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Thread: Is the Tithe a Bondage?

  1. #1
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    Is the Tithe a Bondage?

    I have close acquaintances who have given what they call their "Tithe." And I've been aghast that they have felt the need to obligate themselves to an outmoded rule under the Law of Moses. Some even given a tenth of their *Gross Income!* If a business person did this, they could go broke immediately!

    I hear everything from God threatened a curse in Malachi to those who didn't pay a tithe to the promise of a 100 fold blessing to those who give. I'm told that we should be charitable, but in the NT Scriptures I don't find anywhere that the Tithe must be paid. I'm excluding here the NT Gospels, which are actually mostly in the OT era.

    What I find is that Paul considered the Tithe and the totality of OT regulations as a "bondage." Though the Law of Moses was indeed considered a great blessing, as a temporary reprieve from guilty and punishment, I don't find that it was ever intended to be our ultimate end. It was, as I said, viewed as a "bondage," from which we are now, in the NT, relieved.

    To put people under the Tithe is, therefore, a bondage to me. And it causes Christians to be internally dishonest when they claim to be observant in this respect and likely are not. In fact, if Christians were free, they could consider what the actual needs of their church are, and do their equivalent part. Giving may actually go up with more transparency, and with more freedom.

    What do you think? Is the Law a bondage or not?

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    Re: Is the Tithe a Bondage?

    I tithe and my relationship with God has been astounding compared to when I did not.
    Slug1--out

    ~Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men,~

    ~Honestly, the pain of persecution lets you KNOW you are still alive... IN Christ!~

    ~Colossians 1:28 Him we preach, warning every man and teaching every man in all wisdom, that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus.~


    ~"In the turmoil of any chaos, all it takes is that whisper that is heard like thunder over all the noise and the chaos seems to go away, focus returns and we are comforted in knowing that God has listened to our cry for help."~


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    Re: Is the Tithe a Bondage?

    Quote Originally Posted by Slug1 View Post
    I tithe and my relationship with God has been astounding compared to when I did not.
    Yea, you sound just like my brother. He also has minister's credentials, and has given all his life. He touts men of God who never even have spoken their need, and always had the money come in. I can't argue with personal faith. I'm only arguing with doctrine. God bless!

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    Re: Is the Tithe a Bondage?

    Quote Originally Posted by Slug1 View Post
    I tithe and my relationship with God has been astounding compared to when I did not.
    I give when/where there's need and my relationship with God has been astounding compared to when I did not.

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    Re: Is the Tithe a Bondage?

    Quote Originally Posted by Noeb View Post
    I give when/where there's need and my relationship with God has been astounding compared to when I did not.
    Amen
    Slug1--out

    ~Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men,~

    ~Honestly, the pain of persecution lets you KNOW you are still alive... IN Christ!~

    ~Colossians 1:28 Him we preach, warning every man and teaching every man in all wisdom, that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus.~


    ~"In the turmoil of any chaos, all it takes is that whisper that is heard like thunder over all the noise and the chaos seems to go away, focus returns and we are comforted in knowing that God has listened to our cry for help."~


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    Re: Is the Tithe a Bondage?

    Quote Originally Posted by randyk View Post
    Yea, you sound just like my brother. He also has minister's credentials, and has given all his life. He touts men of God who never even have spoken their need, and always had the money come in. I can't argue with personal faith. I'm only arguing with doctrine. God bless!
    Doctrine usually turns it to relationship with the church rather than with God and when a church is in need, they tend to force feed the doctrine.

    Thing is, when one is in relationship with God and all hell is busting loose, I have (as just a counselor) asked them if their relationship with God does involve trusting Him with provision. All say yes and then I will ask... do you tithe. Most say no. I ask it they've ever tithed, most say no. I ask if they think this can be a "change" they are willing to do in their relationship with God, most say no.

    But for the few who've made the change... their lives turned around when they put God FIRST in ALL parts of their life, including giving back to Him, first fruits.
    Slug1--out

    ~Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men,~

    ~Honestly, the pain of persecution lets you KNOW you are still alive... IN Christ!~

    ~Colossians 1:28 Him we preach, warning every man and teaching every man in all wisdom, that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus.~


    ~"In the turmoil of any chaos, all it takes is that whisper that is heard like thunder over all the noise and the chaos seems to go away, focus returns and we are comforted in knowing that God has listened to our cry for help."~


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    Re: Is the Tithe a Bondage?

    Quote Originally Posted by Slug1 View Post
    Doctrine usually turns it to relationship with the church rather than with God and when a church is in need, they tend to force feed the doctrine.

    Thing is, when one is in relationship with God and all hell is busting loose, I have (as just a counselor) asked them if their relationship with God does involve trusting Him with provision. All say yes and then I will ask... do you tithe. Most say no. I ask it they've ever tithed, most say no. I ask if they think this can be a "change" they are willing to do in their relationship with God, most say no.

    But for the few who've made the change... their lives turned around when they put God FIRST in ALL parts of their life, including giving back to Him, first fruits.
    Can't edit.

    When God has turned a person's or a families life(ves) around because they are not "truly" trusting God with the provision He is giving to them... a church, as a product never has to mention about "tithing" except as lessons to those new in Christ.
    Slug1--out

    ~Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men,~

    ~Honestly, the pain of persecution lets you KNOW you are still alive... IN Christ!~

    ~Colossians 1:28 Him we preach, warning every man and teaching every man in all wisdom, that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus.~


    ~"In the turmoil of any chaos, all it takes is that whisper that is heard like thunder over all the noise and the chaos seems to go away, focus returns and we are comforted in knowing that God has listened to our cry for help."~


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    Re: Is the Tithe a Bondage?

    Quote Originally Posted by Slug1 View Post
    Can't edit.

    When God has turned a person's or a families life(ves) around because they are not "truly" trusting God with the provision He is giving to them... a church, as a product never has to mention about "tithing" except as lessons to those new in Christ.
    Edit again...

    When God has turned a person's or a families life(ves) around because they are "truly" trusting God with the provision He is giving to them... a church, as a product never has to mention about "tithing" except as lessons to those new in Christ.
    Slug1--out

    ~Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men,~

    ~Honestly, the pain of persecution lets you KNOW you are still alive... IN Christ!~

    ~Colossians 1:28 Him we preach, warning every man and teaching every man in all wisdom, that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus.~


    ~"In the turmoil of any chaos, all it takes is that whisper that is heard like thunder over all the noise and the chaos seems to go away, focus returns and we are comforted in knowing that God has listened to our cry for help."~


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    Re: Is the Tithe a Bondage?

    I used to ‘tithe.’ Now I just try to be a generous person. I think Jesus is happy with me?
    "Your name and renown
    is the desire of our hearts."
    (Isaiah 26:8)

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    Re: Is the Tithe a Bondage?

    Many people believe they are in a bargaining situation with God. A Tithe and many other methods fit into that mindset, as people attempt to manage their sin by offsetting it with the doing of good deeds or following procedures. They think that they have their salvation in their own hands. Many tithe out of ignorance, and begrudgingly as well, thinking that this is a "minimum" amount. Neither of these is true. The tithe was like a tax, which was for the operation of the priesthood and the temple. Being as our priesthood is in heaven, and the earthly one abolished, we are free not to tithe. We are still obligated by the law of love to give to our neighbor in need. We still must show our faith in action. The free will gift is what God wants, with a clean conscience.

    Blessings!

    Many people believe they are in a bargaining situation with God. A Tithe and many other methods fit into that mindset, as people attempt to manage their sin by offsetting it with the doing of good deeds or following procedures. They think that they have their salvation in their own hands. Many tithe out of ignorance, and begrudgingly as well, thinking that this is a "minimum" amount. Neither of these is true. The tithe was like a tax, which was for the operation of the priesthood and the temple. Being as our priesthood is in heaven, and the earthly one abolished, we are free not to tithe. We are still obligated by the law of love to give to our neighbor in need. We still must show our faith in action. The free will gift is what God wants, with a clean conscience.

    Blessings!
    As the "thief" in the night, Christ is going to suddenly appear on the throne of Israel - not the antichrist.

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    Re: Is the Tithe a Bondage?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aijalon View Post
    Many people believe they are in a bargaining situation with God. A Tithe and many other methods fit into that mindset, as people attempt to manage their sin by offsetting it with the doing of good deeds or following procedures. They think that they have their salvation in their own hands. Many tithe out of ignorance, and begrudgingly as well, thinking that this is a "minimum" amount. Neither of these is true. The tithe was like a tax, which was for the operation of the priesthood and the temple. Being as our priesthood is in heaven, and the earthly one abolished, we are free not to tithe. We are still obligated by the law of love to give to our neighbor in need. We still must show our faith in action. The free will gift is what God wants, with a clean conscience.

    Blessings!
    The title of this thread is about the bondage of tithing. I feel you have offered some great examples about "when" tithing is about a bondage.

    Those that tithe due to relationship with God, do not suffer all you raised in your post.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aijalon View Post
    Many people believe they are in a bargaining situation with God. A Tithe and many other methods fit into that mindset, as people attempt to manage their sin by offsetting it with the doing of good deeds or following procedures. They think that they have their salvation in their own hands. Many tithe out of ignorance, and begrudgingly as well, thinking that this is a "minimum" amount. Neither of these is true. The tithe was like a tax, which was for the operation of the priesthood and the temple. Being as our priesthood is in heaven, and the earthly one abolished, we are free not to tithe. We are still obligated by the law of love to give to our neighbor in need. We still must show our faith in action. The free will gift is what God wants, with a clean conscience.

    Blessings!
    The title of this thread is about the bondage of tithing. I feel you have offered some great examples about "when" tithing is about a bondage.

    Those that tithe due to relationship with God, do not suffer all you raised in your post.
    Slug1--out

    ~Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men,~

    ~Honestly, the pain of persecution lets you KNOW you are still alive... IN Christ!~

    ~Colossians 1:28 Him we preach, warning every man and teaching every man in all wisdom, that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus.~


    ~"In the turmoil of any chaos, all it takes is that whisper that is heard like thunder over all the noise and the chaos seems to go away, focus returns and we are comforted in knowing that God has listened to our cry for help."~


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    Re: Is the Tithe a Bondage?

    Or so they think.......

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    Re: Is the Tithe a Bondage?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aijalon View Post
    Many people believe they are in a bargaining situation with God. A Tithe and many other methods fit into that mindset, as people attempt to manage their sin by offsetting it with the doing of good deeds or following procedures. They think that they have their salvation in their own hands. Many tithe out of ignorance, and begrudgingly as well, thinking that this is a "minimum" amount. Neither of these is true. The tithe was like a tax, which was for the operation of the priesthood and the temple. Being as our priesthood is in heaven, and the earthly one abolished, we are free not to tithe. We are still obligated by the law of love to give to our neighbor in need. We still must show our faith in action. The free will gift is what God wants, with a clean conscience.

    Blessings!

    I lost rights in my life the day I fully committed to Christ. I'm really a slave of God. He doesn't need my money. But He owns my time. I'm a servant to others. This would make me bitter, to be a slave, except that God made me, and I belong to Him. My highest happiness comes in serving the One who made me.

    Again, He has never indicated He needs money--not in the least. He owns everything. He doesn't need my money. I need it more than Him.

    I feel that it is a good thing to be entrusted with a job, to have a little money. Then I can spend on what I see is needed. I can buy food for my family, a shelter, clothes, transportation, and a certain amount of quality of life.

    And when I need utilities, I pay for them. When the govt. wants my taxes, I pay them...or else.

    When God's house and ministers need money, I pay them...or they close up shop. If I care about the church, I find out what the financial needs are, and I pay my share.

    I don't give secretly in a plate, where some put in only a dollar, and a few others pay the lion's share. Nor do I like a main pastor collecting a hefty pay check when the region and the people have little money, and struggle to pay a pastor who complains that there isn't enough money.

    Of course, the pastor pays his due tithe, trusting that others will follow suit in the congregation to pay him his full amount. But inasmuch as he pays such a large Tithe he tends to fall short anyway.

    I hate to see people pay according to a formula. For me the formula is, what does your local church need to run, pay its ministers, and perform its services and ministries? If the church is large enough and wealthy enough, then that's all that should be required. A bondage to a Tenth is not NT Bible. Sorry, friends--it is NOT biblical! It is indeed a *bondage.* Paul called the Law, and all 613 requirements, a bondage. It was indeed a blessing for its time. But it was a bondage.

    Now there remains certain bondages in our life. We have to pay taxes. We have to pay utilities. We have to pay for basic needs. But they are not recycled to us through NT Law. On the contrary, they are just common sense. And when we are properly informed by our Christians hearts and by our Christian reason, we do what we are supposed to do.

    The big problem I see is that people aren't informed. They need to get more involved in their church, and face up to whether they are doing their square share or not. Law does not accomplish that.

    We don't finance sacrifices anymore. We don't give out of our herds or orchards anymore as a people overall. At least then we could keep 90%!

    We cannot base our giving on a fixed proportion of our gross or net income. We simply need to be the slaves we are, to serve God with a clear conscience. We need to pay our bills, to God and to Man.

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    Re: Is the Tithe a Bondage?

    Quote Originally Posted by randyk View Post
    I have close acquaintances who have given what they call their "Tithe." And I've been aghast that they have felt the need to obligate themselves to an outmoded rule under the Law of Moses. Some even given a tenth of their *Gross Income!* If a business person did this, they could go broke immediately!

    I hear everything from God threatened a curse in Malachi to those who didn't pay a tithe to the promise of a 100 fold blessing to those who give. I'm told that we should be charitable, but in the NT Scriptures I don't find anywhere that the Tithe must be paid. I'm excluding here the NT Gospels, which are actually mostly in the OT era.

    What I find is that Paul considered the Tithe and the totality of OT regulations as a "bondage." Though the Law of Moses was indeed considered a great blessing, as a temporary reprieve from guilty and punishment, I don't find that it was ever intended to be our ultimate end. It was, as I said, viewed as a "bondage," from which we are now, in the NT, relieved.

    To put people under the Tithe is, therefore, a bondage to me. And it causes Christians to be internally dishonest when they claim to be observant in this respect and likely are not. In fact, if Christians were free, they could consider what the actual needs of their church are, and do their equivalent part. Giving may actually go up with more transparency, and with more freedom.

    What do you think? Is the Law a bondage or not?
    I would like to ask a counter question, what makes you think Gentiles are under the Mosaic Law? If so we should all be circumcised and keep all statutes. But Paul says in Gal. 5:2 « Behold, I Paul say unto you (the Gentiles), that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing. », the same law that talks about tithes says « And in the eighth day the flesh of his foreskin shall be circumcised » Lev. 12:3. So I don't really understand why people feel obligated to tithe and not to do the whole law.

    Aristarkos

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    Re: Is the Tithe a Bondage?

    Malachi 3:8 “Will a mere mortal rob God? Yet you rob me. “But you ask, ‘How are we robbing you?’ “In tithes and offerings. 9 You are under a curse—your whole nation—because you are robbing me. The whole nation of Israel. Malachi is written to Jews under the Old Covenant. Malachi 1:1 - The oracle of the word of the LORD to Israel through Malachi.

    Many churches teach that we as Christians, under the New Covenant, are commanded to give a minimum of 10% of our income to our church. Others teach that preachers of these churches are turning the 10% tithe for Israel from the Old Testament into a monetary, legalistic prescription for Christians under the New Covenant. I even once heard a Pastor make a challenge to his congregation to give 10% of their income for 90 days and if God does not bless them then he will give them their money back.

    In 2 Corinthians 9:5-7 we read: Therefore I thought it necessary to exhort the brethren to go to you ahead of time, and prepare your generous gift beforehand, which you had previously promised, that it may be ready as a matter of generosity and not as a grudging obligation. But this I say: He who sows sparingly will also reap sparingly, and he who sows bountifully will also reap bountifully. So let each one give as he purposes in his heart, not grudgingly or of necessity; for God loves a cheerful giver.

    I don't see a "specific percentage" given anywhere for Christians "under the New Covenant," but I certainly believe in giving and not just to our church. I also believe that everything we own belongs to God. If someone wants to give 10% or even more to their church, that is fine and you can't out give God. The problem I have is with Pastors, like the one I previously mentioned, who legalistically uses the 10% tithe to brow-beat people in that church with guilt. He even handed out pledge cards for people to fill out so they can pledge to give extra money on a monthly basis over a three year period above and beyond the 10% tithe directly to the "moving forward" project to build a new mega church. More than a few people have left that church because all that Pastor mainly talks about is money (primarily the 10% tithe) and building that new mega church (which to this day has not been built).

    During one sermon, he even mentioned that a member of that church came into his office one day somewhat irate and said that he is leaving that church because he is tired of hearing about money all the time and needs to find a church where he can go "deeper" in the Word. The Pastor mentioned that the word "deeper" is a code word for "I'm not tithing 10%." The Pastor went on to say that he checked the records and sure enough that member of the church was not giving 10% and some months gave nothing at all and then acted like good riddance to him! Whatever amount of money that you wish to give is between you and God, but we should not turn giving into a legalistic prescription.
    Galatians 6:14 - But God forbid that I should boast except in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world has been crucified to me, and I to the world.

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