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Thread: Do true miracles of God happen today?

  1. #16
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    Re: Do true miracles of God happen today?

    Quote Originally Posted by jayne View Post
    True words.



    I like this. ^^ Just think what would happen if just a handful of Christians in every single church rejected "worldiness" [we can't escape the world, itself] and started a move to holiness with the intent of affecting their church body.



    I'll give a synopsis of it when it's over. I say after because I have some people who really study each week and they can also give some great insights.

    I have about 12 - 15 people who come regularly each week. Another 4-5 come sporadically. One has been saved, one has been renewed, two who have never read the Bible have a wonderful personal study at home now, one man [who was already doing deacon work in his church] has been ordained and is working like a dog, and the Lord is still working on some others - including myself. It's powerful to see God work in people when the Bible is presented, discussed, prayed over, and treated like a treasure trove.

    I tremble sometimes when I think of what God could do if we cleansed ourselves and walked in holiness with him as a lifestyle.
    I think I like this one even more !

  2. #17
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    Re: Do true miracles of God happen today?

    Quote Originally Posted by jayne View Post
    True words.



    I like this. ^^ Just think what would happen if just a handful of Christians in every single church rejected "worldiness" [we can't escape the world, itself] and started a move to holiness with the intent of affecting their church body.



    I'll give a synopsis of it when it's over. I say after because I have some people who really study each week and they can also give some great insights.

    I have about 12 - 15 people who come regularly each week. Another 4-5 come sporadically. One has been saved, one has been renewed, two who have never read the Bible have a wonderful personal study at home now, one man [who was already doing deacon work in his church] has been ordained and is working like a dog, and the Lord is still working on some others - including myself. It's powerful to see God work in people when the Bible is presented, discussed, prayed over, and treated like a treasure trove.

    I tremble sometimes when I think of what God could do if we cleansed ourselves and walked in holiness with him as a lifestyle.
    Amen! Clearly God has entrusted you with people who desire Him and apply their discipleship "into" their lives and thus, into the lives of others (being servants). This is what true investment of discipleship is all about.

    Christians need to understand... do they invest into the Kingdom or do they invest into the world? (don't get me started about double-mindedness )

    The produce/fruit is clear, Christians who do become Christ-like servants and CAN be used by God to invest more (Luke 16:10) into the Kingdom. Or, Christians don't apply and remain unchanged and worldly (despite all those checked boxes) and God looks in any given church and finds none who are like His Son and thus, He can't use them for true Kingdom work

    But you do raise something important... those "few" who do reject worldliness and continue on serving in a church full of people who remain worldly... it's tough! One CAN ask God, WHY? Christ in them answers... "I'm why you keep on, keeping on..."

    Thank you for the pending outline of the study!

  3. #18
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    Re: Do true miracles of God happen today?

    Quote Originally Posted by jayne View Post
    Just think what would happen if just a handful of Christians in every single church rejected "worldiness" [we can't escape the world, itself] and started a move to holiness with the intent of affecting their church body.
    This reminds me of something I was led to touch on for a sermon last year (or maybe 2 years ago?). I will look for it.
    Slug1--out

    ~Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men,~

    ~Honestly, the pain of persecution lets you KNOW you are still alive... IN Christ!~

    ~Colossians 1:28 Him we preach, warning every man and teaching every man in all wisdom, that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus.~


    ~"In the turmoil of any chaos, all it takes is that whisper that is heard like thunder over all the noise and the chaos seems to go away, focus returns and we are comforted in knowing that God has listened to our cry for help."~


  4. #19

    Re: Do true miracles of God happen today?

    Here's how I understand it. Do miracles happen today? I do believe God works miracles when and where He wants.

    I believe the Apostles were given certain abilities... and that there are no apostles today.

    Here's what I believe about the Joel 2 passage...

    I believe when Peter said "THIS is that," that he spoke in specific reference to that which the others "saw" [and heard] that day (and which they had made specific comment in reference to), but not to the entire text he quoted (and I base this on what he then goes on to say further in Acts 3). Here's a commentary I fairly agree with, on this (with my comments below that, in the brackets and that which follows):


    [quoting Wm Kelly commentary]

    "As usual [speaking of the context of those persons in Acts 2], men arrange themselves in more than one class, some astonished, others hostile and scornful. Peter takes the lead in explaining with gravity and distinctness. He explicitly denies the unworthy thought of intoxication, which the early hour itself should have silenced as against God-fearing souls. It was really what Joel spoke of: not of course the fulfilment as it is to be in the last days, but an effusion of that nature. Indeed, the words of the prophet went in this beyond what that day saw accomplished; for 'all flesh' cannot fairly be limited to Israel, and God, Who was soon about to bring in Gentiles to the name of Christ, will bless the nations in the future kingdom, when all the ends of the world shall remember and turn unto the Lord, and all the kindred of the nations shall worship before Him [Daniel 7:27 (following the specific time period of v.25 [see also vv.20-21])]. The gospel now makes good the indiscriminate grace of God even more profoundly than will be under His future government, when He will show that the kingdom is Jehovah's, and that He is the governor among the nations.

    "In the latter day, when Joel's words will be fulfilled as a whole, the Spirit will be poured out, and if Israel enjoy the blessing freely, it will flow far beyond their narrow limits. God's ways will then be known upon earth, His saving health among all nations. Temporal blessing is then to be vouchsafed to Israel (Joel 2:19-27), and their great northern enemy is to be for ever disposed of, for Jehovah will do great things for His people and land, whatever the enemy may have prepared to do. 'My people', He says emphatically, 'shall never be ashamed.' Then as a distinct intimation the prophet [Joel] presents two announcements: the first, the outpouring of the Holy Spirit (vers. 28, 29); the second, external signs of judgment ushering in the days of Jehovah, the circumstances of which are detailed in Acts 3, till we come down to the closing account of their blessings once more. As the wonders above and below precede that day, so does the repentance of Israel prepare for their deliverance and blessing, and especially for the gift of the Spirit. We see the same principle here also.

    "For God, in pouring out of His Spirit now, does thereby associate believers with Christ exalted on high. Given in virtue of redemption the Holy Spirit sheds the love of God in their hearts, seals them for the day of redemption, and is the earnest of their inheritance. He dwells in them now, and will quicken their mortal bodies soon at Christ's coming. Besides, He is the blessed and divine bond, constituting them Christ's body and God's house. [...]"

    --William Kelly, Acts 2 Commentary [source: Bible Hub]

    [end quoting; bold underline, and bracketed insert mine; parenthesis outside of my brackets original]


    Acts 3:21 [speaking to "ye men of Israel," v.12 (unsaved persons as noted in v.13-15,17,19)] then states: "whom indeed it behooves heaven to receive until the times of restoration of all things of which God spoke by the mouth of His holy prophets from the age." [in contrast to that which He had heretofore kept "hidden in God"/was as of yet undisclosed]

    In vv.13 and 26 (Acts 3) the phrase "His Servant Jesus" (they had not been expecting the "suffering servant" aspects of His Person, only the "reigning-in-power King" aspects, though both aspects had been prophesied in the OT); and...

    ... there are TWO "raise" senses spoken of in Acts 3... v.15 speaking of His being "raised from the dead," but the other being "raised" to a position of prominence BEFORE His death (that is, to the position of 'a Prophet like unto Moses'...'raise up unto you of your brethren like unto me [Moses]; him shall ye hear in all things whatsoever he shall say unto you' and 'UNTO YOU FIRST God, having raised up [to a position of prominence BEFORE His death] His Servant Jesus, SENT him to bless you, in turning away every one of you from his iniquities'). The "ALL things which God spoke by the mouth of His holy prophets" (meaning here, OT prophecies) have not yet been fully fulfilled, but remain for a yet-future time (and I believe Joel is one such prophecy).

    The word "King" is only used [re: Jesus] TWO times in all of the epistles, and both of them are "future" [see Rev19:15b still speaking in "future tense"], 1Tim6:15 being one of those, says, "which IN HIS TIMES He SHALL SHEW [openly manifest], who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings, and Lord of lords"

  5. #20
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    Re: Do true miracles of God happen today?

    Quote Originally Posted by randyk View Post
    Wow, what a tough indictment brought against my fellow-Pentecostals! And yet, this is probably somewhat deserved. I belong to a Pentecostal denomination, and have been in Pentecostal denominations since 1971. But I was raised a Lutheran, which in my view is largely dead now--there are, however, individual pastors and churches within the Lutheran denominations that are still alive.

    So I have a kind of unique view on Pentecostal doctrine, and it is perhaps due to my outspokenness on it that I am somewhat marginalized by the churches I've been in. My belief is that it was a positive thing for Pentecostals to pursue belief in the Spiritual Gifts, since they are Scriptural. But when there came to be a *doctrine* that all Christians should exercise *all* spiritual gifts, problems set in.

    Once there was the belief that all *should* be speaking in tongues, prophesying, and performing miracles, it was natural to promote these as normal, and to denigrate, directly or indirectly, a lack of these experiences. The problem is, if the doctrine is wrong, Pentecostals would be guilty of promoting false spiritual phenomena, which is proscribed in Scriptures!

    So I appreciate your candid remarks. I continue to promote reform within the Pentecostal denomination that I am in. But I'm so far down the chain that I haven't yet presumed to address the leadership at the highest levels. I may very well do that, however, if I think it will serve any good purpose.
    I personally believe that there no Churches/Denominations that are truly set on doing the Word of God. There are too may vested interests. But, just as the seven Churches of Revelation, there are those individuals who want to do it God's way. But, as you have discovered, your voice will hardly be heard and you will be relegated to the fringes. They did this to the prophets, and they did it to our Lord Jesus. They will do it to you (and me) too. You cannot reform Christianity. Not even the Lord tries. Rather, He calls for Overcomers.

    But I digress.

  6. #21
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    Re: Do true miracles of God happen today?

    Quote Originally Posted by Walls View Post
    I personally believe that there no Churches/Denominations that are truly set on doing the Word of God. There are too may vested interests. But, just as the seven Churches of Revelation, there are those individuals who want to do it God's way. But, as you have discovered, your voice will hardly be heard and you will be relegated to the fringes. They did this to the prophets, and they did it to our Lord Jesus. They will do it to you (and me) too. You cannot reform Christianity. Not even the Lord tries. Rather, He calls for Overcomers.

    But I digress.
    As do I Walls. There are good churches with genuine believers around, though depending where your located they may be hard to find.

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