Is the Tithe a Bondage?

[kyCyd]

I have close acquaintances who have given what they call their "Tithe." And I've been aghast that they have felt the need to obligate themselves to an outmoded rule under the Law of Moses. Some even given a tenth of their *Gross Income!* If a business person did this, they could go broke immediately!

I hear everything from God threatened a curse in Malachi to those who didn't pay a tithe to the promise of a 100 fold blessing to those who give. I'm told that we should be charitable, but in the NT Scriptures I don't find anywhere that the Tithe must be paid. I'm excluding here the NT Gospels, which are actually mostly in the OT era.

What I find is that Paul considered the Tithe and the totality of OT regulations as a "bondage." Though the Law of Moses was indeed considered a great blessing, as a temporary reprieve from guilty and punishment, I don't find that it was ever intended to be our ultimate end. It was, as I said, viewed as a "bondage," from which we are now, in the NT, relieved.

To put people under the Tithe is, therefore, a bondage to me. And it causes Christians to be internally dishonest when they claim to be observant in this respect and likely are not. In fact, if Christians were free, they could consider what the actual needs of their church are, and do their equivalent part. Giving may actually go up with more transparency, and with more freedom.

What do you think? Is the Law a bondage or not?

I agree with Mailmandan in that it is between the Lord and you. I think the Lord can direct His people. When I was younger and first heard about a tithe I attempted it. I am sure most will. Not being able to make ends meet, I prayed asking the Lord to count the taxes being paid and that all that money go to the poor and needy. I believe this was done for me.

Being retired and on fixed income, not paying taxes any longer, I have recently been directed to give to Feeding America...even went from there to local area and do give there now. I felt directed of the Lord to do this.

Deuteronomy 15:11 For the poor shall never cease out of the land: therefore I command thee, saying, Thou shalt open thine hand wide unto thy brother, to thy poor, and to thy needy, in thy land.

I believe the Lord can and does direct His people. He does this through His word and words given you if you are listening.

Forcing someone or putting pressure on someone is bondage to me. Mentioning it or teaching about it is not bondage....so it depends on how it is presented to people.

The thing the Lord wants is for us to walk in peace...that peace comes when you do as directed of the Lord.

I have close acquaintances who have given what they call their "Tithe." And I've been aghast that they have felt the need to obligate themselves to an outmoded rule under the Law of Moses. Some even given a tenth of their *Gross Income!* If a business person did this, they could go broke immediately!

I hear everything from God threatened a curse in Malachi to those who didn't pay a tithe to the promise of a 100 fold blessing to those who give. I'm told that we should be charitable, but in the NT Scriptures I don't find anywhere that the Tithe must be paid. I'm excluding here the NT Gospels, which are actually mostly in the OT era.

What I find is that Paul considered the Tithe and the totality of OT regulations as a "bondage." Though the Law of Moses was indeed considered a great blessing, as a temporary reprieve from guilty and punishment, I don't find that it was ever intended to be our ultimate end. It was, as I said, viewed as a "bondage," from which we are now, in the NT, relieved.

To put people under the Tithe is, therefore, a bondage to me. And it causes Christians to be internally dishonest when they claim to be observant in this respect and likely are not. In fact, if Christians were free, they could consider what the actual needs of their church are, and do their equivalent part. Giving may actually go up with more transparency, and with more freedom.

What do you think? Is the Law a bondage or not?

I agree with Mailmandan in that it is between the Lord and you. I think the Lord can direct His people. When I was younger and first heard about a tithe I attempted it. I am sure most will. Not being able to make ends meet, I prayed asking the Lord to count the taxes being paid and that all that money go to the poor and needy. I believe this was done for me.

Being retired and on fixed income, not paying taxes any longer, I have recently been directed to give to Feeding America...even went from there to local area and do give there now. I felt directed of the Lord to do this.

Deuteronomy 15:11 For the poor shall never cease out of the land: therefore I command thee, saying, Thou shalt open thine hand wide unto thy brother, to thy poor, and to thy needy, in thy land.

I believe the Lord can and does direct His people. He does this through His word and words given you if you are listening.

Forcing someone or putting pressure on someone is bondage to me. Mentioning it or teaching about it is not bondage....so it depends on how it is presented to people.

The thing the Lord wants is for us to walk in peace...that peace comes when you do as directed of the Lord.

[Slug1]

I would like to ask a counter question, what makes you think Gentiles are under the Mosaic Law? If so we should all be circumcised and keep all statutes. But Paul says in Gal. 5:2 « Behold, I Paul say unto you (the Gentiles), that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing. », the same law that talks about tithes says « And in the eighth day the flesh of his foreskin shall be circumcised » Lev. 12:3. So I don't really understand why people feel obligated to tithe and not to do the whole law.

Aristarkos

Tithing isn't about the Law of Moses, people chose to tithe long before "The Law." Tithing is about relationship in giving back to God with a pure trusting heart.

The problem with just about "all" tithing related doctrines is that the doctrines are "pushed" as a requirement and this is the main element of bondage. Man controlling man's heart by dictating when and how much to give... all in God's name while we know, the real reason is to fund something the church or the leadership of the church, desires.

So, yeah... many (myself included) will stand firm against this bondage method of "tithing."

But this stand cannot cause us to forget or disregard the heart intent of tithing and in so forgetting, NOT tithe and not have that element of relationship with God

Yet many Christians will spend money on lottery tickets/scratch-offs, etc. Or/and many Christians who will not tithe, WILL devote 10% of their income to investments in the world Ya don't think satan has literally taken a relational element that should be with God and stolen it for himself where the very %, is exactly the same?

[Aijalon]

The title of this thread is about the bondage of tithing. I feel you have offered some great examples about "when" tithing is about a bondage.

Those that tithe due to relationship with God, do not suffer all you raised in your post.

The title of this thread is about the bondage of tithing. I feel you have offered some great examples about "when" tithing is about a bondage.

Those that tithe due to relationship with God, do not suffer all you raised in your post.

A tithe, by nature of it's definition, is a tenth percent. It is naturally a good round number to use as a giving guideline, when there is nothing else to go by. Point is, a tithe is currently an arbitrary number, since there is no minimum in the new covenant. It is possible of course to tithe without it being bondage, but only if the giver does not feel guilty in any way when or if they don't or cannot tithe. If the tithe is given out of obligation, it's a bondage. God wants heart-gratitude, not legalism, and a tithe is like a pitfall for legalism. It is very difficult to teach on tithing using an old covenant mindset, and not instill a legalistic belief in the tithe. Whatever you give out of heart gratitude is what god wants. If your faith is small, give small, if your faith is big, give big.

A good rule of thumb I've heard talked about is to "give more than you can spare". While that's a great rule to go by, it works -again- only when one gives without the expectation of a blessing in return. There is no guarantee of a financial blessing in exchange for a tithe or giving. The rewards are spiritual. If we look for money to "come back" to us, we'll going astray.

God has ALREADY given us everything we need by defeating death and solving the sin-problem. No money needed.

[Slug1]

Whatever you give out of heart gratitude is what god wants. If your faith is small, give small, if your faith is big, give big.

A good rule of thumb I've heard talked about is to "give more than you can spare". While that's a great rule to go by, it works -again- only when one gives without the expectation of a blessing in return. There is no guarantee of a financial blessing in exchange for a tithe or giving. The rewards are spiritual. If we look for money to "come back" to us, we'll going astray.

God has ALREADY given us everything we need by defeating death and solving the sin-problem. No money needed.

Later, I'll make some comments on the other portion of your post that I removed from this quote.

What you raised here is something many need to hear. I too, from experience began giving back small but as God moved more and more in my life, I found myself also moving more and more in faithful ways. An element of this (my) faith is to give back in proportion.

You mention that tithing is not a guarantee of a financial blessing and I agree 100%. However, based on needs I've experienced, where a financial burden happened, ALL of them I've prayed to God about and sometimes I can't even explain it, but the need is made easy to deal with. I personally call it, "God's Math" and only those who faithfully tithe understand that it HAPPENS, they just can't explain HOW it happens. When testified to those who do not tithe in faith... makes no sense to them.

[Aristarkos]

Tithing isn't about the Law of Moses, people chose to tithe long before "The Law." Tithing is about relationship in giving back to God with a pure trusting heart.

The problem with just about "all" tithing related doctrines is that the doctrines are "pushed" as a requirement and this is the main element of bondage. Man controlling man's heart by dictating when and how much to give... all in God's name while we know, the real reason is to fund something the church or the leadership of the church, desires.

So, yeah... many (myself included) will stand firm against this bondage method of "tithing."

But this stand cannot cause us to forget or disregard the heart intent of tithing and in so forgetting, NOT tithe and not have that element of relationship with God

Yet many Christians will spend money on lottery tickets/scratch-offs, etc. Or/and many Christians who will not tithe, WILL devote 10% of their income to investments in the world Ya don't think satan has literally taken a relational element that should be with God and stolen it for himself where the very %, is exactly the same?

Thanks for your reply, but I don't think you're right, just look at Leviticus, in v. 27:30 we read « And all the tithe of the land, whether of the seed of the land, or of the fruit of the tree, is the LORD'S: it is holy unto the LORD » two verses ahead « And concerning the tithe of the herd, or of the flock, even of whatsoever passeth under the rod, the tenth shall be holy unto the LORD », so tithing is surely in the Law of Moses.

In Num 18:26 we read « Thus speak unto the Levites, and say unto them, When ye take of the children of Israel the tithes which I have given you from them for your inheritance, then ye shall offer up an heave offering of it for the LORD, even a tenth part of the tithe ». Again this tithing is according to the Law. In Deu. 12:17 « Thou mayest not eat within thy gates the tithe of thy corn, or of thy wine, or of thy oil, or the firstlings of thy herds or of thy flock, nor any of thy vows which thou vowest, nor thy freewill offerings, or heave offering of thine hand ». In Deu. 14:22 « Thou shalt truly tithe all the increase of thy seed, that the field bringeth forth year by year ».

In 2 Chron. 31:6 it says « And concerning the children of Israel and Judah, that dwelt in the cities of Judah, they also brought in the tithe of oxen and sheep, and the tithe of holy things which were consecrated unto the LORD their God, and laid them by heaps », yet you say « Tithing isn't about the Law of Moses »? But it is.

Aristarkos

[Slug1]

Thanks for your reply, but I don't think you're right, just look at Leviticus, in v. 27:30 we read « And all the tithe of the land, whether of the seed of the land, or of the fruit of the tree, is the LORD'S: it is holy unto the LORD » two verses ahead « And concerning the tithe of the herd, or of the flock, even of whatsoever passeth under the rod, the tenth shall be holy unto the LORD », so tithing is surely in the Law of Moses.

In Num 18:26 we read « Thus speak unto the Levites, and say unto them, When ye take of the children of Israel the tithes which I have given you from them for your inheritance, then ye shall offer up an heave offering of it for the LORD, even a tenth part of the tithe ». Again this tithing is according to the Law. In Deu. 12:17 « Thou mayest not eat within thy gates the tithe of thy corn, or of thy wine, or of thy oil, or the firstlings of thy herds or of thy flock, nor any of thy vows which thou vowest, nor thy freewill offerings, or heave offering of thine hand ». In Deu. 14:22 « Thou shalt truly tithe all the increase of thy seed, that the field bringeth forth year by year ».

In 2 Chron. 31:6 it says « And concerning the children of Israel and Judah, that dwelt in the cities of Judah, they also brought in the tithe of oxen and sheep, and the tithe of holy things which were consecrated unto the LORD their God, and laid them by heaps », yet you say « Tithing isn't about the Law of Moses »? But it is.

Aristarkos

Well, "the Law" made tithing a requirement. Many of today's tithe related doctrines that are enforced follow this enforcement quality that the Law instilled. I pray that we all know, God's intention for the Law enforcement was to ensure man (specifically the Israelis) that man could not fulfill all that is enforced. Well, today it's the same and not all can fulfill a "tithe" doctrine enforcement in any given church.

However, the principle of the tithe was a matter of relationship with God BEFORE the Law came into existence. But by including this element about relationship with God as a statute in the Law, God made what should be of the heart/a relational trust quality in a relationship with Him ... a burden! Again to show man they can't do it without feeling burdened and to this day, that burden continues when "enforced" as a law of a church, cept renamed as "doctrine."

Study about Abraham's relationship with God. Specifically about his faith and his offering back to God as an element of faithful trust in God, the first fruits from any provision he was given.

[randyk]

I would like to ask a counter question, what makes you think Gentiles are under the Mosaic Law? If so we should all be circumcised and keep all statutes. But Paul says in Gal. 5:2 « Behold, I Paul say unto you (the Gentiles), that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing. », the same law that talks about tithes says « And in the eighth day the flesh of his foreskin shall be circumcised » Lev. 12:3. So I don't really understand why people feel obligated to tithe and not to do the whole law.

Aristarkos

That was certainly true under the OT, and remains true in the NT. I couldn't agree more.

But I don't think the Jews are under the Law of Moses anymore either. All of mankind is under the Law of God, but not under the Law of Moses. The Law of Christ replaced the Law of Moses for all. All of mankind is presently being judged by Christ--Moses' Law depended on flawed priests, and only served on a temporary basis, until Christ came.

Nobody today has to be circumcised. Nobody has to pay tithes. Nobody has to observe the Sabbath Day or attend church. Nothing is in the way of our salvation. We receive salvation by trusting in Christ.

After trusting in Christ for our salvation we obtain the ability to do good works. Some of those good works involve paying the church to keep it operating, and attending church. These are good things. We might even call them "laws." But no law gets us saved, except the law requiring us to trust in Christ for that.

[randyk]

Malachi 3:8 “Will a mere mortal rob God? Yet you rob me. “But you ask, ‘How are we robbing you?’ “In tithes and offerings. 9 You are under a curse—your whole nation—because you are robbing me. The whole nation of Israel. Malachi is written to Jews under the Old Covenant. Malachi 1:1 - The oracle of the word of the LORD to Israel through Malachi.

Many churches teach that we as Christians, under the New Covenant, are commanded to give a minimum of 10% of our income to our church. Others teach that preachers of these churches are turning the 10% tithe for Israel from the Old Testament into a monetary, legalistic prescription for Christians under the New Covenant. I even once heard a Pastor make a challenge to his congregation to give 10% of their income for 90 days and if God does not bless them then he will give them their money back.

In 2 Corinthians 9:5-7 we read: Therefore I thought it necessary to exhort the brethren to go to you ahead of time, and prepare your generous gift beforehand, which you had previously promised, that it may be ready as a matter of generosity and not as a grudging obligation. But this I say: He who sows sparingly will also reap sparingly, and he who sows bountifully will also reap bountifully. So let each one give as he purposes in his heart, not grudgingly or of necessity; for God loves a cheerful giver.

I don't see a "specific percentage" given anywhere for Christians "under the New Covenant," but I certainly believe in giving and not just to our church. I also believe that everything we own belongs to God. If someone wants to give 10% or even more to their church, that is fine and you can't out give God. The problem I have is with Pastors, like the one I previously mentioned, who legalistically uses the 10% tithe to brow-beat people in that church with guilt. He even handed out pledge cards for people to fill out so they can pledge to give extra money on a monthly basis over a three year period above and beyond the 10% tithe directly to the "moving forward" project to build a new mega church. More than a few people have left that church because all that Pastor mainly talks about is money (primarily the 10% tithe) and building that new mega church (which to this day has not been built).

During one sermon, he even mentioned that a member of that church came into his office one day somewhat irate and said that he is leaving that church because he is tired of hearing about money all the time and needs to find a church where he can go "deeper" in the Word. The Pastor mentioned that the word "deeper" is a code word for "I'm not tithing 10%." The Pastor went on to say that he checked the records and sure enough that member of the church was not giving 10% and some months gave nothing at all and then acted like good riddance to him! Whatever amount of money that you wish to give is between you and God, but we should not turn giving into a legalistic prescription.

Yes, we're somewhat on the same page here. I've attended churches virtually every week of my life. The best church I attended in regard to giving never "passed the plate," but only stuck a box in the back of the church and trusted God for what they needed. The church exploded in finances and growth. I believe the pastors believed in the 10% tithe, but they did not over-teach it.

The church I attend now does over-teach the 10% tithe. And let me explain what that does. We had a church split, and the few that remained were a mix of very poor and fairly well to do. Some, of course, were in the middle.

But the pastor is a good man, and does everything by faith. His faith, however, is often presumptuous. He set an amount of salary for himself and for his wife, and for a time for his daughter. He regularly preached on the "blessings" that come from tithing. In effect this would've required the poor in our church to give a tenth when that could've taken government money that was viewed as the minimum of what they needed! As for the more well to do, they were left to finance a pastor at a higher salary disproportionately, because there were not enough in the church to spread the burden. The pastor, in effect, depended on the tenth, in order to get all of his programs enacted.

In the meantime the pastor brought in an associate pastor, to substitute for him when he wanted a rest, which is pretty regularly. The pastor's wife got sick, and no longer attends. But the pastors dual salary for him and his wife remains constant--a matter of "faith." And now the associate pastor gets a portion of the income as well--a new parsonage.

The pastor obviously practices giving the tenth tithe because in giving this way he feels he sets the standard for everyone else. In this way, he will get all of his programs enacted. But inasmuch as most people cannot actually give the tithe, he sometimes get less. And then the tithe he receives isn't what he considers enough.

It all falls upon this supposed requirement in the Law of Moses that we must give 10%. My brother indicates this is *before the Law of Moses,* because Abraham tithed to Melchizedek. But my brother never answered the question: how often did Abraham pay Melchizedek, and where did the money come from?

The tithe was based on Israel's ancient agricultural system, and had nothing to do with the Gentile world, nor with modern societies. We do not support a sacrificial system anymore. And we don't have 90% remaining when we give 10% of our income! Our bills may consume 100% of our paychecks! A business may gross 100K, but the bills may eat up 100% of that income!

Today, we have a need to support God's ministries. And we simply have to know what our fair share is. To give by a percentage is, I believe, cruel. Some think they have to give, and do harm to themselves. God does not bless presumption! If we give by faith, it should not be by the law of tithe, because that system is no longer in effect. If we simply want to choose to give 10% because it sounds like a reasonable number, and it is truly based on what our family needs to live, God bless! But to put your whole family or yourself under a law that is not being required by God is a "bondage!"

[Slug1]

The best church I attended in regard to giving never "passed the plate," but only stuck a box in the back of the church and trusted God for what they needed. The church exploded in finances and growth. I believe the pastors believed in the 10% tithe, but they did not over-teach it.

The churches explosion in finances did not happen due to not over-teaching of tithing. So what do you believe is the reason for what you described as faithful tithing and offering?

[Slug1]

The best church I attended in regard to giving never "passed the plate," but only stuck a box in the back of the church and trusted God for what they needed. The church exploded in finances and growth. I believe the pastors believed in the 10% tithe, but they did not over-teach it.

The churches explosion in finances did not happen due to not over-teaching of tithing, nor the placing of the collection box at the back of the sanctuary. So what do you believe is the reason for what you described as, faithful tithing and offering?

[Aristarkos]

Well, "the Law" made tithing a requirement. Many of today's tithe related doctrines that are enforced follow this enforcement quality that the Law instilled. I pray that we all know, God's intention for the Law enforcement was to ensure man (specifically the Israelis) that man could not fulfill all that is enforced. Well, today it's the same and not all can fulfill a "tithe" doctrine enforcement in any given church.

However, the principle of the tithe was a matter of relationship with God BEFORE the Law came into existence. But by including this element about relationship with God as a statute in the Law, God made what should be of the heart/a relational trust quality in a relationship with Him ... a burden! Again to show man they can't do it without feeling burdened and to this day, that burden continues when "enforced" as a law of a church, cept renamed as "doctrine."

Study about Abraham's relationship with God. Specifically about his faith and his offering back to God as an element of faithful trust in God, the first fruits from any provision he was given.

I think I understand what you're trying to say, but Abraham was the first mentioned in Scripture who tithed, to Melchizedek — not without meaning BTW. It was with the seed — that which God recognized like that — tithing became a part of the Law. Of others I can't recall they ever tithed or is mentioned in Scripture. Paul never writes about it except in Hebrews.

Aristarkos

[Pbminimum]

Or so they think.......

They are just ignorant in believing they are blessed, but actually in bondage, I assume ?

[Slug1]

I think I understand what you're trying to say, but Abraham was the first mentioned in Scripture who tithed, to Melchizedek — not without meaning BTW. It was with the seed — that which God recognized like that — tithing became a part of the Law. Of others I can't recall they ever tithed or is mentioned in Scripture. Paul never writes about it except in Hebrews.

Aristarkos

Jacob also tithed. The heart of the matter, is that tithing was about faith and trust in God long (about 600 years) before the Law.

[Brother Mark]

Jacob also tithed. The heart of the matter, is that tithing was about faith and trust in God long (about 600 years) before the Law.

It's also what was in their heart. God didn't ask for it. They chose to do it freely. Also, under the law, there were 3 tithes required for a total of about 23.3% a year and it was never money that was tithed. It was always either plants or animals. When Abraham tithed, he gave of all that he had, one time. It doesn't appear to be an ongoing process for him.

Tithing, none of it, is taught after the gospels. Giving is taught. The only place Jesus spoke about it was to Pharisees who were under the law. Jesus didn't appeal to pre-law about that either. And, when Jesus commented on it, it was also about plants and animals and not about money. Making the tithe about money is one mistake that the church has made. It was not about money under the law.

[Slug1]

It's also what was in their heart. God didn't ask for it. They chose to do it freely. Also, under the law, there were 3 tithes required for a total of about 23.3% a year and it was never money that was tithed. It was always either plants or animals. When Abraham tithed, he gave of all that he had, one time. It doesn't appear to be an ongoing process for him.

Tithing, none of it, is taught after the gospels. Giving is taught. The only place Jesus spoke about it was to Pharisees who were under the law. Jesus didn't appeal to pre-law about that either. And, when Jesus commented on it, it was also about plants and animals and not about money. Making the tithe about money is one mistake that the church has made. It was not about money under the law.

This is why meaning of "provisions" and not money should be utilized for this topic in relation to "giving"