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Thread: The Timing of Events

  1. #121
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    Re: The Timing of Events

    Quote Originally Posted by Keraz View Post
    Regarding a One World Government: This concept has been around for a long time and many overt and covert movements have promoted it. That such a political entity will happen, led by a charismatic man known to us as the Anti-Christ, is quite clearly prophesied in Daniel 7:23-24 and described in Daniel 11:21-45, paralleled in Revelation 17:12-13 and described in Revelation 13:1-18.

    The problem the promoters of the OWG have, is the refusal of the nations to relinquish their sovereignty. We all prefer to do our own thing and with the current world situation, this works OK. There are hiccups with nations that mismanage their economies, but it is against the interests of the IMF and the ‘gnomes of Zurich’ to allow a nation to go bankrupt.
    So, in order to force the nations to agree to a OWG; initially 10 regions, governed by 10 Presidents*, they know there has to be some kind of dramatic event to start this process. That planned event is to be a nuke attack in the Middle East. A mini WW3, that will shake up the world and have the beneficial effect of solving the Palestinian/ Israel conflict - they would both be gone!
    Iran will proceed with their avowed plans to wipe Israel off the map and the recent developments in Syria, Gaza and Israel, is an indication of how close we are to this attack. They know such an attack will result in their own destruction, but they will do it, as their religion pushes them into it. Ezekiel 35:6, Proverbs 8:32

    However, it won’t be retaliation by Israel or America that will thwart this secret attack by Iran and her allies onto Israel, the Lord Himself will take action and He will destroy them all, Psalms 11:4-6, virtually depopulating the entire Middle East region. Ezekiel 7:14, Ezekiel 30:2-5, Jeremiah 10:18, Jeremiah 49:35, Isaiah 34:5, Zephaniah 2:4-5 and many other prophesies about the terrible Day of the Lord’s fiery wrath.
    The rest of the world will mostly survive and as things will be then, agreement on a OWG will be easy. Not quite as planned, but a similar result!

    What happens to all the true believers in the Lord? Raptured to heaven? Nowhere does the Bible say that will happen at any time. 1 Peter 3:12 says it clearly; it will be the fiery test of our faith and we must stand firm, believing in His protection as we gather into all of the holy Land. Ezekiel 24:11-16, Isaiah 35:1-10, Isaiah 62:1-7
    Then: look up, for our redemption is near. Luke 21:25-28 and Jesus will Return within 20 years.

    *Google - 10 world regions.
    I agree to the concept of the one world government. I would like you to show me in the Bible where the one world government follows "the terrible Day of the Lords fiery wrath."

    The great earthquake of Rev 6:12 is the last event of the great tribulation, the time of the OWG. This is followed in 6:16 and 17 by God's wrath. God's wrath is the end of this age.
    Chapter 7 begins a new story. The great tribulation, the time of the OWG is found in 7:9-14. God's wrath is found in 8:5, the end of this age.
    The time of the 2 witnesses, the time of the great tribulation, the time of the OWG is found in 11:1-14. God's wrath follows in 11:18-19.
    Chapter 13 is the time of the OWG. God's wrath follows in chapter 14.
    Chapters 16 and 18-19 only show God's wrath, so a pattern can not be emerge from these chapters, except for the fact the OWG is not mentioned to come after God's wrath.

    Rev 15:1 "And I saw another sign in heaven, great and marvellous, seven angels having the seven last plagues; for in them is filled up the wrath of God."
    If the OWG came after God's wrath, these 7 plagues would not be the last because the OWG would still have to be destroyed!

    I agree that everyone won't be killed during the time of the great tribulation or the time of God's wrath. After the time of God's wrath, Gentiles will help Jews get to Israel. Again, no mention of a OWG at this time. This will be the start of the millennial kingdom.

    Quote Originally Posted by Keraz View Post
    Regarding a One World Government: This concept has been around for a long time and many overt and covert movements have promoted it. That such a political entity will happen, led by a charismatic man known to us as the Anti-Christ, is quite clearly prophesied in Daniel 7:23-24 and described in Daniel 11:21-45, paralleled in Revelation 17:12-13 and described in Revelation 13:1-18.

    The problem the promoters of the OWG have, is the refusal of the nations to relinquish their sovereignty. We all prefer to do our own thing and with the current world situation, this works OK. There are hiccups with nations that mismanage their economies, but it is against the interests of the IMF and the ‘gnomes of Zurich’ to allow a nation to go bankrupt.
    So, in order to force the nations to agree to a OWG; initially 10 regions, governed by 10 Presidents*, they know there has to be some kind of dramatic event to start this process. That planned event is to be a nuke attack in the Middle East. A mini WW3, that will shake up the world and have the beneficial effect of solving the Palestinian/ Israel conflict - they would both be gone!
    Iran will proceed with their avowed plans to wipe Israel off the map and the recent developments in Syria, Gaza and Israel, is an indication of how close we are to this attack. They know such an attack will result in their own destruction, but they will do it, as their religion pushes them into it. Ezekiel 35:6, Proverbs 8:32

    However, it won’t be retaliation by Israel or America that will thwart this secret attack by Iran and her allies onto Israel, the Lord Himself will take action and He will destroy them all, Psalms 11:4-6, virtually depopulating the entire Middle East region. Ezekiel 7:14, Ezekiel 30:2-5, Jeremiah 10:18, Jeremiah 49:35, Isaiah 34:5, Zephaniah 2:4-5 and many other prophesies about the terrible Day of the Lord’s fiery wrath.
    The rest of the world will mostly survive and as things will be then, agreement on a OWG will be easy. Not quite as planned, but a similar result!

    What happens to all the true believers in the Lord? Raptured to heaven? Nowhere does the Bible say that will happen at any time. 1 Peter 3:12 says it clearly; it will be the fiery test of our faith and we must stand firm, believing in His protection as we gather into all of the holy Land. Ezekiel 24:11-16, Isaiah 35:1-10, Isaiah 62:1-7
    Then: look up, for our redemption is near. Luke 21:25-28 and Jesus will Return within 20 years.

    *Google - 10 world regions.
    I agree to the concept of the one world government. I would like you to show me in the Bible where the one world government follows "the terrible Day of the Lords fiery wrath."

    The great earthquake of Rev 6:12 is the last event of the great tribulation, the time of the OWG. This is followed in 6:16 and 17 by God's wrath. God's wrath is the end of this age.
    Chapter 7 begins a new story. The great tribulation, the time of the OWG is found in 7:9-14. God's wrath is found in 8:5, the end of this age.
    The time of the 2 witnesses, the time of the great tribulation, the time of the OWG is found in 11:1-14. God's wrath follows in 11:18-19.
    Chapter 13 is the time of the OWG. God's wrath follows in chapter 14.
    Chapters 16 and 18-19 only show God's wrath, so a pattern can not be emerge from these chapters, except for the fact the OWG is not mentioned to come after God's wrath.

    Rev 15:1 "And I saw another sign in heaven, great and marvellous, seven angels having the seven last plagues; for in them is filled up the wrath of God."
    If the OWG came after God's wrath, these 7 plagues would not be the last because the OWG would still have to be destroyed!

    I agree that everyone won't be killed during the time of the great tribulation or the time of God's wrath. After the time of God's wrath, Gentiles will help Jews get to Israel. Again, no mention of a OWG at this time. This will be the start of the millennial kingdom.

  2. #122
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    Re: The Timing of Events

    Quote Originally Posted by 6paths View Post
    Again, no mention of a OWG at this time. This will be the start of the millennial kingdom.
    The MK is a OWG (one world government) but not the type of "OWG" that typically is used to denote Satan's global rule in the GT. The MK's OWG is a Christian theocracy with Christ as the King and ruler of the entire world and every person firmly under his control aided by his immortal saints and the infamous rod of iron.
    James 4:10 Humble yourselves in the sight of the Lord, and he shall lift you up.

  3. #123
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    Re: The Timing of Events

    Quote Originally Posted by 6paths View Post
    I agree to the concept of the one world government. I would like you to show me in the Bible where the one world government follows "the terrible Day of the Lords fiery wrath."

    The great earthquake of Rev 6:12 is the last event of the great tribulation, the time of the OWG. This is followed in 6:16 and 17 by God's wrath. God's wrath is the end of this age.
    Chapter 7 begins a new story. The great tribulation, the time of the OWG is found in 7:9-14. God's wrath is found in 8:5, the end of this age.
    The time of the 2 witnesses, the time of the great tribulation, the time of the OWG is found in 11:1-14. God's wrath follows in 11:18-19.
    Chapter 13 is the time of the OWG. God's wrath follows in chapter 14.
    Chapters 16 and 18-19 only show God's wrath, so a pattern can not be emerge from these chapters, except for the fact the OWG is not mentioned to come after God's wrath.

    Rev 15:1 "And I saw another sign in heaven, great and marvellous, seven angels having the seven last plagues; for in them is filled up the wrath of God."
    If the OWG came after God's wrath, these 7 plagues would not be the last because the OWG would still have to be destroyed!

    I agree that everyone won't be killed during the time of the great tribulation or the time of God's wrath. After the time of God's wrath, Gentiles will help Jews get to Israel. Again, no mention of a OWG at this time. This will be the start of the millennial kingdom.
    As your view of all the end time events is different from mine. I will post the sequence I have prepared, with scriptural support:
    End times sequence:
    Soon to happen: The great and terrible Day of the Lord’s vengeance and wrath, a CME sunstrike. Isaiah 30:26-28 & 30, Malachi 4:1 & 3 It will be the Sixth seal event of cosmic and worldwide effects and the Middle East will be virtually depopulated, cleared and cleansed, Ezekiel 30:1-5, Zephaniah 1:14-18 It will be the fulfilment of Psalms 83, Isaiah 2:12-21, 2 Peter 3:7 and Revelation 6:12-17 A small Messianic Jewish remnant will survive in Jerusalem. Isaiah 6:11-13 Many will die around the world: Isaiah 51:6, Jeremiah 9:22, but most will survive and eventually re-establish the infrastructure.

    The Seventh seal is ‘about’ a 20 year time gap on earth, until the Return of Jesus. [A half hour is a 48th of a day. 20 years is a 48th of 1000 years]

    In a short while: Isaiah 29:17, all the holy Land will be regenerated and the Lord’s people, Christian Israelites, be they true descendants of Jacob or grafted in, all born again believers; will gather in the new country of Beulah. Isaiah 62:1-5, Isaiah 35:1-10 They will live in peace and prosperity and 144,000 missionaries are selected from them, to go out to all peoples and proclaim the coming Kingdom of Jesus. Revelation 7 & 14, Isaiah 66:19

    The rest of the nations will form a One World Government, led by ten Presidents. Daniel 7:24, Revelation 17:12 Before long, three will be taken over and the other seven will confer their power onto another strong leader. Daniel 11:21, Revelation 13:1-8

    After a few years: a Northern confederation, led by a person referred to as Gog, will be motivated to attack Beulah – an unprotected nation, of great wealth. Gog and his horde will be totally wiped out and it will take seven years to bury them and clean the land. Ezekiel 38 & 39, Joel 2:20

    Sometime later, the strong leader of the World Government, will make a seven year treaty with Beulah. This marks the commencement of the seventieth ‘week’ [seven years] of Daniel. There is a 3˝ year period of calm and peace in the world. Daniel 9:27

    After that: the world dictator comes to Jerusalem in force and declares himself to be god in the new Temple. This starts the Great Tribulation, the Trumpet and Bowl judgements. The ‘Woman’- Christian Israelites who refused to violate the Covenant, Daniel 11:32, are taken to a place of safety for 1260 days. Zechariah 14:2, Revelation 12:14

    Then comes the Glorious Return of Jesus: The battle of Armageddon, Jesus destroys the army of the Anti-Christ by the Sword of His Word and chains up Satan.
    The regathering of Christian Israel, all those who have kept faithful. Matthew 24:30-31
    The 1000 year Millennium reign of King Jesus and His resurrected saints.

    The final attack against the holy Land and the armies are instantly cremated. Satan is cast into the lake of fire. Revelation 16:13-16, Revelation 19:17-21
    The Great White Throne judgement, and a New Heaven and a New Earth. Daniel 7:9-10, Revelation chapters 20:11-15 & 21:1-7

  4. #124
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    Re: The Timing of Events

    Quote Originally Posted by Keraz View Post
    I understand that we all must die and remain in the grave until the GWT Judgement after the Millennium. Daniel 12:13 and Job 14:10-12, just as Hebrews 9:27 says: We die and the next thing we know is the Judgment. No such thing as 'going up in our spiritual bodies'.

    The 7 Trumpets come after the 7th Seal. There is about a 20 year time gap between them.

    Your eschatology, Rev Man; leaves much to be desired. You make wild assertions about a so called 'rapture' and what you imagine will happen, that is contradictory to what the Bible actually says.
    You obviously love the notion that you will sit in heaven, watching those who disagreed with your beliefs, get their comeuppance. Realize this: Those who avoid God's discipline are not His children, but are illegitimate. Hebrews 12:8
    I will go back to ignoring your posts, its just a waste of my time.

  5. #125
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    Re: The Timing of Events

    Quote Originally Posted by 6paths View Post
    How do you explain the recurrence of the lightnings, thunders, and voices (the throne of God Rev 4:5) that are repeatedly shown with an earthquake.
    Rev 6:14-17, 8:5,11:19, 16:18-21.
    How do you explain the hail/winepress that is repeated?
    Rev 11:19, 14:18-20, 16:19-21, 19:15.
    Hello brother, sorry, been bust a few days, painting, buying carpet eyc. etc.

    All three of the Earthquakes are shown to be different. Three Judgment classifications so to speak, 1. the Seals...Earthquake. 2.) the Trumpets Earthquake...3.) then lastly the Vials...Earthquake.

    Rev. 11, is the Two-witnesses chapter, it runs from 75 days before the first Seal is opened to the Two-witnesses die, AND to the Second Coming because it says Jesus TAKES OVER. Rev. 14 covers the FULL 7 YEARS....From the Rapture in verse 14 to the Second Coming. Rev. 16 is the Second Coming also, see Vial number 7. Revelation 19 covers the full 7 Years....its the Church in Heaven being Married to the Lamb, then RETURNING to the Marriage Supper {Armageddon}.

    All four of those ENDS with the same event, the Second Coming.

  6. #126
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    Re: The Timing of Events

    Quote Originally Posted by 6paths View Post
    Just for reference, all of the seals were opened on one day. John was in the spirit on the Lord's day and wrote down everything he saw from that 1 day vision.
    This does not mean I believe everything that he saw will happen in 1 day.
    The Lord's Day would be the Day of the Lord God's Wrath....The Day of the Lord....not Sunday brother. He was transported to the Day of the Lord or God's day of vengeance which lasts for 3.5 years PLUS Maybe another 1000 years of his reign.

    I never said that Jesus lost his Deity. However, he did give up some power when became a man. Consider these verses Heb 5:8-9
    8 "Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered;
    9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;"

    Jesus learned... How could he learn if he was all knowing?
    Being made perfect...If Jesus had not learned obedience to his Father, he would not have been perfect, and we would not have salvation.

    Jesus was both God and man, but he humbled himself. He put himself under the will of the Father and against his own will, in order that we would have salvation.
    His humility is the reason he is now glorified as shown in my previous statements.
    Jesus was always God...he clearly stated he could have called a legion of Angels to come fight for him at any time he so wished, if he had wanted to. Jesus was God, he had no SIN LESH. He was tempted but never gave in because he was God. God can't sin.

    Are 2 brides found in the Revelation?
    Of course, the Church is in Heaven Marrying the Lamb....Israel are being protected in the Petra/Bozrah area.

    When I match up chapters 6,7,8,9,15&16, I find that chapter 6 ends with the wrath of God. I find that 8.5 is the wrath of God that ends the chapter 7 story. I find that the story of the trumpets does not end until the end of chapter 11, when once again the wrath of God ends this longer story. Chapters 10 and most of 11 are 2 stories of the 3.5 years of great tribulation that immediately precede God's wrath. I find the story of the trumpets repeated in Rev 12:7-14:20, ending with the wrath of God. Chapters 15 and 16 are the full description of the wrath of God.
    You are missing the forest for the trees brother. Uts a continuous run n those chapters, minus 15 which in reality is in Heaven...but then again so is the last half of chapter 7.

    God's Wrath STARTS with the First Seal...which allows the Anti-Christ to go forth, but the first 4 Seals are about the AC and the 5th Seal about his HANDIWORK or Murders to come...the th Seal is opened at the same time as the first 5.........within miliseconds. So God's Wrath begins with the First Seal being opened, the th Seal is the announcement.

    The Seals Trumpets and Vials covers the 42 Months the AC is in power. Thus Rev. 12, 13, and 18 cover the full 42 Months, whereas Rev. 17 doesn't the Harlot Religions are destroyed by the AC/Beast. The Wrath of God lasts 42 months. It covers the fulltime of all the Seals, Trumpets and Vials.

  7. #127
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    Re: The Timing of Events

    Quote Originally Posted by ewq1938 View Post
    Yet outside of the literal language of a parable we do not see the dead in Christ resurrecting on Earth out of their graves and then rapturing into heaven to follow Christ down in the second coming. We only have them in heaven, where Paul says the new body is, and them following Christ...nothing about their old bodies coming back to life on earth.



    It's not an "example" if the dead in Christ do not follow this same procedure. This clearly is a one time event to show the deceived people of the world that the two prophets were telling the truth and God is with them not the people of the world following the AC.



    The first harvest is of the living not the dead so this doesn't fit correctly.




    Christ is the only one to resurrect into immortality as far as we know. We can't say that for sure about the two prophets. Other resurrections like Lazarus would have been back to mortality.
    We know the dead in Christ resurrect to immortality but everything we know of that is a resurrection into a new body not an old body that is transformed into immortal so this would be the first to skip the old body yet still be a resurrection which means to "stand up". A new body for a bodiless spirit would qualify as a resurrection.

    I think these verses say it all:

    2Co 5:1 For we know that if our earthly house of this tabernacle were dissolved, we have a building of God, an house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens.
    2Co 5:2 For in this we groan, earnestly desiring to be clothed upon with our house which is from heaven:

    1Pe 1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,
    1Pe 1:4 To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you,

    Again, something awaits us in heaven. Is it not the new glorified body given in a heavenly resurrection?
    Eternal life comes from the Father and the Son who are in heaven. Our spirit never dies, but goes to be with God in heaven. This is not the new glorified body.
    As you have stated, the resurrection occurs all at once, at the last day.
    However, Rev 6:9-11 shows some in heaven who are clothed before others have died on earth.
    How can this be?

    Heb 12:23 shows things which are already in heaven.
    "23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,"
    The names of those in the church are written in the Lamb's book of life.
    God is in heaven.
    The spirits of just men made perfect are those who have died with faith in Christ, who can not have their names blotted out of heaven because they are dead.

    Our house is from heaven, it is in heaven, our inheritance is heaven which is not of this creation; it is the heavenly tabernacle of God, the Holiest of All, which we enter upon our death.
    Heb 9:8 "The Holy Ghost this signifying, that the way into the holiest of all was not yet made manifest, while as the first tabernacle was yet standing:"

    When God split the veil of the first tabernacle, he made a way into our inheritance. Heb 10:28-29
    "19 Having therefore, brethren, boldness to enter into the holiest by the blood of Jesus,
    20 By a new and living way, which he hath consecrated for us, through the veil, that is to say, his flesh;"

    Those who died prior to Jesus death did not enter into heaven.
    John 3:13 "And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven."

    When Jesus rose, he took the spirits of those who belong to him from "Abraham's bosom" or "paradise" into heaven with him. This is what is meant by taking captivity captive.
    Eph 4:8 "Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men."

    At death, we never die because our spirit is raised immediately into heaven.
    At the last day, our bodies will arise out of our graves and will be joined with our spirits.

  8. #128
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    Re: The Timing of Events

    Quote Originally Posted by ewq1938 View Post
    The MK is a OWG (one world government) but not the type of "OWG" that typically is used to denote Satan's global rule in the GT. The MK's OWG is a Christian theocracy with Christ as the King and ruler of the entire world and every person firmly under his control aided by his immortal saints and the infamous rod of iron.
    Hey, we agree on something!

    What did you mean by "The first harvest is of the living not the dead so this doesn't fit correctly."

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    Re: The Timing of Events

    Quote Originally Posted by Keraz View Post
    As your view of all the end time events is different from mine. I will post the sequence I have prepared, with scriptural support:
    End times sequence:
    Soon to happen: The great and terrible Day of the Lord’s vengeance and wrath, a CME sunstrike. Isaiah 30:26-28 & 30, Malachi 4:1 & 3 It will be the Sixth seal event of cosmic and worldwide effects and the Middle East will be virtually depopulated, cleared and cleansed, Ezekiel 30:1-5, Zephaniah 1:14-18 It will be the fulfilment of Psalms 83, Isaiah 2:12-21, 2 Peter 3:7 and Revelation 6:12-17 A small Messianic Jewish remnant will survive in Jerusalem. Isaiah 6:11-13 Many will die around the world: Isaiah 51:6, Jeremiah 9:22, but most will survive and eventually re-establish the infrastructure.

    The Seventh seal is ‘about’ a 20 year time gap on earth, until the Return of Jesus. [A half hour is a 48th of a day. 20 years is a 48th of 1000 years]

    In a short while: Isaiah 29:17, all the holy Land will be regenerated and the Lord’s people, Christian Israelites, be they true descendants of Jacob or grafted in, all born again believers; will gather in the new country of Beulah. Isaiah 62:1-5, Isaiah 35:1-10 They will live in peace and prosperity and 144,000 missionaries are selected from them, to go out to all peoples and proclaim the coming Kingdom of Jesus. Revelation 7 & 14, Isaiah 66:19

    The rest of the nations will form a One World Government, led by ten Presidents. Daniel 7:24, Revelation 17:12 Before long, three will be taken over and the other seven will confer their power onto another strong leader. Daniel 11:21, Revelation 13:1-8

    After a few years: a Northern confederation, led by a person referred to as Gog, will be motivated to attack Beulah – an unprotected nation, of great wealth. Gog and his horde will be totally wiped out and it will take seven years to bury them and clean the land. Ezekiel 38 & 39, Joel 2:20

    Sometime later, the strong leader of the World Government, will make a seven year treaty with Beulah. This marks the commencement of the seventieth ‘week’ [seven years] of Daniel. There is a 3˝ year period of calm and peace in the world. Daniel 9:27

    After that: the world dictator comes to Jerusalem in force and declares himself to be god in the new Temple. This starts the Great Tribulation, the Trumpet and Bowl judgements. The ‘Woman’- Christian Israelites who refused to violate the Covenant, Daniel 11:32, are taken to a place of safety for 1260 days. Zechariah 14:2, Revelation 12:14

    Then comes the Glorious Return of Jesus: The battle of Armageddon, Jesus destroys the army of the Anti-Christ by the Sword of His Word and chains up Satan.
    The regathering of Christian Israel, all those who have kept faithful. Matthew 24:30-31
    The 1000 year Millennium reign of King Jesus and His resurrected saints.

    The final attack against the holy Land and the armies are instantly cremated. Satan is cast into the lake of fire. Revelation 16:13-16, Revelation 19:17-21
    The Great White Throne judgement, and a New Heaven and a New Earth. Daniel 7:9-10, Revelation chapters 20:11-15 & 21:1-7
    Could show me verses anywhere in your soon to happen category that are followed by a one world government that is not the MK
    Isaiah chapters 30-35 repeat the day of the Lord's vengeance followed by the MK.
    Nothing after Malachi after 4:1 & 3 to support your theory
    Ezekiel 30:1-5 seems to be speaking about the time of King Nebuchadnezzar.
    I already commented that there is nothing after Zephaniah 1:14-18 to support your order of events.
    Isaiah 2 seems to conclude in Isaiah 4 with the MK.

    I can't find one example of a OWG occurring after the passages you quoted in the Soon to happen portion except for a chronological interpretation of the Revelation which denies the repetitions I have already pointed out.
    I have found examples of the MK occurring after your Soon to happen portion, which support my position.

    Repeating what you believe does not add support to your theory.

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    Re: The Timing of Events

    Quote Originally Posted by Revelation Man View Post
    Hello brother, sorry, been bust a few days, painting, buying carpet eyc. etc.
    Take your time. I am not exactly speedy here myself. The ideas will keep.

    Quote Originally Posted by Revelation Man View Post
    All three of the Earthquakes are shown to be different. Three Judgment classifications so to speak, 1. the Seals...Earthquake. 2.) the Trumpets Earthquake...3.) then lastly the Vials...Earthquake.
    There were 4 earthquakes in my example. Is your evidence that the earthquakes are different that they come at the end of different sequences?
    What do you say about them all coming when the throne of God is symbolized or directly stated? Coincidence?
    The seals earthquake and the vials earthquake both remove the mountains and islands. Are the mountains and islands rebuilt between the time of the seal and the vials? How could these earthquakes be different?

    Quote Originally Posted by Revelation Man View Post
    Rev. 11, is the Two-witnesses chapter, it runs from 75 days before the first Seal is opened to the Two-witnesses die, AND to the Second Coming because it says Jesus TAKES OVER. Rev. 14 covers the FULL 7 YEARS....From the Rapture in verse 14 to the Second Coming. Rev. 16 is the Second Coming also, see Vial number 7. Revelation 19 covers the full 7 Years....its the Church in Heaven being Married to the Lamb, then RETURNING to the Marriage Supper {Armageddon}.
    How do you explain that death is 1/3 of the population from the 6th trumpet, the time of the 2 witnesses; but is only 1/4 from the 4 horses? Rev 9:15, Rev 6:8.

    Quote Originally Posted by Revelation Man View Post
    All four of those ENDS with the same event, the Second Coming.
    We agree that all four of these ends with the same event.
    Aren't both God the Father and God the Son visible from earth in Rev 6:16? "And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:"
    Why don't you consider this to be the second coming?

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    Re: The Timing of Events

    Quote Originally Posted by 6paths View Post
    Hey, we agree on something!

    What did you mean by "The first harvest is of the living not the dead so this doesn't fit correctly."
    I can't simplify the sentence any further...can you ask more specifically?
    James 4:10 Humble yourselves in the sight of the Lord, and he shall lift you up.

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    Re: The Timing of Events

    Quote Originally Posted by 6paths View Post
    Could show me verses anywhere in your soon to happen category that are followed by a one world government that is not the MK
    Isaiah chapters 30-35 repeat the day of the Lord's vengeance followed by the MK.
    Nothing after Malachi after 4:1 & 3 to support your theory
    Ezekiel 30:1-5 seems to be speaking about the time of King Nebuchadnezzar.
    I already commented that there is nothing after Zephaniah 1:14-18 to support your order of events.
    Isaiah 2 seems to conclude in Isaiah 4 with the MK.

    I can't find one example of a OWG occurring after the passages you quoted in the Soon to happen portion except for a chronological interpretation of the Revelation which denies the repetitions I have already pointed out.
    I have found examples of the MK occurring after your Soon to happen portion, which support my position.

    Repeating what you believe does not add support to your theory.
    Many prophesies tell about a time when the Lord's people will live in all of the holy Land and how they will know the Lord is helping them; not by His visible presence, but by His deeds for them. Ezekiel says this over 25 times....you will know that I am the Lord, who helps you.
    Proof of this is how the Christian people will choose for themselves a leader. Hosea 1:11, Jeremiah 30:21
    Then the detailed instructions given to them in Ezekiel 40 to 48, show plainly that Jesus has not Returned as yet.

  13. #133
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    Re: The Timing of Events

    Quote Originally Posted by Revelation Man View Post
    The Lord's Day would be the Day of the Lord God's Wrath....The Day of the Lord....not Sunday brother. He was transported to the Day of the Lord or God's day of vengeance which lasts for 3.5 years PLUS Maybe another 1000 years of his reign.
    Rev 1:10-11."10 I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet,
    11 Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea."

    What I hear you saying is that John is told to write a book to 7 churches about things which don't concern them!
    Didn't all of the other prophets write things so that the people would be warned about what was going to happen to them?
    To me, it's a lot easier to believe that John had quite the day of visions and he was given the meaning of some of them.

    Quote Originally Posted by Revelation Man View Post
    Jesus was always God...he clearly stated he could have called a legion of Angels to come fight for him at any time he so wished, if he had wanted to. Jesus was God, he had no SIN LESH. He was tempted but never gave in because he was God. God can't sin.
    Jesus is and was always God; however, God died! He could not have done that unless he had emptied himself of something.
    Please explain Heb 2:9 "But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man."

    Quote Originally Posted by Revelation Man View Post
    Of course, the Church is in Heaven Marrying the Lamb....Israel are being protected in the Petra/Bozrah area.
    Where is the church shown marrying the Lamb before/while Israel is being protected in the Petra/Bozrah area?


    Quote Originally Posted by Revelation Man View Post
    You are missing the forest for the trees brother. Uts a continuous run n those chapters, minus 15 which in reality is in Heaven...but then again so is the last half of chapter 7.
    God's Wrath STARTS with the First Seal...which allows the Anti-Christ to go forth, but the first 4 Seals are about the AC and the 5th Seal about his HANDIWORK or Murders to come...the th Seal is opened at the same time as the first 5.........within miliseconds. So God's Wrath begins with the First Seal being opened, the th Seal is the announcement.

    The Seals Trumpets and Vials covers the 42 Months the AC is in power. Thus Rev. 12, 13, and 18 cover the full 42 Months, whereas Rev. 17 doesn't the Harlot Religions are destroyed by the AC/Beast. The Wrath of God lasts 42 months. It covers the fulltime of all the Seals, Trumpets and Vials.[/QUOTE]

    Please show me where the wrath of God lasts 42 months. I only see the wrath of God occurring as the last 7 plagues. Rev 15:1
    "And I saw another sign in heaven, great and marvellous, seven angels having the seven last plagues; for in them is filled up the wrath of God."
    In these 7 plagues is the entire wrath of God.
    Immediately after the great tribulation come the signs of the wrath of God.
    Great tribulation and God's wrath are separate, sequential periods of time.

    Quote Originally Posted by Revelation Man View Post
    The Lord's Day would be the Day of the Lord God's Wrath....The Day of the Lord....not Sunday brother. He was transported to the Day of the Lord or God's day of vengeance which lasts for 3.5 years PLUS Maybe another 1000 years of his reign.
    Rev 1:10-11."10 I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet,
    11 Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea."

    What I hear you saying is that John is told to write a book to 7 churches about things which don't concern them!
    Didn't all of the other prophets write things so that the people would be warned about what was going to happen to them?
    To me, it's a lot easier to believe that John had quite the day of visions and he was given the meaning of some of them.

    Quote Originally Posted by Revelation Man View Post
    Jesus was always God...he clearly stated he could have called a legion of Angels to come fight for him at any time he so wished, if he had wanted to. Jesus was God, he had no SIN LESH. He was tempted but never gave in because he was God. God can't sin.
    Jesus is and was always God; however, God died! He could not have done that unless he had emptied himself of something.
    Please explain Heb 2:9 "But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man."

    Quote Originally Posted by Revelation Man View Post
    Of course, the Church is in Heaven Marrying the Lamb....Israel are being protected in the Petra/Bozrah area.
    Where is the church shown marrying the Lamb before/while Israel is being protected in the Petra/Bozrah area?


    Quote Originally Posted by Revelation Man View Post
    You are missing the forest for the trees brother. Uts a continuous run n those chapters, minus 15 which in reality is in Heaven...but then again so is the last half of chapter 7.
    God's Wrath STARTS with the First Seal...which allows the Anti-Christ to go forth, but the first 4 Seals are about the AC and the 5th Seal about his HANDIWORK or Murders to come...the th Seal is opened at the same time as the first 5.........within miliseconds. So God's Wrath begins with the First Seal being opened, the th Seal is the announcement.

    The Seals Trumpets and Vials covers the 42 Months the AC is in power. Thus Rev. 12, 13, and 18 cover the full 42 Months, whereas Rev. 17 doesn't the Harlot Religions are destroyed by the AC/Beast. The Wrath of God lasts 42 months. It covers the fulltime of all the Seals, Trumpets and Vials.[/QUOTE]

    Please show me where the wrath of God lasts 42 months. I only see the wrath of God occurring as the last 7 plagues. Rev 15:1
    "And I saw another sign in heaven, great and marvellous, seven angels having the seven last plagues; for in them is filled up the wrath of God."
    In these 7 plagues is the entire wrath of God.
    Immediately after the great tribulation come the signs of the wrath of God.
    Great tribulation and God's wrath are separate, sequential periods of time.

  14. #134
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    Re: The Timing of Events

    Quote Originally Posted by 6paths View Post
    Take your time. I am not exactly speedy here myself. The ideas will keep.
    I finally got my brand new computer to work properly after a year.....it would just freeze on everything, right out of the box, I installed a new bios {scary} and everything else, took like 6 hours, so no more keypads with not letters showing, LOL. Look like I couldn't spell, but half my letters were blank/or black.

    There were 4 earthquakes in my example. Is your evidence that the earthquakes are different that they come at the end of different sequences?
    What do you say about them all coming when the throne of God is symbolized or directly stated? Coincidence?
    The seals earthquake and the vials earthquake both remove the mountains and islands. Are the mountains and islands rebuilt between the time of the seal and the vials? How could these earthquakes be different?
    There is only three earthquakes, the Rev. 11 earthquake and the Rev. 16 earthquake are the SAME ONE. As per the "Mountains and Islands its prose, its meant to show what happens during earthquakes, "THINGS MOVE" There can be gigantic earthquake in California that in no wise effects Europe, likewise Japan can have a quake that doesn't effect America, etc. etc. etc. These Plagues hit the whole world. As per to the earthquakes, we can see them described.

    Rev. 6:12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood; 13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind. 14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.

    {{{ This earthquake announces Gods Wrath to Mankind, it happens on day 1261, and thus the Beast has 1260 days to rule. All 6 Seals are basically opened at the same time, the 7th Seal, which is the 7 Trumpets is held up until the Jews reach Petra. I see Satan being cast out of Heaven as THE STARS here.}}}

    Rev. 8:5 And the angel took the censer, and filled it with fire of the altar, and cast it into the earth: and there were voices, and thunderings, and lightnings, and an earthquake. 6 And the seven angels which had the seven trumpets prepared themselves to sound.

    {{{ Then in chapter 8 we have another Earthquake at the very moment that the 7th Trumpets are being readied. These coming Plagues will be in the 1/3's the Sun and moon go dark by 1/3's. }}}

    Rev. 11:19 And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail.

    {{{ The above is the Rev. 16 vial number 7 Earthquake. That's why Jesus TAKES OVER here !! Just like in Rev. 16:19. }}}

    Actually verse 19 or 18-19...………. Rev. 16:18 And there were voices, and thunders, and lightnings; and there was a great earthquake, such as was not since men were upon the earth, so mighty an earthquake, and so great. 9 And the great city was divided into three parts, and the cities of the nations fell: and great Babylon came in remembrance before God, to give unto her the cup of the wine of the fierceness of his wrath.

    {{{ Jesus destroys the Beast and TAKES OVER HERE. }}}

    How do you explain that death is 1/3 of the population from the 6th trumpet, the time of the 2 witnesses; but is only 1/4 from the 4 horses? Rev 9:15, Rev 6:8.
    Different Events, the Anti-Christ will kill a 1/3 of all Mankind, the Judging Angelic Army of God will take out 1/4 of all mankind left on earth.

    We agree that all four of these ends with the same event.
    Aren't both God the Father and God the Son visible from earth in Rev 6:16? "And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:"
    Why don't you consider this to be the second coming?
    I was speaking about chapters 12, 13, 17 and 18. I will look over the other post later, God Bless.

    Quote Originally Posted by 6paths View Post
    Take your time. I am not exactly speedy here myself. The ideas will keep.
    I finally got my brand new computer to work properly after a year.....it would just freeze on everything, right out of the box, I installed a new bios {scary} and everything else, took like 6 hours, so no more keypads with not letters showing, LOL. Look like I couldn't spell, but half my letters were blank/or black.

    There were 4 earthquakes in my example. Is your evidence that the earthquakes are different that they come at the end of different sequences?
    What do you say about them all coming when the throne of God is symbolized or directly stated? Coincidence?
    The seals earthquake and the vials earthquake both remove the mountains and islands. Are the mountains and islands rebuilt between the time of the seal and the vials? How could these earthquakes be different?
    There is only three earthquakes, the Rev. 11 earthquake and the Rev. 16 earthquake are the SAME ONE. As per the "Mountains and Islands its prose, its meant to show what happens during earthquakes, "THINGS MOVE" There can be gigantic earthquake in California that in no wise effects Europe, likewise Japan can have a quake that doesn't effect America, etc. etc. etc. These Plagues hit the whole world. As per to the earthquakes, we can see them described.

    Rev. 6:12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood; 13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind. 14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.

    {{{ This earthquake announces Gods Wrath to Mankind, it happens on day 1261, and thus the Beast has 1260 days to rule. All 6 Seals are basically opened at the same time, the 7th Seal, which is the 7 Trumpets is held up until the Jews reach Petra. I see Satan being cast out of Heaven as THE STARS here.}}}

    Rev. 8:5 And the angel took the censer, and filled it with fire of the altar, and cast it into the earth: and there were voices, and thunderings, and lightnings, and an earthquake. 6 And the seven angels which had the seven trumpets prepared themselves to sound.

    {{{ Then in chapter 8 we have another Earthquake at the very moment that the 7th Trumpets are being readied. These coming Plagues will be in the 1/3's the Sun and moon go dark by 1/3's. }}}

    Rev. 11:19 And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail.

    {{{ The above is the Rev. 16 vial number 7 Earthquake. That's why Jesus TAKES OVER here !! Just like in Rev. 16:19. }}}

    Actually verse 19 or 18-19...………. Rev. 16:18 And there were voices, and thunders, and lightnings; and there was a great earthquake, such as was not since men were upon the earth, so mighty an earthquake, and so great. 9 And the great city was divided into three parts, and the cities of the nations fell: and great Babylon came in remembrance before God, to give unto her the cup of the wine of the fierceness of his wrath.

    {{{ Jesus destroys the Beast and TAKES OVER HERE. }}}

    How do you explain that death is 1/3 of the population from the 6th trumpet, the time of the 2 witnesses; but is only 1/4 from the 4 horses? Rev 9:15, Rev 6:8.
    Different Events, the Anti-Christ will kill a 1/3 of all Mankind, the Judging Angelic Army of God will take out 1/4 of all mankind left on earth.

    We agree that all four of these ends with the same event.
    Aren't both God the Father and God the Son visible from earth in Rev 6:16? "And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:"
    Why don't you consider this to be the second coming?
    I was speaking about chapters 12, 13, 17 and 18. I will look over the other post later, God Bless.

  15. #135
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    Re: The Timing of Events

    Quote Originally Posted by ewq1938 View Post
    I can't simplify the sentence any further...can you ask more specifically?
    1 Thes 4:13-17
    "13 But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.
    14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
    15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
    16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
    17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord."

    Verse 15 says specifically that those who are alive will not prevent or precede those who are dead.
    Verse 16 repeats that the dead will first be raised before anything happens to the living.

    Doesn't this mean that something happens to the dead before something happens to the living?
    To me, the dead come out of the ground like a crop coming up from seeds, then the living crop is changed into a like form as that of the dead, and then they are harvested or cut off from the earth at one time.

    Where do you find the living harvested before the dead?

    Quote Originally Posted by ewq1938 View Post
    I can't simplify the sentence any further...can you ask more specifically?
    1 Thes 4:13-17
    "13 But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.
    14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
    15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
    16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
    17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord."

    Verse 15 says specifically that those who are alive will not prevent or precede those who are dead.
    Verse 16 repeats that the dead will first be raised before anything happens to the living.

    Doesn't this mean that something happens to the dead before something happens to the living?
    To me, the dead come out of the ground like a crop coming up from seeds, then the living crop is changed into a like form as that of the dead, and then they are harvested or cut off from the earth at one time.

    Where do you find the living harvested before the dead?

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