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Thread: What and when is the thousand years?

  1. #31
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    Re: What and when is the thousand years?

    Quote Originally Posted by marty fox View Post
    What you stated here confirms my point that the binding and the reigning don't start and end at the same times
    Almost certainly not the EXACT same times, but there is an approximate 1,000 year overlap - which is the important thing to get.

  2. #32
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    Re: What and when is the thousand years?

    Quote Originally Posted by marty fox View Post
    Agreed and that has always been my point it isn't exclusive for the martyred ones of the beast or even the martyred ones yet I seam to always be told that it is and that I am wrong.
    I don;t think I have ever said that to you.

    This has always been my view of revelation as it was written to 7 churches of a soon coming persecution. Revelation was written to them not us so we need to read it standing in the shoes of the people that it was written to not from our point of view. Revelation was also written for us but not to us.
    Now you are making Revelation EXCLUSIVE to them.
    It wasn't. There were some parts which were EXCLUSIVE to each individual church, and some which would affect all 7, but then there is more which is for the WHOLE church, as it was to come at a yet further point in the future. In this respect (basically from Rev 4) it was written to us and not SPECIFICALLY to them, but rather for them, even as Rev 2 & 3 was SPECIFICALLY to them, and only for us.
    It is a complicated book.

  3. #33
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    Re: What and when is the thousand years?

    Quote Originally Posted by ForHisglory View Post
    I don;t think I have ever said that to you.


    Now you are making Revelation EXCLUSIVE to them.
    It wasn't. There were some parts which were EXCLUSIVE to each individual church, and some which would affect all 7, but then there is more which is for the WHOLE church, as it was to come at a yet further point in the future. In this respect (basically from Rev 4) it was written to us and not SPECIFICALLY to them, but rather for them, even as Rev 2 & 3 was SPECIFICALLY to them, and only for us.
    It is a complicated book.
    No I recall you saying it but many many others have

    Actually it was exclusively to the seven churches but I’m not saying that John is

    Revelation 1:4
    4 John,

    To the seven churches in the province of Asia:

    Grace and peace to you from him who is, and who was, and who is to come, and from the seven spirits[a] before his throne,

    And to confirm that we read this in the very last chapter

    Revelation 22:16
    16 “I, Jesus, have sent my angel to give you[a] this testimony for the churches. I am the Root and the Offspring of David, and the bright Morning Star.”

    There is no fairwell to the seven church’s after chapter 3. Like it or not I’m not saying this but Jesus is.

    Just like it is the corinthians and the Thessalonians that Paul is writing to about the rapture the message is still to the whole church. I am not saying that the seven churches will be on the earth during all of the events in the book of revelation or that all the events will effect them but the book was written exclusively to them not to us. But the message is hope for the whole church

  4. #34
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    Re: What and when is the thousand years?

    Correction in the post about I don’t recall you having said that to me still can’t edit my post LOL

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    Re: What and when is the thousand years?

    Quote Originally Posted by marty fox View Post
    Revelation was written to them not us so we need to read it standing in the shoes of the people that it was written to not from our point of view. Revelation was also written for us but not to us.
    What would be the point for it be written for us if nothing written in actually involves us? How do you make the thousand years work then? If you think it happens in this age and that it continues up unto the 2nd coming, how does that not add up to it also being written to us?

  6. #36
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    Re: What and when is the thousand years?

    Quote Originally Posted by divaD View Post
    What would be the point for it be written for us if nothing written in actually involves us? How do you make the thousand years work then? If you think it happens in this age and that it continues up unto the 2nd coming, how does that not add up to it also being written to us?
    It does involve us as I believe that we are apart of the thousand years. It is also hope for all ages including today as in we still reign even after we die. It could also be our age that Satan is released in defeated and the end of our world. Also all ages now see what we will have at the end of our world our future in the NHNE.

    It is no different as why did Paul tell the corinthians and the Thessalonians about the rapture when they didn’t experience it? It was an anticipated hope for all Christians the first century

  7. #37
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    Re: What and when is the thousand years?

    Correction again

    An antisapation scince the first century

  8. #38
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    Re: What and when is the thousand years?

    Quote Originally Posted by marty fox View Post
    No I recall you saying it but many many others have

    Actually it was exclusively to the seven churches but I’m not saying that John is

    Revelation 1:4
    4 John,

    To the seven churches in the province of Asia:

    Grace and peace to you from him who is, and who was, and who is to come, and from the seven spirits[a] before his throne,

    And to confirm that we read this in the very last chapter

    Revelation 22:16
    16 “I, Jesus, have sent my angel to give you[a] this testimony for the churches. I am the Root and the Offspring of David, and the bright Morning Star.”

    There is no fairwell to the seven church’s after chapter 3. Like it or not I’m not saying this but Jesus is.

    Just like it is the corinthians and the Thessalonians that Paul is writing to about the rapture the message is still to the whole church. I am not saying that the seven churches will be on the earth during all of the events in the book of revelation or that all the events will effect them but the book was written exclusively to them not to us. But the message is hope for the whole church
    I get what you are saying. yet the recipient of a letter is not necessarily who the letter is addressed to.
    This is why in Rev 2 and 3 there is a notation of which specific church it is addressed to.
    However Rev 4 then speaks of what is after, and so the 7 churches receive the letter on behalf of the whole church, and it is to us all as rev 22:16 shows.

  9. #39

    Re: What and when is the thousand years?

    Quote Originally Posted by marty fox View Post
    Yes we come to life and reign with Him when we accept Him as our saviour
    That's right.

    Originally posted by marty fox
    Wow fantastic post this is how we can reign now on this earth thanks. People need to start seeing things in Gods ways not our earthly ways.
    Yes. We reign by Christ in us, in love and mercy and patience and peace as Jesus teaches us. It's a fatal mistake not to see how Jesus reigns on earth.

    But as for these enemies of mine, who did not want me to reign over them, bring them here and slaughter them before me. Lk.19:27

  10. #40

    Re: What and when is the thousand years?

    Quote Originally Posted by ForHisglory View Post
    Actually incorrect. It is perceived as light in the view of eternity.
    Of course it's light in view of eternity. Knowing Jesus changes of view of time. The world celebrates what they consider long life, but to those who know the Lord, it isn't.

    for the child shall die an hundred years old; but the sinner being an hundred years old shall be accursed.
    Isa.65:20

    Quote Originally Posted by ForHisglory View Post
    Christians who go through this, and who are certainly in Christ do not find it light whilst experiencing it.
    and when they had called the apostles, and beaten them....they departed from the presence of the council, rejoicing Acts 5:40-41

    Quote Originally Posted by ForHisglory View Post
    An irrelevancy. What you are trying to argue is that because one thing is symbolic, so the other is also. Yet there is no problem with the binding of Satan being a symbol. Yet that symbol, like the vision of the beast, is of a REALITY.
    I know its reality. The spiritual is reality. That's been my position all along.

    Quote Originally Posted by ForHisglory View Post
    When the Beats rises, he is coming from a place which is NOT of here. When Satan is bound and placed in the pit, it is also NOT of here.
    You have this completely backwards. It's our Savior who isn't from here. And those who come to faith in Jesus are no longer from here. The beast and Satan are only from here and are trapped here.

    Quote Originally Posted by ForHisglory View Post
    And? What is the relevancy?
    The point is, Jesus viewed life differently from those who thought they were putting an end to James. But why wouldn't they, since they thought they put an end to the Word of God.

    Quote Originally Posted by ForHisglory View Post
    More irrelevancy which aren't even logical as a question.
    It's Jesus who binds Satan. It's Jesus who lives forever so that the nations should be deceived no longer.

    For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith. 1Jn.5:4

    Wait for Jesus to begin His reign all you like. I'm not waiting for something he's currently doing.

    Quote Originally Posted by ForHisglory View Post
    They don't and they can't. Rev 12:11 happens BEFORE Rev 13:7
    No it doesn't. Rev.13:7 is a physical manifestation of Rev.12:11. If you think the beast can defeat the saints, then you don't know Jesus.

    Quote Originally Posted by ForHisglory View Post
    I can see that you think it is only a question of perception. It isn't. It is actually a question of REALITY.
    My perception that the Word of the Lord rules over all is reality. It's the only reality there is or ever has been or will be.

    Quote Originally Posted by ForHisglory View Post
    You see Satan is NOT presently bound, so whether you perceive it that way or not, he continues to roam around as a roaring lion. This simply means your perception is wrong.
    No. It means people with faith (the sober and vigilant) need not fear a lion.

    Thy servant kept his father's sheep, and there came a lion....and when he arose against me, I caught him by his beard, and smote him, and slew him 1Sam.17:34-35

    we are more than conquerors through him that loved us. Rom.8:37

  11. #41
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    Re: What and when is the thousand years?

    Quote Originally Posted by journeyman View Post
    and when they had called the apostles, and beaten them....they departed from the presence of the council, rejoicing Acts 5:40-41
    I know its reality. The spiritual is reality. That's been my position all along.
    They were NOT rejoicing while they were being beaten.
    God isn;t ONLY about the spiritual. He is about the physical too.

    You have this completely backwards. It's our Savior who isn't from here. And those who come to faith in Jesus are no longer from here. The beast and Satan are only from here and are trapped here.
    Our fight is NOT against flesh and blood but against the principalities and powers.
    Satan is not from here, and nor is the beast.
    I have nothing backwards.
    We are FROM here, but we have a citizenship which is with Him.

    It's Jesus who binds Satan. It's Jesus who lives forever so that the nations should be deceived no longer.
    rev 20 states it is an angel who binds Satan not Jesus. The nations Are presently deceived so this is NOT speaking of a present reality.

    For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith. 1Jn.5:4
    Wait for Jesus to begin His reign all you like. I'm not waiting for something he's currently doing.
    It is the Father who is seated on the throne. Jesus is at His right hand and is NOT currently reigning as King of Kings. One day He will.
    We don;t only have a relationship with Jesus though, but also with the Father who is our Abba.

    No it doesn't. Rev.13:7 is a physical manifestation of Rev.12:11. If you think the beast can defeat the saints, then you don't know Jesus.
    I do know Jesus and Jesus gave Revelation to tell us that DURING the reign of the beast that the saints would be overcome.
    So I'll go by what Jesus says. Rev 13:9 tells those who have ears to hear to listen, and in verse 10 tells us we need patient endurance DURING that time.
    Rev 12:11 is nothing to do with Rev 13:7.
    Rev 12:11 is BEFORE Rev 13:7 whilst Rev 13:7 is related to Rev 7:13 & 14
    It is because of the saints NOW who lose their lives and who give testimony to the TRUTH of Jesus that Satan is defeated and cast out of heaven.

    My perception that the Word of the Lord rules over all is reality. It's the only reality there is or ever has been or will be.
    When you say this, are you meaning "He is God" in which case everyone would agree with you. However if you are referring to a SPECIFIC reign of Him on earth, then I think no one would agree with you.

    No. It means people with faith (the sober and vigilant) need not fear a lion.
    Thy servant kept his father's sheep, and there came a lion....and when he arose against me, I caught him by his beard, and smote him, and slew him 1Sam.17:34-35
    we are more than conquerors through him that loved us. Rom.8:37
    It does indeed mean we need to be sober and vigilant, but it also means that he is still deceiving even today.

  12. #42
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    Re: What and when is the thousand years?

    When you say this, are you meaning "He is God" in which case everyone would agree with you. However if you are referring to a SPECIFIC reign of Him on earth, then I think no one would agree with you.
    I would

    Thy Kingdom come.
    Thy Will be done, on earth as it is in Heaven.

  13. #43

    Re: What and when is the thousand years?

    Quote Originally Posted by ForHisglory View Post
    They were NOT rejoicing while they were being beaten.
    God isn;t ONLY about the spiritual. He is about the physical too.
    I understand nobody wants to be beaten. It's the reason why they were being beaten that they were glad about. Look--->But rejoice, inasmuch as ye are partakers of Christ's sufferings 1Pet.4:13.

    Sharing in what Jesus suffered? Suffering like Jesus suffered? Having a taste of what Jesus suffered?

    That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death Phil.3:10

    What? To experience the way Jesus died? To know the sufferings of our Lord? Puts an entirely different meaning to "taking the sins of this world upon himself at the cross", because what was done to Jesus was sinful. The rejection of God by mankind. Not the fruitloop heresy that the Father was punishing or rejecting his Son.

    Quote Originally Posted by ForHisglory View Post
    Our fight is NOT against flesh and blood but against the principalities and powers.
    And they're not reigning over us anymore. Jews are waiting for the Messiah to come and defeat their enemies and teach the Torah and bring peace to the world. Christians are waiting for Jesus to return and begin reigning. People who have faith in Jesus have the peace of God already, his peace that's above the understanding of unbelievers. People who have faith in Jesus know that defeated death, the last enemy of mankind and gives eternal life to believers now. And people who are waiting for Jesus to come and reign over them don't him very well, if at all.

    Quote Originally Posted by ForHisglory View Post
    Satan is not from here, and nor is the beast.
    I have nothing backwards.
    We are FROM here, but we have a citizenship which is with Him.
    I mean it's where the devil's mind is at. Through Christ, we see Satan is confined to this world, the lusts of it, the greed of it, which can never be filled, like a hole that has no end, a bottomless pit. And in whose eyes is the devil released from this pit? Only the ungodly, because his
    purpose is to raise an army against people who can't be destroyed. Can you say, insanity?

    Quote Originally Posted by ForHisglory View Post
    rev 20 states it is an angel who binds Satan not Jesus. The nations Are presently deceived so this is NOT speaking of a present reality.
    It's symbolic of the gospel going forth to the world. Are you still deceived? An I still deceived? Are millions of non Jews still deceived after believing Christ? Was Jesus's resurrection simply a precursor for not being deceived, with a more effective way of not being deceived to come later?

    Quote Originally Posted by ForHisglory View Post
    It is the Father who is seated on the throne. Jesus is at His right hand and is NOT currently reigning as King of Kings. One day He will.
    We don;t only have a relationship with Jesus though, but also with the Father who is our Abba.
    They're not divided. There is no relationship with God apart from his Word. He reigns over all. He proved it throughout history, which the scriptures attest to, the greatest example being during his ministry 2000+ years ago.

    Quote Originally Posted by ForHisglory View Post
    I do know Jesus and Jesus gave Revelation to tell us that DURING the reign of the beast that the saints would be overcome.
    In the eyes of the world, yes. In reality, no.

    Quote Originally Posted by ForHisglory View Post
    So I'll go by what Jesus says. Rev 13:9 tells those who have ears to hear to listen, and in verse 10 tells us we need patient endurance DURING that time.
    Rev 12:11 is nothing to do with Rev 13:7.
    Rev 12:11 is BEFORE Rev 13:7 whilst Rev 13:7 is related to Rev 7:13 & 14
    Jesus said we have power over all the enemy. It isn't possible for any minister of Satan to defeat you and me and that's the bottom line. That's reality. It's people who think otherwise that are living in a dream world.

    Quote Originally Posted by ForHisglory View Post
    It is because of the saints NOW who lose their lives and who give testimony to the TRUTH of Jesus that Satan is defeated and cast out of heaven.
    Yes, but that's Christs victory in us.

    Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out. Jn.12:31

    By "now",Jesus meant "because of this"...because of his victory, because he reigns supreme.

    Quote Originally Posted by ForHisglory View Post
    When you say this, are you meaning "He is God" in which case everyone would agree with you. However if you are referring to a SPECIFIC reign of Him on earth, then I think no one would agree with you.
    The specific reign for believers is by faith, by Christ in us. It's how we overcome this world.

    Quote Originally Posted by ForHisglory View Post
    It does indeed mean we need to be sober and vigilant, but it also means that he is still deceiving even today.
    Brother, God promised to show the world the truth. This doesn't mean everyone will receive it.

  14. #44
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    Re: What and when is the thousand years?

    Quote Originally Posted by journeyman View Post
    And they're not reigning over us anymore. Jews are waiting for the Messiah to come and defeat their enemies and teach the Torah and bring peace to the world. Christians are waiting for Jesus to return and begin reigning. People who have faith in Jesus have the peace of God already, his peace that's above the understanding of unbelievers. People who have faith in Jesus know that defeated death, the last enemy of mankind and gives eternal life to believers now. And people who are waiting for Jesus to come and reign over them don't him very well, if at all.
    Confused reasoning. The principalities and powers are still at work in the world which Jesus died for.
    He will reign over that world and we with Him, but this is not true right now.

  15. #45
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    Re: What and when is the thousand years?

    Quote Originally Posted by marty fox View Post
    It does involve us as I believe that we are apart of the thousand years. It is also hope for all ages including today as in we still reign even after we die. It could also be our age that Satan is released in defeated and the end of our world. Also all ages now see what we will have at the end of our world our future in the NHNE.

    It is no different as why did Paul tell the corinthians and the Thessalonians about the rapture when they didn’t experience it? It was an anticipated hope for all Christians the first century
    Thanks for explaining further. Apparently I initially misunderstood you, but now your position seems a lot clearer to me.

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