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Thread: No mortals survive the second coming able to populate a millennium

  1. #31
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    Re: No mortals survive the second coming able to populate a millennium

    Quote Originally Posted by ross3421 View Post

    36 Then the heathen that are left round about you shall know that I the Lord build the ruined places, and plant that that was desolate: I the Lord have spoken it, and I will do it.

    The heathen left are not speaking of living unbelievers which somehow escaped death but rather the heathen which have been cast into the LOF which are still able to see the goings on in eternity
    Your not exegeting your interpretation from this passage. This is pure eisegesis. Where in Ezekiel 36 does it state that the “nations that REMAIN around you (Jerusalem)” are actually those in the lake of fire? Please read through Ezekiel 36 and show me any passage that clearly states that these nations are in the LOF at that time…
    The passage does not even hint at that interpretation. The exegetical interpretation of those “remaining around you” would indicate that there are nations still surrounding Israel after the 2nd coming. My interpretation takes the words at face value here and takes not interpretive gymnastics to land it.

  2. #32
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    Re: No mortals survive the second coming able to populate a millennium

    Quote Originally Posted by ross3421 View Post

    Again these nations are left, ie remain after the resurrection.
    Your going to have to give a little more info than that if you expect me to pull off the premillennial view of Zechariah 14...

    You seem to be indicating that the "survivors" of the nations in Zechariah 14 are resurrected saints... However, the passage is clear that there are some people in this group that will remain in disobedience and will be "struck with plagues". For example

    Zec 14:17-18* And it shall be that whichever of the families of the earth do not come up to Jerusalem to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, on them there will be no rain. *(18)* If the family of Egypt will not come up and enter in, they shall have no rain; they shall receive the plague with which the LORD strikes the nations who do not come up to keep the Feast of Tabernacles.

    So, if only resurrected saints are on the NHNE in your opinion, then who are the peoples who are receiving "the plagues" in Egypt for not coming to the Feast of Tabernacles?

    If there are no mortals in your opinion, then do you believe that resurrected/glorified/perfected saints can fall away after their glorification?

  3. #33
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    Re: No mortals survive the second coming able to populate a millennium

    The parable of the harvest of wheat and tares proves no mortals survive to enter a 1000 year reign

    30 Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn.
    38 The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one;
    39 The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels.
    40 As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world.

    So where can there possibly be a gap between resurrections and or a 1000 period whereby mortals survive in the above? The tares are burned in the fire at the end of this world.

  4. #34
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    Re: No mortals survive the second coming able to populate a millennium

    Quote Originally Posted by ross3421 View Post
    The parable of the harvest of wheat and tares proves no mortals survive to enter a 1000 year reign

    30 Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn.
    38 The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one;
    39 The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels.
    40 As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world.

    So where can there possibly be a gap between resurrections and or a 1000 period whereby mortals survive in the above? The tares are burned in the fire at the end of this world.
    This is at the time of the GWTJ not the thousand years and even this shows a gap because the tares are gathered FIRST, and after that is done the wheat is gathered to the barn which is a separation of time. Also, the fact that the tares grow alongside the wheat proves that before this burning happens that the saved and unsaved lived together which is what Premil teaches. In using this passage you have disproven everything you wanted to prove.
    James 4:10 Humble yourselves in the sight of the Lord, and he shall lift you up.

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    Re: No mortals survive the second coming able to populate a millennium

    Quote Originally Posted by ewq1938 View Post
    This is at the time of the GWTJ not the thousand years and even this shows a gap because the tares are gathered FIRST, and after that is done the wheat is gathered to the barn which is a separation of time. Also, the fact that the tares grow alongside the wheat proves that before this burning happens that the saved and unsaved lived together which is what Premil teaches. In using this passage you have disproven everything you wanted to prove.
    If it is at the time of the GWTJ, that would be Amil, not Premil.

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    Re: No mortals survive the second coming able to populate a millennium

    Quote Originally Posted by divaD View Post
    If it is at the time of the GWTJ, that would be Amil, not Premil.
    No, it's still Premil. The return of Christ happens long before the tares and wheat events. The tares being gathered and burned is the GWTJ and the LOF, the wheat going into the barn is the saved entering into the NHNE. That the tares lived among the wheat in the field/world is the thousand years. After it, Satan is released and the tares become fully ripened tares that are poisoned by Satan's deceiving when he goes to them. All resurrections have also already taken pace by the time the tares are meant to be burned up...again just as it is at the GWTJ.
    James 4:10 Humble yourselves in the sight of the Lord, and he shall lift you up.

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    Re: No mortals survive the second coming able to populate a millennium

    Quote Originally Posted by ewq1938 View Post
    because the tares are gathered FIRST, and after that is done the wheat is gathered to the barn which is a separation of time. Also, the fact that the tares grow alongside the wheat proves that before this burning happens that the saved and unsaved lived together which is what Premil teaches. In using this passage you have disproven everything you wanted to prove.
    Have you ever harvested wheat? You first separate chaff (tares) from the wheat. You gather the chaff to be burned later. Thus just because the chaff (tares) are gathered first does not mean they are resurrected/destroyed before the wheat.

    Study harvesting crops.

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    Re: No mortals survive the second coming able to populate a millennium

    Quote Originally Posted by ross3421 View Post
    Have you ever harvested wheat? You first separate chaff (tares) from the wheat. You gather the chaff to be burned later.
    Tares are not "chaff". Chaff if the unedible part of wheat that must be removed so the edible part is left. There is no such "burned later" either:

    Mat 13:39* The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels.*
    Mat 13:40* As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world.*

    There is no waiting period between the tares being gathered and the burning.

    "Study harvesting crops. "

    You don't even know what you are talking about since you confused chaff and tares. You are the one who needs to study this not me.

    Burning the chaff is the unsaved being cast into the LOF. That is at the GWTJ not the second coming.
    James 4:10 Humble yourselves in the sight of the Lord, and he shall lift you up.

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    Re: No mortals survive the second coming able to populate a millennium

    Quote Originally Posted by ross3421 View Post
    Have you ever harvested wheat? You first separate chaff (tares) from the wheat. You gather the chaff to be burned later. Thus just because the chaff (tares) are gathered first does not mean they are resurrected/destroyed before the wheat.

    Study harvesting crops.
    I tend to agree with some of this here. Probably because you seem to be arguing for Premil, though I'm sure that's not your intention. If the tares are bound at the 2nd coming, to be burned later, that could simply indicate they shall be gathered together, as prisoners are gathered in the pit, and shall be shut up in the prison, and after many days shall they be visited(Isaiah 24:22).

    gathered in the pit, and shall be shut up in the prison...meaning the binding of them in bundles.

    and after many days shall they be visited...meaning after the thousand years during the GWTJ, where they then get cast into the LOF, the burning of them.

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    Re: No mortals survive the second coming able to populate a millennium

    Quote Originally Posted by divaD View Post
    If the tares are bound at the 2nd coming, to be burned later, that could simply indicate they shall be gathered together, as prisoners are gathered in the pit, and shall be shut up in the prison, and after many days shall they be visited(Isaiah 24:22).

    and after many days shall they be visited...meaning after the thousand years during the GWTJ, where they then get cast into the LOF, the burning of them.
    As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world.

    Does it really look like the tares are burned up some 1000 years later? Of course not.

  11. #41
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    Re: No mortals survive the second coming able to populate a millennium

    Quote Originally Posted by ewq1938 View Post
    Burning the chaff is the unsaved being cast into the LOF. That is at the GWTJ not the second coming.
    12 Whose fan is in his hand, and he will throughly purge his floor, and gather his wheat into the garner; but he will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire.

    7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
    8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
    9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

    Tares and chaff represent the ungodly both are burned in the fire which happens upon the second coming at the GWT. No 1000 years separate.

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    Re: No mortals survive the second coming able to populate a millennium

    Quote Originally Posted by ross3421 View Post
    As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world.

    Does it really look like the tares are burned up some 1000 years later? Of course not.
    They aren't burned before the thousand years according to Rev 20. It shows they are burned after the thousand years because they are the unsaved:

    Rev 20:1* And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.*
    Rev 20:2* And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,*
    Rev 20:3* And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.*
    Rev 20:4* And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.*
    Rev 20:5* But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.*
    Rev 20:6* Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.*

    The unsaved are not cast into the LOF yet.


    Rev 20:7* And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,*
    Rev 20:8* And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.*
    Rev 20:9* And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.*
    Rev 20:10* And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.*
    Rev 20:11* And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.*
    Rev 20:12* And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.*
    Rev 20:13* And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.*
    Rev 20:14* And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.*
    Rev 20:15* And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.*

    Only after the thousand years are they cast into the fire. Super simple stuff here. Chronology is milk.
    James 4:10 Humble yourselves in the sight of the Lord, and he shall lift you up.

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    Re: No mortals survive the second coming able to populate a millennium

    Quote Originally Posted by ross3421 View Post
    12 Whose fan is in his hand, and he will throughly purge his floor, and gather his wheat into the garner; but he will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire.

    7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
    8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
    9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

    Tares and chaff represent the ungodly both are burned in the fire which happens upon the second coming at the GWT. No 1000 years separate.
    That passage show no fire being used against anyone. Christ returns in flaming fire which is lightning and it speaks of the speed of his return. Never is Christ written to use fire against anyone at the second coming. Christ only uses the sword of his mouth and the slain are cut up not burned. See Rev 19 which is the eyewitness account of the second coming and the slayings that happen.
    James 4:10 Humble yourselves in the sight of the Lord, and he shall lift you up.

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    Re: No mortals survive the second coming able to populate a millennium

    Quote Originally Posted by ewq1938 View Post
    That passage show no fire being used against anyone. Christ returns in flaming fire which is lightning and it speaks of the speed of his return. Never is Christ written to use fire against anyone at the second coming. Christ only uses the sword of his mouth and the slain are cut up not burned. See Rev 19 which is the eyewitness account of the second coming and the slayings that happen.
    11 And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.
    12 His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself.

    Nahum 1
    5 The mountains quake at him, and the hills melt, and the earth is burned at his presence, yea, the world, and all that dwell therein.
    6 Who can stand before his indignation? and who can abide in the fierceness of his anger? his fury is poured out like fire, and the rocks are thrown down by him.

    There are too many other passages to list showing the opposite.

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    Re: No mortals survive the second coming able to populate a millennium

    Quote Originally Posted by ross3421 View Post
    11 And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.
    12 His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself.
    He's not shooting fire from his eyes to kill anyone and this isn't the second coming where he is slaying people. He uses a sword not fire. The lake of fire is also not the second coming. You have everything mixed up.
    James 4:10 Humble yourselves in the sight of the Lord, and he shall lift you up.

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