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Thread: Like a Thief in the Night

  1. #211
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    Re: Like a Thief in the Night

    Quote Originally Posted by Keraz View Post
    I agree and the Bible prophets agree too.
    There will be no nuke war, the Lord will send fire to destroy His enemies and wipe all weapons off the face of the earth. Ezekiel 7:14, Hosea 2:18, Isaiah 66:15-17, +

    The Lord will instigate an earth directed explosion on the suns surface, that will literally fulfil all the graphic prophesies about the great and terrible Day of the Lords fiery wrath.
    All the cosmic events prophesied cannot be caused by nukes on earth.
    I definitely agree that not everything can be attributed to what I believe will be a localized nuclear event.

    I also agree that it looks like there will be some solar event, like a cme.

    But even so, all those events can't be attributed to a cme.

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    Re: Like a Thief in the Night

    Quote Originally Posted by DurbanDude View Post
    I definitely agree that not everything can be attributed to what I believe will be a localized nuclear event.

    I also agree that it looks like there will be some solar event, like a cme.

    But even so, all those events can't be attributed to a cme.
    Actually all the things that will happen on the Day of the Lord's fiery wrath, CAN be attributed to a huge Coronal Mass Ejection. Scientists know of this possibility and Governments and the Military are preparing for it.
    One thing that makes it certain it will be a CME, is the time period between the initial flash and the arrival of the mass of superheated hydrogen plasma, of about 24 hours. During that time, people will be terrified as they see their doom approaching:
    Jeremiah 6:24-26 News of them [the coming disaster] has reached us and our hands hang limp, agony grips us, like a woman in labor. Do not go outside for terror is spread all around. In an instant, the despoiler is upon us.
    Jeremiah 30:6-7 Every man grips his sides and every face turns pale. How awful is that Day. It is a time of trouble for the descendants of Jacob, but some will be rescued out of it.
    Ezekiel 7:17 Every hand hangs limp, fright will cause their knees to be wet with urine.
    Ezekiel 21:5-7a All shall know that I, the Lord has drawn My sword.... groan bitterly until you collapse. All hearts will melt, all hands hang limp, all courage will fail.

  3. #213
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    Re: Like a Thief in the Night

    Quote Originally Posted by ewq1938 View Post
    There's no description of nuclear war in the bible. That's the strange stance and stranger still that people think God would need to use human made nuclear weapons when he wars.
    Not strange at all. God controls all of the events on earth, except free choice.

    Isa 54.16 “See, it is I who created the blacksmith
    who fans the coals into flame
    and forges a weapon fit for its work.
    And it is I who have created the destroyer to wreak havoc;
    17 no weapon forged against you will prevail,
    and you will refute every tongue that accuses you.
    This is the heritage of the servants of the Lord,
    and this is their vindication from me,”
    declares the Lord.

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    Re: Like a Thief in the Night

    Quote Originally Posted by randyk View Post
    Not strange at all. God controls all of the events on earth, except free choice.

    Isa 54.16 “See, it is I who created the blacksmith
    who fans the coals into flame
    and forges a weapon fit for its work.
    And it is I who have created the destroyer to wreak havoc;
    17 no weapon forged against you will prevail,
    and you will refute every tongue that accuses you.
    This is the heritage of the servants of the Lord,
    and this is their vindication from me,”
    declares the Lord.
    In times past the Lord did use other peoples to carry out His punishments. But the forthcoming Day of the Lord's fiery wrath will be a punishment from the Lord Himself. Amos 1...I shall send fire....
    He will strike unexpectedly; like a thief, using His Creation; the sun, to literally fulfill all the graphic prophesies about that terrible Day. Deuteronomy 32:22 & 34-35, Jeremiah 4-7-9, Isaiah 30:26-30, Joel 2:1-11, Revelation 6:12-17, +

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    Re: Like a Thief in the Night

    Quote Originally Posted by Keraz View Post
    In times past the Lord did use other peoples to carry out His punishments. But the forthcoming Day of the Lord's fiery wrath will be a punishment from the Lord Himself. Amos 1...I shall send fire....
    He will strike unexpectedly; like a thief, using His Creation; the sun, to literally fulfill all the graphic prophesies about that terrible Day. Deuteronomy 32:22 & 34-35, Jeremiah 4-7-9, Isaiah 30:26-30, Joel 2:1-11, Revelation 6:12-17, +
    Yes, sometimes God brings vengeance Himself. At other times, He uses agents of judgment, including angels, men, armies, and weapons. I'm not sure how you distinguish between the two in matters of NT events, and in matters of eschatological events? Don't you think you should answer that question before declaring *what you believe* to be the fulfillment of all these things?

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    Re: Like a Thief in the Night

    Quote Originally Posted by randyk View Post
    Yes, sometimes God brings vengeance Himself. At other times, He uses agents of judgment, including angels, men, armies, and weapons. I'm not sure how you distinguish between the two in matters of NT events, and in matters of eschatological events? Don't you think you should answer that question before declaring *what you believe* to be the fulfillment of all these things?
    Isn't I shall send fire.....Amos 1 and The Lord is coming in fire....Isaiah 66:15 The Lord is in heaven raining fiery coals upon the wicked...Psalms 11:4-6, + many other prophesies, sufficient for you?

  7. #217
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    Re: Like a Thief in the Night

    Quote Originally Posted by Keraz View Post
    Isn't I shall send fire.....Amos 1 and The Lord is coming in fire....Isaiah 66:15 The Lord is in heaven raining fiery coals upon the wicked...Psalms 11:4-6, + many other prophesies, sufficient for you?
    No. You see, you're just using the Scriptures at face value, without determining what they mean, and just stating your opinion. The following verses use the *same language,* and yet apply to historical events in which God did not literally send fire from heaven, like what happened with Sodom and Gomorrah. Instead, the exact same language can be applied to God's use of human armies, who brought divine judgment in the form of conquest, burning down villages and cities, and the countryside, as a consequence.

    The following verses did *not* refer to God throwing fire down from heaven, whether solar flares, lightning, or a miraculous fire from heaven. Instead, the same language applies to incidences in which God utilized human agencies, enemy armies, and other earthly agents of destruction. The fire did not have to come from heaven. It was simply directed from heaven, ie from God Himself.

    Isa 8.14 Israel has forgotten their Maker
    and built palaces;
    Judah has fortified many towns.
    But I will send fire on their cities
    that will consume their fortresses.”

    Amos 1.4 I will send fire on the house of Hazael that will consume the fortresses of Ben-Hadad.
    1.7 I will send fire on the walls of Gaza that will consume her fortresses.
    1.10 I will send fire on the walls of Tyre that will consume her fortresses.”
    1.12 I will send fire on Teman that will consume the fortresses of Bozrah.”
    2.2 I will send fire on Moab that will consume the fortresses of Kerioth. Moab will go down in great tumult amid war cries and the blast of the trumpet.
    2.5 I will send fire on Judah that will consume the fortresses of Jerusalem.”

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    Re: Like a Thief in the Night

    Quote Originally Posted by randyk View Post
    No. You see, you're just using the Scriptures at face value, without determining what they mean, and just stating your opinion. The following verses use the *same language,* and yet apply to historical events in which God did not literally send fire from heaven, like what happened with Sodom and Gomorrah. Instead, the exact same language can be applied to God's use of human armies, who brought divine judgment in the form of conquest, burning down villages and cities, and the countryside, as a consequence.

    The following verses did *not* refer to God throwing fire down from heaven, whether solar flares, lightning, or a miraculous fire from heaven. Instead, the same language applies to incidences in which God utilized human agencies, enemy armies, and other earthly agents of destruction. The fire did not have to come from heaven. It was simply directed from heaven, ie from God Himself.

    Isa 8.14 Israel has forgotten their Maker
    and built palaces;
    Judah has fortified many towns.
    But I will send fire on their cities
    that will consume their fortresses.”

    Amos 1.4 I will send fire on the house of Hazael that will consume the fortresses of Ben-Hadad.
    1.7 I will send fire on the walls of Gaza that will consume her fortresses.
    1.10 I will send fire on the walls of Tyre that will consume her fortresses.”
    1.12 I will send fire on Teman that will consume the fortresses of Bozrah.”
    2.2 I will send fire on Moab that will consume the fortresses of Kerioth. Moab will go down in great tumult amid war cries and the blast of the trumpet.
    2.5 I will send fire on Judah that will consume the fortresses of Jerusalem.”
    I am happy to admit to taking the prophesies at face value. What can be literally fulfilled; will be.

    Right. The Lord doesn't personally come in fire.
    On the forthcoming sudden and devastating Day of fiery wrath, He use His Creation the sun, His storehouse, Deut 32:34, as Isaiah 30:26a plainly tells us.
    Sodom and G. are good examples, Jude 1:7, that time God used a volcanic eruption to destroy them.

    It is plainly impossible for the soon to happen, Day of fiery wrath to be volcanic, as it will affect all the world and the cosmic effects are not related to volcanoes.

  9. #219
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    Re: Like a Thief in the Night

    Quote Originally Posted by Keraz View Post
    I am happy to admit to taking the prophesies at face value. What can be literally fulfilled; will be.

    Right. The Lord doesn't personally come in fire.
    On the forthcoming sudden and devastating Day of fiery wrath, He use His Creation the sun, His storehouse, Deut 32:34, as Isaiah 30:26a plainly tells us.
    Sodom and G. are good examples, Jude 1:7, that time God used a volcanic eruption to destroy them.

    It is plainly impossible for the soon to happen, Day of fiery wrath to be volcanic, as it will affect all the world and the cosmic effects are not related to volcanoes.
    That is the weakest answer possible, and doesn't even address the original point. You are not distinguishing between what is a miracle from God, what is a space-based phenomenon, and what are examples of divine judgment on earth, utilizing human and other agents. You are *just stating your own opinion* as to which is which!

    If you are arguing that endtime judgment must be *space-based* judgment, because this is a *universal judgment,* this is purely your opinion. Universal judgment can take place across the world by world war, and by a number of other natural disasters, affecting the whole planet.

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    Re: Like a Thief in the Night

    Quote Originally Posted by randyk View Post
    That is the weakest answer possible, and doesn't even address the original point. You are not distinguishing between what is a miracle from God, what is a space-based phenomenon, and what are examples of divine judgment on earth, utilizing human and other agents. You are *just stating your own opinion* as to which is which!

    If you are arguing that endtime judgment must be *space-based* judgment, because this is a *universal judgment,* this is purely your opinion. Universal judgment can take place across the world by world war, and by a number of other natural disasters, affecting the whole planet.
    It isn't my opinion to quote scripture. The prophets wrote about what God has planned for these end times.
    It seems that what they plainly said doesn't suit your beliefs. Tough!

    Isaiah 42:14-15 Long have I restrained Myself, kept silence and held Myself in check. I shall lay waste to mountain and hill, dry up the trees and fields. I shall dry up the rivers and empty the lakes.
    The Lord is about to act once again in His creation – The Lord’s Day of vengeance and fiery wrath - the next prophesied, worldwide event. The first of a series of judgements and punishments to His enemies and blessings to His faithful Christian people, Isaiah 44:1-3, leading to the culmination of this age – the Return of Jesus.

    Isaiah 42:11-17 The Lord will go forth as a warrior; He will shout His battle cry and will triumph over His enemies.
    I will guide the blind along unfamiliar paths and will make the way smooth for them. But those who do not trust Me, they will be put to shame.

    Isaiah 42:10-12 Sing a new song to the Lord – throughout the world, you on the seas and you that inhabit the coasts and islands. Let all people give glory to the Lord!
    This is the gathering and settling of His people into all of the holy Land.

    Isaiah 42:18-20 Hear now: you deaf people, you My servants that are blind: look and see! Who is so blind as My servants? So deaf as the messengers that I send? You have seen much, but perceived little. Your ears are open but you hear nothing.
    The Lord’s servants: every faithful Christian, all those who love Him and obey His Laws, fail to see or listen to the truths that are prophesied about these end times.
    Why is this?

    Isaiah 29:9-12 If you confuse yourselves, you will stay confused. For the Lord has poured on you a spirit of deep stupor, the prophetic vision of it all has become like the words in a sealed book.
    How can we really understand what the prophets are telling us?
    2 Peter 1:19 We have the word of the prophets, you do well to pay attention to it, as a light shining in a dark place and when the day dawns, it will illuminate your minds.

    Isaiah 29:22-24 This is no time for Jacob to be afraid, when they see what I will do for them, they will regard their God with awe. The confused will gain understanding and the obstinate will accept instruction.
    Jacob/Israel and Joseph; now refer to every faithful Christian person. Galatians 3:26-29
    So, it may not be until after the Lord has acted against His enemies, that His people will finally realize and understand His plans and purposes for them. Psalms 60:1-5

    Zechariah 10:6-12 I shall give triumph and victory to Judah and Joseph and in My compassion, I shall restore them as though I had never cast them off. My people will see and be glad, for I will deliver them. I will whistle to call them in and they will be as many as they used to be. Though dispersed among the nations and yet in far off lands, they will remember Me. I shall bring them home from wherever they are and will lead them into all the holy Land, until there is no more room. Their strength will be in God, they will march proudly in His Name. Ref: REB, some verses abridged

    The Lord’s Christian people are gathered and settled into their own Land, after He judges and punishes His enemies. Jeremiah 12:14-17, Ezekiel 20:34-38, Isaiah 35:1-10
    Unfortunately these events will come as a surprise to the secular world and to many Bible believers. Why should you be shocked and taken unawares by them?

  11. #221
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    Re: Like a Thief in the Night

    Quote Originally Posted by Keraz View Post
    It isn't my opinion to quote scripture. The prophets wrote about what God has planned for these end times.
    It seems that what they plainly said doesn't suit your beliefs. Tough!
    You apparently are willing to be self-satisfied, and not answer the tough questions. I asked how you distinguish between a supernatural, Sodom type of fire and earthly fires caused by invading armies. And your answer is, "Tough?"

    We are *both* quoting Scriptures, brother, and you know that. It is a matter of interpretation. Are you saying that anybody who quotes Scriptures can interpret them any way they want? Or, are you saying that somehow *your opinion* holds more weight than my opinion, or the opinions of scholars?

    Again, what is the basis for your determination that "I will send fire" refers in the endtimes to solar flares? There are passages in which the sun is said to be *part of it,* but certainly not the whole thing. But to say that the major judgment is an EMP goes quite beyond the specificity of Scriptures. In other words, you can't just quote that men will be scorched by the fire of the sun, and then say that this displaces a world wide conflagration, involving hostile militaries.

    As I just proved to you, the very language of "fiery judgment" can apply equally to solar flares as to supernatural fire or fires resulting from burning down the countryside in war. Your response? "Tough."

    Quote Originally Posted by Keraz
    Isaiah 42:14-15 Long have I restrained Myself, kept silence and held Myself in check. I shall lay waste to mountain and hill, dry up the trees and fields. I shall dry up the rivers and empty the lakes.
    The Lord is about to act once again in His creation – The Lord’s Day of vengeance and fiery wrath - the next prophesied, worldwide event. The first of a series of judgements and punishments to His enemies and blessings to His faithful Christian people, Isaiah 44:1-3, leading to the culmination of this age – the Return of Jesus.

    Isaiah 42:11-17 The Lord will go forth as a warrior; He will shout His battle cry and will triumph over His enemies.
    I will guide the blind along unfamiliar paths and will make the way smooth for them. But those who do not trust Me, they will be put to shame.

    Isaiah 42:10-12 Sing a new song to the Lord – throughout the world, you on the seas and you that inhabit the coasts and islands. Let all people give glory to the Lord!
    This is the gathering and settling of His people into all of the holy Land.

    Isaiah 42:18-20 Hear now: you deaf people, you My servants that are blind: look and see! Who is so blind as My servants? So deaf as the messengers that I send? You have seen much, but perceived little. Your ears are open but you hear nothing.
    The Lord’s servants: every faithful Christian, all those who love Him and obey His Laws, fail to see or listen to the truths that are prophesied about these end times.
    Why is this?

    Isaiah 29:9-12 If you confuse yourselves, you will stay confused. For the Lord has poured on you a spirit of deep stupor, the prophetic vision of it all has become like the words in a sealed book.
    How can we really understand what the prophets are telling us?
    2 Peter 1:19 We have the word of the prophets, you do well to pay attention to it, as a light shining in a dark place and when the day dawns, it will illuminate your minds.

    Isaiah 29:22-24 This is no time for Jacob to be afraid, when they see what I will do for them, they will regard their God with awe. The confused will gain understanding and the obstinate will accept instruction.
    Jacob/Israel and Joseph; now refer to every faithful Christian person. Galatians 3:26-29
    So, it may not be until after the Lord has acted against His enemies, that His people will finally realize and understand His plans and purposes for them. Psalms 60:1-5

    Zechariah 10:6-12 I shall give triumph and victory to Judah and Joseph and in My compassion, I shall restore them as though I had never cast them off. My people will see and be glad, for I will deliver them. I will whistle to call them in and they will be as many as they used to be. Though dispersed among the nations and yet in far off lands, they will remember Me. I shall bring them home from wherever they are and will lead them into all the holy Land, until there is no more room. Their strength will be in God, they will march proudly in His Name. Ref: REB, some verses abridged

    The Lord’s Christian people are gathered and settled into their own Land, after He judges and punishes His enemies. Jeremiah 12:14-17, Ezekiel 20:34-38, Isaiah 35:1-10
    Unfortunately these events will come as a surprise to the secular world and to many Bible believers. Why should you be shocked and taken unawares by them?
    So, you're saying that everyone who rejects your "prophecy" is hard-hearted, deaf, and rebelling against the word of the Lord? This is what happens when you stake your reputation on a single prognostication.

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    Re: Like a Thief in the Night

    Quote Originally Posted by randyk View Post
    You apparently are willing to be self-satisfied, and not answer the tough questions. I asked how you distinguish between a supernatural, Sodom type of fire and earthly fires caused by invading armies. And your answer is, "Tough?"

    We are *both* quoting Scriptures, brother, and you know that. It is a matter of interpretation. Are you saying that anybody who quotes Scriptures can interpret them any way they want? Or, are you saying that somehow *your opinion* holds more weight than my opinion, or the opinions of scholars?

    Again, what is the basis for your determination that "I will send fire" refers in the endtimes to solar flares? There are passages in which the sun is said to be *part of it,* but certainly not the whole thing. But to say that the major judgment is an EMP goes quite beyond the specificity of Scriptures. In other words, you can't just quote that men will be scorched by the fire of the sun, and then say that this displaces a world wide conflagration, involving hostile militaries.

    As I just proved to you, the very language of "fiery judgment" can apply equally to solar flares as to supernatural fire or fires resulting from burning down the countryside in war. Your response? "Tough."



    So, you're saying that everyone who rejects your "prophecy" is hard-hearted, deaf, and rebelling against the word of the Lord? This is what happens when you stake your reputation on a single prognostication.
    NOT my prophecy! My task is to present what the Prophets Wrote.

    Basically, yes. The Bible says that the Lord's servants, namely Christians; ARE deaf and blinded to the Prophetic truths. Isaiah 42:18-20 But a few 'wise' people will understand. Daniel 12:10
    The 'wise' people are those who read and understand the plain Words of prophecy.

    I do not see people such as yourself, as rebelling against the Word, only having accepted and believed teachings that are not soundly based in the Bible.
    Therefore; the Lord puts a veil over peoples understanding, making it very difficult, if not impossible for them to know God's plans for us in these end times.
    Why He does this, you will have to ask Him.

    My point is; that this forthcoming Day of the Lord's fiery wrath, which is plainly stated to come from the sun; will take most everyone by surprise. THAT is what God wants, as it will test the faith of everyone, 1 Peter 4:12, and those who do as we are told; Call upon the Name of the Lord, will be saved. Joel 2:32, Acts 2:21

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    Re: Like a Thief in the Night

    Quote Originally Posted by Keraz View Post
    NOT my prophecy! My task is to present what the Prophets Wrote.

    Basically, yes. The Bible says that the Lord's servants, namely Christians; ARE deaf and blinded to the Prophetic truths. Isaiah 42:18-20 But a few 'wise' people will understand. Daniel 12:10
    The 'wise' people are those who read and understand the plain Words of prophecy.

    I do not see people such as yourself, as rebelling against the Word, only having accepted and believed teachings that are not soundly based in the Bible.
    Therefore; the Lord puts a veil over peoples understanding, making it very difficult, if not impossible for them to know God's plans for us in these end times.
    Why He does this, you will have to ask Him.

    My point is; that this forthcoming Day of the Lord's fiery wrath, which is plainly stated to come from the sun; will take most everyone by surprise. THAT is what God wants, as it will test the faith of everyone, 1 Peter 4:12, and those who do as we are told; Call upon the Name of the Lord, will be saved. Joel 2:32, Acts 2:21
    I got it. Take your word for it, without any real evidence whatsoever? Just your word that the Prophets mean such and such should be good enough for all--otherwise, if others do not agree with you, they are "deaf?"

    But I'm all for staking my values in eternal things. That much we can agree on. And I have no doubt that judgments are coming. But to deny that God uses anything but solar flares is off, in my estimation.

    Antichrist will be, I believe, a dangerous *military* power. "Who can make war against him?" If Antichrist will have such tight control over Europe, within the domain of his immediate rule, there are economic concerns we need to be aware of.

    Armageddon ultimately is going to involve "generals." If all we do is look for a Coronal Mass Ejection, we will miss what's going on in front of our eyes. Concern about military buildups affects us much the same way as a CME might. However, we need to focus on each potential crisis separately, and in different ways, as well. Each issue may require a different response materially, even if there is the same need to respond spiritually.

    Are you "deaf" to all biblically-pronounced judgments besides a Coronal Mass Ejection? The Scriptures certainly declare other judgments besides solar flares!

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    Re: Like a Thief in the Night

    Quote Originally Posted by randyk View Post
    I got it. Take your word for it, without any real evidence whatsoever? Just your word that the Prophets mean such and such should be good enough for all--otherwise, if others do not agree with you, they are "deaf?"

    But I'm all for staking my values in eternal things. That much we can agree on. And I have no doubt that judgments are coming. But to deny that God uses anything but solar flares is off, in my estimation.

    Antichrist will be, I believe, a dangerous *military* power. "Who can make war against him?" If Antichrist will have such tight control over Europe, within the domain of his immediate rule, there are economic concerns we need to be aware of.

    Armageddon ultimately is going to involve "generals." If all we do is look for a Coronal Mass Ejection, we will miss what's going on in front of our eyes. Concern about military buildups affects us much the same way as a CME might. However, we need to focus on each potential crisis separately, and in different ways, as well. Each issue may require a different response materially, even if there is the same need to respond spiritually.

    Are you "deaf" to all biblically-pronounced judgments besides a Coronal Mass Ejection? The Scriptures certainly declare other judgments besides solar flares!
    I thank you, Randyk; your replies are reasonable and not unpleasant.

    The Prophets mean what they say, I just point it out and try to put it all into a coherent order.
    Where you go wrong is in mixing up and conflating that sequence. Gog/M, AC, Armageddon and the GWTJ all come later. It is the next prophesied event, the Day of the Lord's fiery wrath that is coming next. Jesus confirmed that when He read Isaiah 61:1-2a, leaving off verse 2b and what follows up to verse 11, for the future.

    Why do you and many others; have such an aversion to God using the sun to punish the earth? CME's are a known natural thing, scientists have given out plenty of warnings about the likelihood of one that could send us back into the 1800's technology. Note; that there will be another CME at the 4th Bowl. Rev 16:8-9

    The thing is, this reset of our civilization needs to be seem as a natural event, so as the survivors can keep their disbelief of God and then worship the 'beast'. Rev 13:4
    But we Christians have another destiny, as Isaiah 61:3-11 and Isaiah 62:1-12.....they will be called the holy people, the Redeemed of the Lord....

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    Re: Like a Thief in the Night

    Quote Originally Posted by Keraz View Post
    I thank you, Randyk; your replies are reasonable and not unpleasant.

    The Prophets mean what they say, I just point it out and try to put it all into a coherent order.
    Where you go wrong is in mixing up and conflating that sequence. Gog/M, AC, Armageddon and the GWTJ all come later. It is the next prophesied event, the Day of the Lord's fiery wrath that is coming next. Jesus confirmed that when He read Isaiah 61:1-2a, leaving off verse 2b and what follows up to verse 11, for the future.

    Why do you and many others; have such an aversion to God using the sun to punish the earth? CME's are a known natural thing, scientists have given out plenty of warnings about the likelihood of one that could send us back into the 1800's technology. Note; that there will be another CME at the 4th Bowl. Rev 16:8-9

    The thing is, this reset of our civilization needs to be seem as a natural event, so as the survivors can keep their disbelief of God and then worship the 'beast'. Rev 13:4
    But we Christians have another destiny, as Isaiah 61:3-11 and Isaiah 62:1-12.....they will be called the holy people, the Redeemed of the Lord....
    Very friendly post! Thank you brother. I do accept the possibility of a CME. As I said, I think it is part of the endtime judgment upon the Kingdom of the Beast. All I'm saying is that there are other bad things happening too. We'll talk later...

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