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Thread: When was satan kicked out of heaven?

  1. #46
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    Re: When was satan kicked out of heaven?

    Quote Originally Posted by ross3421 View Post
    My point is that they must be in heaven.

    1. John says they are in heaven.
    2. A third of the stars seen in heaven are cast to earth
    3. There is a war in Heaven with Michael and angels. Does this not happen in heaven?
    4. The dragon is cast of heaven to earth.
    5. Voices heard in heaven as the accuser (dragon) is cast DOWN.

    How do you respond to this.



    The dragon makes war with the offspring which we see in the next chapter.

    Rev 13
    7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them:




    I am not saying the woman is the state of NJ. The woman only becomes new after Christ returns aka NHNE. Before this the woman was to be the bride however she flees to earth and then commits fornication with the beast (wrong bridegroom), thus like the NHNE and all of us she too needs to become anew.
    Revelation 12:12
    12
    Therefore rejoice, you heavens
    and you who dwell in them!
    But woe to the earth and the sea,
    because the devil has gone down to you!
    He is filled with fury,
    because he knows that his time is short.”

    If you notice above it says heavens as more than one there is only one literal heaven were God dwells

    Revelation 12:5
    5 She gave birth to a son, a male child, who “will rule all the nations with an iron scepter.”[a] And her child was snatched up to God and to his throne.

    Now if you notice in the verse above that the child is snatched up to God and to His throne it doesn't say snatched up to God and to heaven.

    If you look at history Rome persecuted Israel and then the church and then back to Israel. So I see the woman as Israel whos first offspring was the none believing Jews then her other offspring was the saints


    I am a little confused so who exactually do you think the woman is before she gave birth?

  2. #47
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    Re: When was satan kicked out of heaven?

    Quote Originally Posted by marty fox View Post
    I am a little confused so who exactually do you think the woman is
    You never answered my many questions, but you stay on your script. Others also have shown that the woman cannot be Mary or Israel.

    The woman is the heavenly city Jerusalem.

    IS 66
    6 A voice of noise from the city, a voice from the temple, a voice of the Lord that rendereth recompence to his enemies.
    7 Before she travailed, she brought forth; before her pain came, she was delivered of a man child.
    8 Who hath heard such a thing? who hath seen such things? Shall the earth be made to bring forth in one day? or shall a nation be born at once? for as soon as Zion travailed, she brought forth her children.


    Now if revelation tells us there is a woman in the wilderness and she is a city would you not think that this woman can be a city also? Whether you think she is the same woman or not we are given the interpretation of what a woman is in Revelation itself.

    Rev 17
    18 And the woman which thou sawest is that great city, which reigneth over the kings of the earth.

  3. #48
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    Re: When was satan kicked out of heaven?

    [QUOTE]
    Quote Originally Posted by marty fox View Post
    Revelation 12:12
    12
    Therefore rejoice, you heavens
    and you who dwell in them!
    But woe to the earth and the sea,
    because the devil has gone down to you!
    He is filled with fury,
    because he knows that his time is short.”

    If you notice above it says heavens as more than one there is only one literal heaven were God dwells

    Psalms
    He that sitteth in the heavens shall laugh: the Lord shall have them in derision.

    Thy mercy, O Lord, is in the heavens; and thy faithfulness reacheth unto the clouds.

    The Lord hath prepared his throne in the heavens; and his kingdom ruleth over all.


    And there are many more

    I could go on but it is obvious you have not studied this out, as in about a second I could pull up many verses relating to the heavens where God dwells.

    If you look at history Rome persecuted Israel and then the church and then back to Israel. So I see the woman as Israel whos first offspring was the none believing Jews then her other offspring was the saints
    You have never addressed the 3.5 year supposed past period and Rome, Mary, and Israel

  4. #49
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    Re: When was satan kicked out of heaven?

    Quote Originally Posted by ross3421 View Post
    You never answered my many questions, but you stay on your script. Others also have shown that the woman cannot be Mary or Israel.

    The woman is the heavenly city Jerusalem.

    IS 66
    6 A voice of noise from the city, a voice from the temple, a voice of the Lord that rendereth recompence to his enemies.
    7 Before she travailed, she brought forth; before her pain came, she was delivered of a man child.
    8 Who hath heard such a thing? who hath seen such things? Shall the earth be made to bring forth in one day? or shall a nation be born at once? for as soon as Zion travailed, she brought forth her children.


    Now if revelation tells us there is a woman in the wilderness and she is a city would you not think that this woman can be a city also? Whether you think she is the same woman or not we are given the interpretation of what a woman is in Revelation itself.

    Rev 17
    18 And the woman which thou sawest is that great city, which reigneth over the kings of the earth.
    Sorry but I thought that I have answered your questions as they are all in my Rev 12 study I will repost it for you.


    I think the issue is what is a city? Is a city a bunch of buildings or the people of that city.


    Matthew 23:37-38
    37 “Jerusalem, Jerusalem, you who kill the prophets and stone those sent to you, how often I have longed to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, and you were not willing. 38 Look, your house is left to you desolate.

    Jesus was talking to the people the leaders of the city not the buildings

  5. #50
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    Re: When was satan kicked out of heaven?

    [QUOTE=ross3421;3513555]


    Psalms
    He that sitteth in the heavens shall laugh: the Lord shall have them in derision.

    Thy mercy, O Lord, is in the heavens; and thy faithfulness reacheth unto the clouds.

    The Lord hath prepared his throne in the heavens; and his kingdom ruleth over all.


    And there are many more

    I could go on but it is obvious you have not studied this out, as in about a second I could pull up many verses relating to the heavens where God dwells.



    You have never addressed the 3.5 year supposed past period and Rome, Mary, and Israel
    The verses you showed also mention clouds the heavens meant above but there still is a literal heaven


    Here are all of my answers


    Revelation chapter 12 is like a story right out of a fantasy novel, it’ s filled with amazing imagery and tells of a great epic battle of good versus evil but unlike a fantasy novel this story is true. Even though every Christian believes in every word of Revelation chapter 12 not every Christian agrees with the interpretation or the timing of the events in this chapter full of wonder.

    This is the interpretation I got from reading Revelation chapter 12 and as I go through it verse by verse I hope that I can bring some clarity to some of you reading this study. I don’t mean to push my view on people but I just hope that people reading it can see it in a new and different light. This chapter goes back in time and also reveals the woman and satan in different forms but the woman is always tied to Israel.

    Revelation 12:1
    1 A great sign appeared in heaven: a woman clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet and a crown of twelve stars on her head

    The sign described above is showing us that the woman in this verse is the nation of Israel and takes us back to Josephs dream in.

    Genesis 37:9-10
    9 Then he had another dream, and he told it to his brothers. “Listen,” he said, “I had another dream, and this time the sun and moon and eleven stars were bowing down to me.”
    10 When he told his father as well as his brothers, his father rebuked him and said, “What is this dream you had? Will your mother and I and your brothers actually come and bow down to the ground before you?”

    This verse takes us from the last book in the bible Revelation to the first book in the bible of the bible Genesis. Jacob who is Joseph’s father name was changed to Israel and he is the sun Rachel Joseph’s mother is the moon Josephs eleven brothers are the eleven stars and Joseph is the twelfth star.

    Revelation 12:2
    2 She was pregnant and cried out in pain as she was about to give birth.

    We now see the woman as Mary who was of Israel and she is about to give birth to Jesus.

    3 Then another sign appeared in heaven: an enormous red dragon with seven heads and ten horns and seven crowns on its heads.

    Another sign appeared in heaven a red dragon who is satan with seven crowned heads which symbolized world empires and ten horns which symbolized the complete nations or kingdoms of the world.

    I believe the seven world empires to be past world empires as laid out below as they were the seven world empires up until that time.
    1-Egypt
    2-Assyria
    3-Babylon
    4-Medes or Media
    5-Persia
    6-Greece
    7-Rome

    I believe the ten horns to be the kingdoms or nations of the world as we see in the verses below that the kingdoms or nations of the world were satan’s when he offered them to Jesus.

    Luke 4:5-7
    5 The devil led him up to a high place and showed him in an instant all the kingdoms of the world. 6 And he said to him, “I will give you all their authority and splendor; it has been given to me, and I can give it to anyone I want to. 7 If you worship me, it will all be yours.”

    Revelation chapter 12:4
    4 Its tail swept a third of the stars out of the sky and flung them to the earth. The dragon stood in front of the woman who was about to give birth, so that it might devour her child the moment he was born.

    We see later in verse nine that the stars which the dragon flung to the earth are the fallen angels that fell with him. We also now see that satan the red dragon is symbolized as king Herod (whose family color was red) who tried to kill Jesus when Jesus was born.

    5 She gave birth to a son, a male child, who “will rule all the nations with an iron scepter.” And her child was snatched up to God and to his throne.

    The son the male child is Jesus and we see His birth ‘reigning and ascension in this short verse.

    6 The woman fled into the wilderness to a place prepared for her by God, where she might be taken care of for 1,260 days.

    I believe the woman in the verse above to symbolize Jewish believers in Christ. After Jesus ascended back up to heaven on the year 30AD the first Christian Jews had about 3 ½ years or 1260 days of protection which ended on the day Stephen was stoned to death in
    34AD as we read in the verses below.

    Acts 7:57-60---Acts 8:1-3
    57 At this they covered their ears and, yelling at the top of their voices, they all rushed at him, 58 dragged him out of the city and began to stone him. Meanwhile, the witnesses laid their coats at the feet of a young man named Saul.
    59 While they were stoning him, Stephen prayed, “Lord Jesus, receive my spirit.” 60 Then he fell on his knees and cried out, “Lord, do not hold this sin against them.” When he had said this, he fell asleep.

    Acts 8:1-3
    1On that day a great persecution broke out against the church in Jerusalem, and all except the apostles were scattered throughout Judea and Samaria. 2 Godly men buried Stephen and mourned deeply for him. 3 But Saul began to destroy the church. Going from house to house, he dragged off both men and women and put them in prison.

    Revelation chapter 12:7-9
    7 Then war broke out in heaven. Michael and his angels fought against the dragon, and the dragon and his angels fought back. 8 But he was not strong enough, and they lost their place in heaven. 9 The great dragon was hurled down—that ancient serpent called the devil, or Satan, who leads the whole world astray. He was hurled to the earth, and his angels with him.

    Verse 7 starts with the word “Then” which proceeds after Jesus’ ascension and the start of the 1260 days of protection of the woman. This above and the verses below show us when satan and his angles were cast out on heaven. When did this happen?

    Luke 10:17-18
    17 The seventy-two returned with joy and said, “Lord, even the demons submit to us in your name.”
    18 He replied, “I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven.

    After Jesus sent out the 72 followers they proclaimed that the demons submitted to them because of Jesus’ and Jesus saw what was happening in the heavens. Now in the verses below shortly before Jesus’ death Jesus tells us when satan’s fall from heaven would happen.

    John12:31-33
    31 Now is the time for judgment on this world; now the prince of this world will be driven out. 32 And I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all people to myself.” 33 He said this to show the kind of death he was going to die.

    Revelation chapter 12:10
    10 Then I heard a loud voice in heaven say:
    “Now have come the salvation and the power
    and the kingdom of our God,
    and the authority of his Messiah.
    For the accuser of our brothers and sisters,
    who accuses them before our God day and night,
    has been hurled down.

    Verse 10 also starts with the word “Then” which tells us that the loud voice in heaven comes after satan is cast out of heaven.
    This verse also takes us back to Genesis when God cursed the serpent (satan) for tempting Eve and He foretold us that satan will wound Jesus but Jesus will defeat satan.

    Genesis 3:15
    15 And I will put enmity
    between you and the woman,
    and between your offspring and hers;
    he will crush your head,
    and you will strike his heel.”

    In the book of Job we read of how satan had access to God and at times satan would accuse us.
    Job 1:6
    6 One day the angels came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan also came with them

    But now satan can’t accuse Christians anymore because Revelation 12:10 says that “now the kingdom of God has come” and Jesus tells us in the verses below that the Spirit of God within the kingdom of God is what drives out demons.

    Matthew 28:28-29
    28 But if it is by the Spirit of God that I drive out demons, then the kingdom of God has come upon you. 29 “Or again, how can anyone enter a strong man’s house and carry off his possessions unless he first ties up the strong man? Then he can plunder his house.

    I believe that the timing of the kingdom of God which came in Revelation chapter 12:10 (which was after Jesus the male child was caught up to God at His ascension) was also the same time as the verses below in Daniel as Jesus was given all authority.

    Daniel 7:13-14
    13 “In my vision at night I looked, and there before me was one like a son of man, coming with the clouds of heaven. He approached the Ancient of Days and was led into his presence. 14He was given authority, glory and sovereign power; all nations and peoples of every language worshiped him. His dominion is an everlasting dominion that will not pass away, and his kingdom is one that will never be destroyed.

    Satan cannot accuse Christians anymore because at Jesus' death He removed our sin and guilt which also removed us from God's wrath and ended our alienation from God thus we are now redeemed as we read in the verses below.

    Colossians 2:13-15
    13 when you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made you alive with Christ. He forgave us all our sins, 14 having canceled the charge of our legal indebtedness, which stood against us and condemned us; he has taken it away, nailing it to the cross. 15 And having disarmed the powers and authorities, he made a public spectacle of them, triumphing over them by the cross.

    Revelation chapter 12:11
    11 They triumphed over him
    by the blood of the Lamb
    and by the word of their testimony;
    they did not love their lives so much
    as to shrink from death.

    Verse 11 started its fulfillment with the death of Stephen which we read in the book of Acts and it is still currently happening as Christians are still being martyred today. Christians are triumphing over satan by the blood of Christ and many have refused to reject Christ even onto the point of death.

    Revelation 12:12
    12 Therefore rejoice, you heavens
    and you who dwell in them!
    But woe to the earth and the sea,
    because the devil has gone down to you!
    He is filled with fury,
    because he knows that his time is short.”

    We now read that satan has been cast from heaven to the earth and that he is now full of fury but there is also a woe given to the earth and the sea. What is meant by the earth and the see?
    Let’s read a couple of verses from the next chapter in Revelation.

    Revelation 13:1& 11
    1The dragon stood on the shore of the sea. And I saw a beast coming out of the sea. It had ten horns and seven heads, with ten crowns on its horns, and on each head a blasphemous name
    11 Then I saw a second beast, coming out of the earth. It had two horns like a lamb, but it spoke like a dragon.

    We read in the above verses that one of the beasts comes from the sea and the other beast comes from the earth the very same locations that the woes are given too in Revelation12:12. The sea and the earth represent the people of the earth carnal worldly men as John refers to when Jesus was speaking to the Jews in the verse below

    John 8:23
    23 But he continued, “You are from below; I am from above. You are of this world; I am not of this world.

    We now see that the timing of the two beasts in Revelation chapter 13 was right after satan was cast from heaven to the earth which was shortly after Jesus’ ascension. The meaning of the woes was the havoc that these two beasts would cause in the world.

    Revelation 12:13-14
    13 When the dragon saw that he had been hurled to the earth, he pursued the woman who had given birth to the male child. 14 The woman was given the two wings of a great eagle, so that she might fly to the place prepared for her in the wilderness, where she would be taken care of for a time, times and half a time, out of the serpent’s reach.

    After satan was cast to the earth he again pursues the woman (Israel) but she is given two wings of an eagle and taken to the wildness for a set time of a time’ times and a half a time or 3 ½ year. Verse 14 takes us back to the time of the Exodus as Israel was taken to the wilderness by God for protection from Egypt upon eagles wings as mentioned in the verse below.

    Exodus 19:4
    4 ‘You yourselves have seen what I did to Egypt and how I carried you on eagles’ wings and brought you to myself

    Revelation 12:15-16
    15 Then from his mouth the serpent spewed water like a river, to overtake the woman and sweep her away with the torrent. 16 But the earth helped the woman by opening its mouth and swallowing the river that the dragon had spewed out of his mouth.

    The verses above also takes us back to Exodus as God protected Israel and used the red sea to protect Israel from Pharaohs pursuing army.

    I believe this to be the time from the start of the Roman and Jewish war until the destruction of Jerusalem in 70AD. The war started in 66AD and 3 1/2 years later Jerusalem was destroyed. God protected Israel from total destruction during that time to allow time for the Christian Jews to escape the city of Jerusalem. God also used that time for a grace period for some unbelieving Jews who could realized that Jesus’ prediction of the destruction of Jerusalem in the Olivet discourse was about to take place.

    I believe the river that the dragon spewed from his mouth was the first advancement on the Roman armies upon Jerusalem in 66AD. The Roman army surrounded Jerusalem but then retreated as Cestius Gallus the legate of Syria realized that he did not have enough troops for the task he then retreated to wait for more reinforcements. As the Roman army retreaded they were perused by the Jewish rebels and defeated.

    God used the time of the retreat as an opportunity for a window of escape for the Christian Jews who had heeded the words of Jesus in the Olivet discourse as we read below.

    Luke 21:20-21
    20 “When you see Jerusalem being surrounded by armies, you will know that its desolation is near. 21 Then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains, let those in the city get out, and let those in the country not enter the city.

    Matthew 24:15-16
    15 “So when you see standing in the holy place ‘the abomination that causes desolation,’ spoken of through the prophet Daniel—let the reader understand— 16 then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains.

    After the defeat of the Romans the Jews became arrogant and believed that God would be on their side and protect them and not allow the Roman’s to defeat them and conquer the city of Jerusalem.

    Revelation 12:17
    17 Then the dragon was enraged at the woman and went off to wage war against the rest of her offspring—those who keep God’s commands and hold fast their testimony about Jesus.

    Verse 17 tells us that the dragon then turned his fury to the rest of the woman’s offspring (as the woman was protected for a set time) and that the woman mentioned in verses 13-16 is not the church because the rest of her offspring “the ones who hold to the testimony of Jesus is the church. I believe that this was fulfilled during the persecution by Nero on the church which lasted for 3 ½ years or 42 months and that the persecution is mentioned in the very next chapter in Revelation as we read below.

    Revelation 13:5-7
    5 The beast was given a mouth to utter proud words and blasphemies and to exercise its authority for forty-two months. 6 It opened its mouth to blaspheme God, and to slander his name and his dwelling place and those who live in heaven. 7 It was given power to wage war against God’s holy people and to conquer them. And it was given authority over every tribe, people, language and nation

    In Revelation 12:14 we read that the woman is taken to the wilderness and protected for a set time and we don’t see her again until.

    Revelation 17:3-5
    3 Then the angel carried me away in the Spirit into a wilderness. There I saw a woman sitting on a scarlet beast that was covered with blasphemous names and had seven heads and ten horns. 4 The woman was dressed in purple and scarlet, and was glittering with gold, precious stones and pearls. She held a golden cup in her hand, filled with abominable things and the filth of her adulteries. 5 The name written on her forehead was a mystery:
    Babylon the great
    the mother of prostitutes
    and of the abominations of the earth.

    I believe the woman in Revelation chapter 17 to represent apostate Israel and the city of Jerusalem. Babylon the great is called a prostitute and Ezekiel in Ezekiel chapter 16 also calls Jerusalem a prostitute. In Revelation chapter 17 we read what happens to the woman after the time of her protection as she was destroyed by the beast and the 10 horns as God used them for His purpose as we read in.

    Revelation 17:16-17
    16 The beast and the ten horns you saw will hate the prostitute. They will bring her to ruin and leave her naked; they will eat her flesh and burn her with fire. 17 For God has put it into their hearts to accomplish his purpose by agreeing to hand over to the beast their royal authority, until God’s words are fulfilled.

    God judged apostate Israel for rejecting and killing their Messiah and allowed the temple to be destroyed as every sin sacrifice after Jesus’ death was a rejection of Jesus’ sacrifice which He paid for us.

    The Jewish historian Josephus in his account of the fall of Jerusalem records the horrific events of the destruction of Jerusalem which happened in 70AD. What happens to Babylon the great seems to fit the same details as Jerusalem as God used Rome (whom I believe to be the beast a demon in charge of Rome) to destroy Jerusalem for His purpose.

    This reminds me of Jesus’ words and prediction back in.

    Matthew 23:33-38
    33 “You snakes! You brood of vipers! How will you escape being condemned to hell? 34 Therefore I am sending you prophets and sages and teachers. Some of them you will kill and crucify; others you will flog in your synagogues and pursue from town to town. 35 And so upon you will come all the righteous blood that has been shed on earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah son of Berekiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar. 36 Truly I tell you, all this will come on this generation.
    37 “Jerusalem, Jerusalem, you who kill the prophets and stone those sent to you, how often I have longed to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, and you were not willing. 38 Look, your house is left to you desolate.

    This wraps up my study on Revelation chapter 12 and I believe it helps to show us the timing of some of the events in the book of Revelation.

  6. #51

    Re: When was satan kicked out of heaven?

    Quote Originally Posted by marty fox View Post
    Did you read the link I provided on revelation chapter 12? It may shed some light as it shows Satan kicked out of heaven when Jesus ascended back up to heaven
    For me to look at it like this a few apparent contradictions spring to mind, If this is Satan being bound so his house can be plundered, then it would mean his house is in heaven and he is now consigned to the earth?

    Also if you like me believe the third angels are cast out with him, is this when they are cast down to earth as well? Also the dragon and the third stars attempt to devour the Lord when he is born, so again it appears to contradict as it must be earlier.

    Also the new testament accounts show the activity of the demons, and of Satan and it appears to already be on earth? I view if it was it the cross, then there would be no demonic activity before the cross and then afterwards there would have to be a heap of fallen angels(demons) now running around.

    As to answer your question Satan is mentioned as being in heaven or the presence of God way back in the book of Job
    Im not sure why people use this as a proof text that Satan is in heaven, I view the sons of God as men and use this verse to show Satan was in the land of Uz (on earth) I even Think he led the Chaldeans as he indwelt their leader/king to attack Jobs family. Anyway you could be right or wrong and so could I, but its based on our preconceived viewpoints, so its innuendo in the fact it does not come straight out and say Satan is in heaven or Satan is on earth. Just trying to show as a proof text its pretty weak argument, but considering their isn't really any scripture that says Satan is in heaven then it would probably be the strongest.

    But there are other accounts that say specifically Satan is in heaven yet we both know why they are not used as proof texts, for they show the opposite if anything of Satan having access. Im thinking of Isaiah 14, where Isaiah proclaims to Satan You have said in your heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt myself above the angels, I will ascend above the clouds, etc etc so we see Isaiah is foretelling a future event. Just to add Rev 12 also shows Satan entering heaven, and it is a wonder and a sign. My point is its a one off event, Why would Isaiah tell Satan he will one day ascend to heaven if its a normal occurrence?

    To me Isaiah is a proof text that Satan one day in the future will enter heaven and it already lines up with how I view other scriptures, yet other people will have their own theology they wish to adhere to and will no doubt be able to dismantle Isaiahs proclamation. I see the timing in scripture as lining up with when the Lord leaves heaven, is it not logical that when the Lord comes to earth to rule, the current ruler could be a bit put out by it?

  7. #52
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    Re: When was satan kicked out of heaven?

    Quote Originally Posted by boangry View Post
    For me to look at it like this a few apparent contradictions spring to mind, If this is Satan being bound so his house can be plundered, then it would mean his house is in heaven and he is now consigned to the earth?

    Also if you like me believe the third angels are cast out with him, is this when they are cast down to earth as well? Also the dragon and the third stars attempt to devour the Lord when he is born, so again it appears to contradict as it must be earlier.

    Also the new testament accounts show the activity of the demons, and of Satan and it appears to already be on earth? I view if it was it the cross, then there would be no demonic activity before the cross and then afterwards there would have to be a heap of fallen angels(demons) now running around.

    Im not sure why people use this as a proof text that Satan is in heaven, I view the sons of God as men and use this verse to show Satan was in the land of Uz (on earth) I even Think he led the Chaldeans as he indwelt their leader/king to attack Jobs family. Anyway you could be right or wrong and so could I, but its based on our preconceived viewpoints, so its innuendo in the fact it does not come straight out and say Satan is in heaven or Satan is on earth. Just trying to show as a proof text its pretty weak argument, but considering their isn't really any scripture that says Satan is in heaven then it would probably be the strongest.

    But there are other accounts that say specifically Satan is in heaven yet we both know why they are not used as proof texts, for they show the opposite if anything of Satan having access. Im thinking of Isaiah 14, where Isaiah proclaims to Satan You have said in your heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt myself above the angels, I will ascend above the clouds, etc etc so we see Isaiah is foretelling a future event. Just to add Rev 12 also shows Satan entering heaven, and it is a wonder and a sign. My point is its a one off event, Why would Isaiah tell Satan he will one day ascend to heaven if its a normal occurrence?

    To me Isaiah is a proof text that Satan one day in the future will enter heaven and it already lines up with how I view other scriptures, yet other people will have their own theology they wish to adhere to and will no doubt be able to dismantle Isaiahs proclamation. I see the timing in scripture as lining up with when the Lord leaves heaven, is it not logical that when the Lord comes to earth to rule, the current ruler could be a bit put out by it?
    The way I see it is that before the cross satan and his fallen angles could go back and fourth to the earth and heavens like we see in Job but after the cross they were banished from heaven


    Why would Isaiah tell Satan he will one day ascend to heaven if its a normal occurrence?
    I think the difference here is that satan is saying that he will rule in heaven

  8. #53

    Re: When was satan kicked out of heaven?

    Quote Originally Posted by marty fox View Post
    Revelation 12:5-12
    [FONT="]5 She gave birth to a son, a male child, who “will rule all the nations with an iron scepter.”[a] And her child was snatched up to God and to his throne. 6 The woman fled into the wilderness to a place prepared for her by God, where she might be taken care of for 1,260 days.[/FONT]
    [FONT="]7 Then war broke out in heaven. Michael and his angels fought against the dragon, and the dragon and his angels fought back. 8 But he was not strong enough, and they lost their place in heaven. 9 The great dragon was hurled down—that ancient serpent called the devil, or Satan, who leads the whole world astray. He was hurled to the earth, and his angels with him.[/FONT]
    [FONT="]10 Then I heard a loud voice in heaven say:[/FONT]
    [FONT="][FONT="]“Now have come the salvation and the power
    and the kingdom of our God,
    and the authority of his Messiah.
    For the accuser of our brothers and sisters,
    who accuses them before our God day and night,
    has been hurled down.
    11 They triumphed over him
    by the blood of the Lamb
    and by the word of their testimony;
    they did not love their lives so much
    as to shrink from death.
    12 Therefore rejoice, you heavens
    and you who dwell in them!
    But woe to the earth and the sea,
    because the devil has gone down to you!
    He is filled with fury,
    because he knows that his time is short.”[/FONT]
    [/FONT]

    Some people believe that this was in the past and some people believe that it will be in the future but when did Jesus sat that it would happen?
    Tishri 23, 2069.

    John 12:27-33
    [FONT="]27 “Now My soul is troubled, and what shall I say? ‘Father, save Me from this hour’? But for this purpose I came to this hour. 28 Father, glorify Your name.”[/FONT]
    [FONT="]Then a voice came from heaven, saying, “I have both glorified it and will glorify it again.”[/FONT]
    [FONT="]29 Therefore the people who stood by and heard it said that it had thundered. Others said, “An angel has spoken to Him.”[/FONT]
    [FONT="]30 Jesus answered and said, “This voice did not come because of Me, but for your sake.31 Now is the judgment of this world; now the ruler of this world will be cast out. 32 And I, if I am [e]lifted up from the earth, will draw all peoples to Myself.”33 This He said, signifying by what death He would die.

    Jesus clearly tells us in the verses above that satan was banished from heaven at the time of Jesus death and resurrection
    [/FONT]
    Prophecy is nearly always in the past tense. With God, it is as certain as the history. Satan is cast out at the Psalm 82 trial. When he goes out from us, it will be night on the earth and no one can work.

  9. #54
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    Re: When was satan kicked out of heaven?

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnE View Post
    Tishri 23, 2069.



    Prophecy is nearly always in the past tense. With God, it is as certain as the history. Satan is cast out at the Psalm 82 trial. When he goes out from us, it will be night on the earth and no one can work.
    Could you explain a bit more please

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