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Thread: Seven year tribulation period

  1. #76
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    Re: Seven year tribulation period

    Quote Originally Posted by Walls View Post
    You pose non-existent problems. No matter what chastisement falls on Israel, no matter how many are slaughtered, God has promised RESURRECTION. You are one-sided. You only deal with the chastisement and turn a blind eye to recovery. Hosea 6:1-2.

    1 "Come, and let us return unto the LORD: for he hath torn, and he will heal us; he hath smitten, and he will bind us up.
    2 After two days will he revive us: in the third day he will raise us up, and we shall live in his sight."


    And it is no good saying "many prophecies". You should have said "ALL", for if one prophecy remains promising mercy and restoration for Israel, then either God is a liar or Israel will be restored.

    Take Zacharias' prophecy in my previous posting. Will our Lord Jesus accomplish that or is God a liar? Your only way out of making God's Word of none effect is to CREATE more than one Israel - a notion that the Bible does not entertain. The Promise to Abraham is valid today and DESPITE Israel's perfidy and unfaithfulness God will bring it to pass. You only proffer verses concerning Israel's chastisement. You are unable to deal with with the dozens of scriptures predicting Israel's recovery. I propose you give a detailed exegesis on Zacharias' prophecy to show where I was wrong.
    The answer to our different beliefs, is to correctly identify the true Israel of God today.
    Are they just those people who call themselves Jews, citizens of the Jewish State of Israel and those still in dispersion. About 20 million people.

    Or are they Abrahams descendants by faith? He set us an example of obedience to God, being willing to sacrifice his son and then, many years later God did sacrifice His Son for our redemption and salvation.

    The Bible makes it crystal clear which one it is: Galatians 3:7 & 26-29, Romans 4:16, Isaiah 63:16, Isaiah 51:1-2

    So, the people that you insist must have God's Promises, no longer have any claim to them; they rejected them and forfeited their status, in the first century. That the Jews have had a recovery and have received help from God, is because it is God's plan to have them as a visible entity, actually a fake Israel, while God worked with the peoples who have accepted the Gospel. The mission of Jesus HAS been very successful and now it is the vast multitude of faithful Christians who are the Israelites of God. 1 Peter 2:9-10, Revelation 5:10

    In Luke 1:67-79, Zacharias prays the Jesus would deliver the Jews and set them free...… Sadly they rejected Him, so what Zacharias wanted didn't happen.

  2. #77
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    Re: Seven year tribulation period

    Quote Originally Posted by marty fox View Post
    This isn't in a literal sense as there is no spiritual difference between a woman giving birth and a woman not being able to. This is just saying that salvation is proven in obedience as the child bearing woman was being obedient in submitting to her husband and the church is living out her position in life.

    Child bearing was a great blessing in biblical times and this was showing a woman blessed by God for being obedient
    Exactly. If you cannot explain it, make it mean something else. This is what I expected from those who take "saved" as literal everywhere else but not here. And then, they still cannot explain their allegorical approach. Are you satisfied with your answer?

  3. #78
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    Re: Seven year tribulation period

    Quote Originally Posted by Keraz View Post
    The answer to our different beliefs, is to correctly identify the true Israel of God today.
    Are they just those people who call themselves Jews, citizens of the Jewish State of Israel and those still in dispersion. About 20 million people.

    Or are they Abrahams descendants by faith? He set us an example of obedience to God, being willing to sacrifice his son and then, many years later God did sacrifice His Son for our redemption and salvation.

    The Bible makes it crystal clear which one it is: Galatians 3:7 & 26-29, Romans 4:16, Isaiah 63:16, Isaiah 51:1-2

    So, the people that you insist must have God's Promises, no longer have any claim to them; they rejected them and forfeited their status, in the first century. That the Jews have had a recovery and have received help from God, is because it is God's plan to have them as a visible entity, actually a fake Israel, while God worked with the peoples who have accepted the Gospel. The mission of Jesus HAS been very successful and now it is the vast multitude of faithful Christians who are the Israelites of God. 1 Peter 2:9-10, Revelation 5:10

    In Luke 1:67-79, Zacharias prays the Jesus would deliver the Jews and set them free...… Sadly they rejected Him, so what Zacharias wanted didn't happen.
    "True Israel", "Fake Israel" ...? The Bible does not ever make such a statement. We are here to discuss the Bible. If you want to discuss men's inventions, why, I'm sure that there are Forums for this.

    And, as to "people no longer having claim to the contents of God's Promise", why, they have no say! A promise is a promise! It is unconditional! Perish the thought of a Christian who thinks that God makes empty promises. This is the height of unbelief.

  4. #79
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    Re: Seven year tribulation period

    Quote Originally Posted by Walls View Post
    Exactly. If you cannot explain it, make it mean something else. This is what I expected from those who take "saved" as literal everywhere else but not here. And then, they still cannot explain their allegorical approach. Are you satisfied with your answer?
    Yes I am look at the context of that paragraph in that scripture

    I believe that we are saved (from going to hell) when we accept Jesus as our saviour but our salvation (becoming more Christ like an obiedence) continues and won’t complete until we die for example baptism.

    What do you think it is saying in that verse as many child bearing mothers have died being unsaved?

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    Re: Seven year tribulation period

    Quote Originally Posted by Walls View Post
    Exactly. If you cannot explain it, make it mean something else. This is what I expected from those who take "saved" as literal everywhere else but not here. And then, they still cannot explain their allegorical approach. Are you satisfied with your answer?
    Did you see my response in post 62-63?

  6. #81
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    Re: Seven year tribulation period

    Quote Originally Posted by Walls View Post
    "True Israel", "Fake Israel" ...? The Bible does not ever make such a statement. We are here to discuss the Bible.
    Trinity
    "Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost"

    "Jesus came from Nazareth of Galilee, and was baptized of John in Jordan. And straightway coming up out of the water, he saw the heavens opened, and the Spirit like a dove descending upon him: And there came a voice from heaven, saying, Thou art my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased. "

    "in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby: And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh. For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father."




    Nativity
    "Now Now the birth of Jesus Christ was on this wise"

    "Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel"

    For unto you is born this day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord.




    True Israel. and Fake Israel.
    "For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel: Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called. That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed. "

    We be Abraham's seed. I know that ye are Abraham's seed; but ye seek to kill me, because my word hath no place in you. I speak that which I have seen with my Father: and ye do that which ye have seen with your father. They answered and said unto him, Abraham is our father. Jesus saith unto them, If ye were Abraham's children, ye would do the works of Abraham. But now ye seek to kill me, a man that hath told you the truth, which I have heard of God: this did not Abraham. Ye do the deeds of your father. Then said they to him, We be not born of fornication; we have one Father, even God. Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me. Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word. Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it. And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not. Which of you convinceth me of sin? And if I say the truth, why do ye not believe me? He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.

    "they of the circumcision which believed were astonished"

    a great multitude both of the Jews and also of the Greeks believed. But the unbelieving Jews stirred up the Gentiles, and made their minds evil affected against the brethren. "

    "a synagogue of the Jews: And Paul, as his manner was, went in unto them, and three sabbath days reasoned with them out of the scriptures, Opening and alleging, that Christ must needs have suffered, and risen again from the dead; and that this Jesus, whom I preach unto you, is Christ. And some of them believed, and consorted with Paul and Silas; and of the devout Greeks a great multitude, and of the chief women not a few. But the Jews which believed not, moved with envy"

    "Thou seest, brother, how many thousands of Jews there are which believe"

    "Make haste, and get thee quickly out of Jerusalem: for they will not receive thy testimony concerning me. And I said, Lord, they know that I imprisoned and beat in every synagogue them that believed on thee"

    "there came many to him into his lodging; to whom he expounded and testified the kingdom of God, persuading them concerning Jesus, both out of the law of Moses, and out of the prophets, from morning till evening. And some believed the things which were spoken, and some believed not. "

    "For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh,But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit"

    "For the promise, that he should be the heir of the world, was not to Abraham, or not to his seed, through the law, but through the righteousness of faith. "

    "Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children. But Jerusalem which is above is free "

    "he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit"

    "Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son. "

    "I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan."

    "ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham. So then they which be of faith are blessed with faithful Abraham. For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse"

    "He that is not with me is against me"

  7. #82
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    Re: Seven year tribulation period

    Quote Originally Posted by Walls View Post
    "True Israel", "Fake Israel" ...? The Bible does not ever make such a statement. We are here to discuss the Bible. If you want to discuss men's inventions, why, I'm sure that there are Forums for this.

    And, as to "people no longer having claim to the contents of God's Promise", why, they have no say! A promise is a promise! It is unconditional! Perish the thought of a Christian who thinks that God makes empty promises. This is the height of unbelief.
    You persist in making the Jewish people to be the only Israel. This idea simply cannot be correct.
    You must do it, or your belief in a 'rapture to heaven' of the Church, is impossible with the Jews on earth, going thru Tribulation.
    Both ideas are wrong, nowhere does Bible prophecy say Christians go to live in heaven and more that 20 prophesies tell us about the virtual demise of the Jews.

    Thanks David Taylor, your verses that tell us who the real Israel is, are good. But there are more, esp in the OT.
    Matthew 8:12 ...those who were born into the kingdom, will be thrown out into the dark.....
    John 10:1-27....other sheep I have....
    Isaiah 56:1-8...foreigners who choose to do My will, will have joy in My House of prayer....
    Jeremiah 12:14 I shall uproot the evil neighbors...Judah too, I shall uproot
    Isaiah 22:14 Assuredly the wickedness of Judah will never be wiped out; they will die for it.

  8. #83
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    Re: Seven year tribulation period

    Quote Originally Posted by marty fox View Post
    Yes I am look at the context of that paragraph in that scripture

    I believe that we are saved (from going to hell) when we accept Jesus as our saviour but our salvation (becoming more Christ like an obiedence) continues and won’t complete until we die for example baptism.

    What do you think it is saying in that verse as many child bearing mothers have died being unsaved?
    I take it then that you are unable to explain why a woman can be saved in childbearing. They say the best defense when one is unable to answer a question is to ask another question. You are satisfied with your answer, so lets leave it at that.

  9. #84
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    Re: Seven year tribulation period

    Quote Originally Posted by marty fox View Post
    Did you see my response in post 62-63?
    Yes. I do believe you did not write posting #63. You did not explain why, and how, a woman is saved by childbearing. You are satisfied with your answer. I'm happy to leave it at that. I did however note that there are any number of brothers ready to contend with me at all times, but in this case there was an unearthly silence.

  10. #85
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    Re: Seven year tribulation period

    Quote Originally Posted by David Taylor View Post
    Trinity
    "Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost"

    "Jesus came from Nazareth of Galilee, and was baptized of John in Jordan. And straightway coming up out of the water, he saw the heavens opened, and the Spirit like a dove descending upon him: And there came a voice from heaven, saying, Thou art my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased. "

    "in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby: And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh. For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father."




    Nativity
    "Now Now the birth of Jesus Christ was on this wise"

    "Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel"

    For unto you is born this day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord.




    True Israel. and Fake Israel.
    "For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel: Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called. That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed. "

    We be Abraham's seed. I know that ye are Abraham's seed; but ye seek to kill me, because my word hath no place in you. I speak that which I have seen with my Father: and ye do that which ye have seen with your father. They answered and said unto him, Abraham is our father. Jesus saith unto them, If ye were Abraham's children, ye would do the works of Abraham. But now ye seek to kill me, a man that hath told you the truth, which I have heard of God: this did not Abraham. Ye do the deeds of your father. Then said they to him, We be not born of fornication; we have one Father, even God. Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me. Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word. Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it. And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not. Which of you convinceth me of sin? And if I say the truth, why do ye not believe me? He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.

    "they of the circumcision which believed were astonished"

    a great multitude both of the Jews and also of the Greeks believed. But the unbelieving Jews stirred up the Gentiles, and made their minds evil affected against the brethren. "

    "a synagogue of the Jews: And Paul, as his manner was, went in unto them, and three sabbath days reasoned with them out of the scriptures, Opening and alleging, that Christ must needs have suffered, and risen again from the dead; and that this Jesus, whom I preach unto you, is Christ. And some of them believed, and consorted with Paul and Silas; and of the devout Greeks a great multitude, and of the chief women not a few. But the Jews which believed not, moved with envy"

    "Thou seest, brother, how many thousands of Jews there are which believe"

    "Make haste, and get thee quickly out of Jerusalem: for they will not receive thy testimony concerning me. And I said, Lord, they know that I imprisoned and beat in every synagogue them that believed on thee"

    "there came many to him into his lodging; to whom he expounded and testified the kingdom of God, persuading them concerning Jesus, both out of the law of Moses, and out of the prophets, from morning till evening. And some believed the things which were spoken, and some believed not. "

    "For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh,But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit"

    "For the promise, that he should be the heir of the world, was not to Abraham, or not to his seed, through the law, but through the righteousness of faith. "

    "Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children. But Jerusalem which is above is free "

    "he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit"

    "Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son. "

    "I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan."

    "ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham. So then they which be of faith are blessed with faithful Abraham. For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse"

    "He that is not with me is against me"
    It is true that we men must sometimes devise a name for a complex issue. But Israel is not a complex issue. Israel was a man who also went by the name of Jacob. He was offspring by "the will of the flesh" of Abraham via Isaac. Jacob, having been named Israel by God, produced, by the seed of his loins a great nation. The Bible, because origin is everything, calls Jacob "Israel", and calls his seed Israel. If a man or woman is from the line of Jacob's seed, he or she is called "Israel" by the Bible. So my question is; which persons were "False Israel" and why? The answer is clear. There is no True and False Israel. One is either born from the seed of Jacob as it was spread between four women, and then called "Israel" or one came from some other man's seed and one is NOT Israel. Simple.

    Some 1,300 years after Abraham started this line, Israel, now a great nation, had fallen into such rebellion against God that God divided the kingdom of Israel. For reasons best known to god, and most probably because they made up the vast majority, the ten Northern Tribes were called "Israel". The two Southern Tribes became known by the inspired writ as Judah. Now, Israel was divided because of Solomon's sins. Which are "True Israelites" and which were "Fake Israelites". The answer is clear. ALL are true Israel despite Solomon's sins. One is either born from the seed of Jacob as it was spread between four women, and then called "Israel" or one came from some other man's seed and one is NOT Israel. Simple. Sins do not change this.

    The prophets, starting with Moses, predicted that Israel would, through massive and continual breaking of the Law give to them, be carried off and dispersed by foreign nations. This came to pass. Starting around 720 BC the ten northern Tribes were deported and dispersed by Assyria and about 590 BC the two southern Tribes were carried off by Babylon. Only 2.5% of the two southern Tribes returned to prepare the coming of Messiah. My question is; "which, of these three groups is "True Israel" and which is "Fake Israel"? The answer is simple. Irrespective of Law-breaking, one is either born from the seed of Jacob as it was spread between four women, and then called "Israel" or one came from some other man's seed and one is NOT Israel. Simple.

    About 2,000 years ago, the promised Messiah was born, seed of an Israelite woman who is traced to Abraham in the gospel of Luke. He was surround by the seed, or offspring of the 2.5% Israelites who returned from Babylon. My question is, was Jesus, "True Israelite" or a "False Israelite". The answer is simple. Mary is traced back to Jacob and then to Abraham. She is an Israelite and therefore her seed - Jesus, is an Israelite too. One is either born from the seed of Jacob as it was spread between four women, and then called "Israel" or one came from some other man's seed and one is NOT Israel. Simple.

    This Man Jesus, offered Israel a New Birth by the Holy Spirit. They largely refused. What where they then? ISRAELITES! Nothing had changed except a new refusal to do God's bidding. They then murdered this Jesus, as they had murdered the prophets before Him. What were they then? ISRAELITES! God gave these Israelites another 40 years to change their point of view about (i) the Law of Moses, and (ii) the Man Jesus. They refused and killed the disciples of this Jesus. What were they after this? ISRAELITES! One is either born from the seed of Jacob as it was spread between four women, and then called "Israel" or one came from some other man's seed and one is NOT Israel. Simple. Sin, rejcetion of God and His Messiah do not change the seed of Jacob.

    The years is 2,000 AD. The seed of Jacob is dispersed all over the earth including Palestine. My question is; "Which are the "True Israel" and which are the "Fake Israel". The answers is; One is either born from the seed of Jacob as it was spread between four women, and then called "Israel" or one came from some other man's seed and one is NOT Israel. Simple.

    A man or woman can live in the USA, or he/she can live in Tierra Del Fuego. One can worship demons and one can celebrate the Passover. One can lie, steal and murder, or one can abide by Moses and the laws of his host country. One is either born from the seed of Jacob as it was spread between four women, and then called "Israel" or one came from some other man's seed and one is NOT Israel. Simple.

    I have defined Israel through their history. Now you show me the history of "True Israel", and what makes a man or woman "True Israel", and show me the history and origin that makes a man or woman "Fake Israel". If I am a Gentile, born outside of Jacobs' line I AN SIMPLY NOT AN ISRAELITE EVEN IF I CALL MYSELF ONE! And if I am of Jacob's line and I DENY that I am am an Israelite, I AM STILL AN ISRAELITE. Simple.

    The Bible does NOT recognize a "True Israelite" or a "False" one. There is only an Israelite - OR there is a Gentile! SIMPLE ... or?

  11. #86
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    Re: Seven year tribulation period

    Quote Originally Posted by Keraz View Post
    You persist in making the Jewish people to be the only Israel. This idea simply cannot be correct.
    You must do it, or your belief in a 'rapture to heaven' of the Church, is impossible with the Jews on earth, going thru Tribulation.
    Both ideas are wrong, nowhere does Bible prophecy say Christians go to live in heaven and more that 20 prophesies tell us about the virtual demise of the Jews.

    Thanks David Taylor, your verses that tell us who the real Israel is, are good. But there are more, esp in the OT.
    Matthew 8:12 ...those who were born into the kingdom, will be thrown out into the dark.....
    John 10:1-27....other sheep I have....
    Isaiah 56:1-8...foreigners who choose to do My will, will have joy in My House of prayer....
    Jeremiah 12:14 I shall uproot the evil neighbors...Judah too, I shall uproot
    Isaiah 22:14 Assuredly the wickedness of Judah will never be wiped out; they will die for it.
    See my posting #85 and find a flaw. Then we will discuss.

    The job of any instructor is not only to demonstrate the right way, but to observe the pupil for wrong techniques. I would say that you are so fixated on that event of 1st Thessalonians 4 that it clouds your thinking process. The Rapture has not been mentioned in this posting, nor is it connected with Israel. Yet you make it the foundation of your counter-argument. The JU-87 Stuka pilots of World War 2 often took heavy fire, for they were effective and feared. But a Stuka pilot's worst enemy was not enemy fire. It was a thing called "Target Fixation". The human can be so absorbed by the goal at hand that he will ignore all vital signs that he is in danger. "Target Fixation" is when the pilot is so intent on dropping his load right on target that he flies right into the target.

    You've got "Rapture Fixation". You bring it up in almost every posting even if others have not mentioned it. And, just like target fixation, you end up splattering your argument all over the place instead of dropping your bomb at the right altitude, then pulling out and letting your bomb hammer the target instead of you being strawberry jam. The brothers are very polite, and we are bound to admonish in love. But you are not doing your credibility any good by this wild flailing around of the Rapture. A smiley is probably in order here because I mean it as a brother that can't possibly sit in judgement.

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    Re: Seven year tribulation period

    Quote Originally Posted by Walls View Post
    I take it then that you are unable to explain why a woman can be saved in childbearing. They say the best defense when one is unable to answer a question is to ask another question. You are satisfied with your answer, so lets leave it at that.
    But I did answer in the other post and my question still stands as I would really like to know how you see it

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    Re: Seven year tribulation period

    Quote Originally Posted by Walls View Post
    Yes. I do believe you did not write posting #63. You did not explain why, and how, a woman is saved by childbearing. You are satisfied with your answer. I'm happy to leave it at that. I did however note that there are any number of brothers ready to contend with me at all times, but in this case there was an unearthly silence.
    Sorry my mistake I meant post #61 & 62

    Again I did answer your question

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    Re: Seven year tribulation period

    Quote Originally Posted by Walls View Post
    See my posting #85 and find a flaw. Then we will discuss.

    The job of any instructor is not only to demonstrate the right way, but to observe the pupil for wrong techniques. I would say that you are so fixated on that event of 1st Thessalonians 4 that it clouds your thinking process. The Rapture has not been mentioned in this posting, nor is it connected with Israel. Yet you make it the foundation of your counter-argument. The JU-87 Stuka pilots of World War 2 often took heavy fire, for they were effective and feared. But a Stuka pilot's worst enemy was not enemy fire. It was a thing called "Target Fixation". The human can be so absorbed by the goal at hand that he will ignore all vital signs that he is in danger. "Target Fixation" is when the pilot is so intent on dropping his load right on target that he flies right into the target.

    You've got "Rapture Fixation". You bring it up in almost every posting even if others have not mentioned it. And, just like target fixation, you end up splattering your argument all over the place instead of dropping your bomb at the right altitude, then pulling out and letting your bomb hammer the target instead of you being strawberry jam. The brothers are very polite, and we are bound to admonish in love. But you are not doing your credibility any good by this wild flailing around of the Rapture. A smiley is probably in order here because I mean it as a brother that can't possibly sit in judgement.
    The flaw in your post #85, is that the Jewish people are not all of Israel.
    In fact, the historical record indicates that most of them have no claim to descent from Judah and Benjamin. Let alone any of the other 10 tribes.

    I have to bring up the 'rapture to heaven' theory, as it is foundational to the discussion of who is Israel today. You must have the visible entity who call themselves Israel around, so they will be here for the Great Tribulation, while the Church sits in heaven. Neither idea is Biblical.

    God does know who are His own people, the absolute basis for that is faith and trust in Him. But Amos 9:8-9 makes it clear that the majority of them will be actual, traceable descendants of Jacob, in order for God's promises to the Patriarchs to be fulfilled. Some won't be, as Isaiah 56:1-8 tells us.

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    Re: Seven year tribulation period

    Quote Originally Posted by marty fox View Post
    Sorry my mistake I meant post #61 & 62

    Again I did answer your question
    OK. I'm not going to press it, and we can walk away from it. But I tell you, if I was answering that question I would go to lengths to explain why ...
    1. Romans 10:9 says, "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved."
    2. Romans 10:13 says, "For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved."
    3. Ephesians 2:8, "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God"

    ... and then up pops 1st Timothy 2:15, "Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety", a totally different way of being saved, open only to women, and by works.

    And what is more is the deafening silence from our normally vocal posters.

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