen was killed? If that were the case, there would be no souls of Christian martyrs under the altar yet. I think it is after AD 95, because in Revelation 4:1, the voice says: “Come up here, and I will show you the things which must happen after this.”

    If the seals meant wars, famines, plagues, and economic disasters in general, what changed after the opening of the seals? These things happened before the time of Christ too.

  11. #11

    Re: Possible Explanation of first 5 seals

    Quote Originally Posted by Revelation Man View Post
    No, the First 5 Seals will be opened by Jesus at the Mid way point of the 70th Week.
    It sounds like you are equating the seals, trumpets and bowls with the Great Tribulation. 42 months are mentioned in Revelation 11:2 AFTER the sixth trumpet. The wars, famines, and martyrdom in Matthew 24 happen in the verses before the abomination of desolation is set up. We may disagree, but thank you for expressing your point of view.

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    Re: Possible Explanation of first 5 seals

    Quote Originally Posted by greenonions View Post
    Thanks for your feedback. Yes, I have noticed the correspondence between the seals and Matthew 24, but I don't see that it all happened before AD 70.



    We are agreed that the rider of the white horse could refer to someone who appears like Christ.



    Yes, there was war between AD 30 and AD 70.



    The book of Acts mentions famines. I haven't found evidence of the above mentioned prices before AD 70. It could be buried in history.



    The word translated "pestilence" in Revelation 6:8 is thanato, which is more literally "death". I don't think it matches pestilences and earthquakes very closely, but they can cause death.



    Agreed.



    Yes, they match.
    If you read read the writings of the Jewish historian Josephus in his recordings of the fall of Jerusalem you will see massive death and starvation and diseases due to the conditions within the walls of the city during the siege by the Romans.

    The Roman historian Tacitus also records in his writing of the madness of Nero of great earthquakes and wars and civil wars leading up to 70AD as well.

    Another interesting fact is that both of these unbelievers also mention Jesus in their recording proving that Jesus was a real person in history who walked upon the earth

  13. #13

    Re: Possible Explanation of first 5 seals

    Quote Originally Posted by marty fox View Post
    If you read read the writings of the Jewish historian Josephus in his recordings of the fall of Jerusalem you will see massive death and starvation and diseases due to the conditions within the walls of the city during the siege by the Romans.
    I can believe that.

    The Roman historian Tacitus also records in his writing of the madness of Nero of great earthquakes and wars and civil wars leading up to 70AD as well.
    Tacitus mentioned earthquakes during Claudius' reign in Rome, circa AD 53 in Apamea, in AD 60 at Laodicea and in AD 62 at Pompeii, and there were civil wars. Is that what you mean?

    Another interesting fact is that both of these unbelievers also mention Jesus in their recording proving that Jesus was a real person in history who walked upon the earth

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    Re: Possible Explanation of first 5 seals

    Quote Originally Posted by greenonions View Post
    I can believe that.



    Tacitus mentioned earthquakes during Claudius' reign in Rome, circa AD 53 in Apamea, in AD 60 at Laodicea and in AD 62 at Pompeii, and there were civil wars. Is that what you mean?


    Yes that was what I mean

    I believe that Jesus was warning the disciples during the Olivit Discourse of what they will see and experience leading up to 70AD and we read about it in the book of Acts. I also believe that Jesus was warning the 7 churches in the book of Revelation of the same thing.

    Revelation 1-3
    The revelation from Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show his servants what must soon take place. He made it known by sending his angel to his servant John, 2 who testifies to everything he saw—that is, the word of God and the testimony of Jesus Christ. 3 Blessed is the one who reads aloud the words of this prophecy, and blessed are those who hear it and take to heart what is written in it, because the time is near.

    Revelation 22:7 & 10
    7 “Look, I am coming soon! Blessed is the one who keeps the words of the prophecy written in this scroll.”

    10 Then he told me, “Do not seal up the words of the prophecy of this scroll, because the time is near.

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    Re: Possible Explanation of first 5 seals

    Quote Originally Posted by greenonions View Post
    Thanks for your specific criticism.
    I didn't start with a SPECIFIC criticism. I went into detail afterwards.

    You seem to say that there could be multiple other candidates. Do you mean all the other 3 co-emperors, or the thousands of kings throughout history? I found that identifying a specific conqueror was pretty impossible unless we view the four horsemen as a closely connected unit. If you look for a conqueror within a group of 4 people, it narrows down the choices significantly. I picked Constantius as the rider of the white horse because he is described as a relatively good person, compared to the other three.
    There are indeed a mass of alternatives, including many which don't include any Caesar's or co-emperors.
    Why even do you think the 4 horsemen must be directly connected?
    You need to ask yourself what they symbolise first.

    Maximian used his legions to attack the rebels, which is using the sword to take away peace and make men slay each other. Revelation 6:4 does not mention the word "war", so it doesn't need to fit war. I was thinking in terms of civil war. Maximian fought other wars against the Germanic tribes.
    Using the sword was the way people killed each other until the last couple of hundred years.
    Why civil war?

    We have someone who has a balance, who is concerned with weights and measurements -- e.g. of food. The price is from the midst of the four living creatures -- God decreed that there would be significant inflation. Diocletian's edict of maximum prices tells us that the level of inflation was exceeded by that time, meaning that it was probably fulfilled before AD 301.
    God didn't decree significant inflation. It states a very simple day's food for a day's work. Where is inflation in that?

    You didn't mention the 4th seal. Does it match?
    I didn't note what you put for the 4th seal.

    The martyrs were told to rest until the number of those killed were completed. When the last martyr of the Great Persecution was killed in AD 313, all of the persecutors were dead. Concerning vengeance. The Great Persecution began in AD 303. In AD 304, Diocletian got a disease, from which he almost died, then survived, but was too sick to continue as emperor. Maximian tried to kill Constantine, but was caught, and chose to strangle himself. Galerius had worms in his intestines for a long and died a horrible death. Diocletian died seeing his plans to prevent civil war through the tetrarchy fail completely. Maximinus took poison, but didn't die, suffering torments instead. He hit his head against wall and didn't die, but his eyes fell out. He thought he saw God judging him and yelled as someone being tortured and died a horrible death. (https://people.ucalgary.ca/~vandersp.../lactperf.html)
    There are martyrs being killed today. You have narrowly focused on one period of Persecution within the Roman Empire. It is not a picture about a single instance of Persecution, but about the persecution over time hence the number not yet complete.

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